Andre Smith released

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

C'mon, we have seen some bad OL for awhile - so far, I have not once heard people calling for Cole's head on a gameday thread. The guy is incredibly solid - not a lot of push, but just a smart, solid player for a rookie. If Toner, Boehm, Watford, or any of those others drafted played as solid as Cole, we would at least of one of the G positions covered as well in the future.

I’m not certain of that. Before smith started getting Rosen killed it was our interior line getting smushed. And you don’t get any more interior than center. I don’t think we have a true inkling if Cole is average or mediocre. What we do know is that he likely isn’t a stud.

 

[RON_IN_OC]

So you know we are assured of a losing season already this year, right? So that’s two losing seasons. In a row. The last two years. 13 wins - 8 wins - 7 wins - 2 wins (likely). See a trend?

Also, his signings of Bradford and smith at STARTERS and both already CUT, without being injured. Yeah, some stellar work.

Keim sucks now.

Actually, last year wasn't a losing season...8-8...I think the year before was 7-9.

So 13 wins, followed by 7 wins, followed by 8 wins, followed by 2ish wins.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

 

[Arz101]

So you know we are assured of a losing season already this year, right? So that’s two losing seasons. In a row. The last two years. 13 wins - 8 wins - 7 wins - 2 wins (likely). See a trend?

Also, his signings of Bradford and smith at STARTERS and both already CUT, without being injured. Yeah, some stellar work.

Keim sucks now.

Agreed that Keim's stock is very very low. But I don't think Keim is at Enron level. It will be the biggest surprise of the 2018 cardinals season if Keim is let go.

 

[AZCrazy]

It's easy to overlook flaws when you're winning and just as easy to overlook virtues when you're not.

Keim does some things well. His faults are in overdrafting 'small school team leader' types, and in early round misfires. Every team has them, but ours seem to play their way out of jobs rather than into pro bowls.

As far as Markus Golden, I still think he's got the potential to be a big part of a winning defense. Injuries are always a concern and cant be predicted, but all in all I'd rather have him on the team than not.

 

[Chopper0080]

I have thought a lot about this and the question whether to retain Keim really boils down to this for me.

1-Do I think Keim can hire a top 16 NFL HC who can get the most out of Josh Rosen?

2-Do I think Keim can put together a top 16 NFL offensive line which can protect Josh Rosen?

The answer to the first question is yes. He has done it once and I believe that means he can do it again. The answer to the second question is no IMO. I haven't seen a quality offensive line since Keim has had the job despite the amount of picks and FA dollars he can invested in it.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Actually, last year wasn't a losing season...8-8...I think the year before was 7-9.

So 13 wins, followed by 7 wins, followed by 8 wins, followed by 2ish wins.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

Yup I got them backwards. Thx.

 

[kerouac9]

I have thought a lot about this and the question whether to retain Keim really boils down to this for me.

1-Do I think Keim can hire a top 16 NFL HC who can get the most out of Josh Rosen?

2-Do I think Keim can put together a top 16 NFL offensive line which can protect Josh Rosen?

The answer to the first question is yes. He has done it once and I believe that means he can do it again. The answer to the second question is no IMO. I haven't seen a quality offensive line since Keim has had the job despite the amount of picks and FA dollars he can invested in it.

I don't know -- did we really not have an average offensive line from 2013 - 2016?

Football Outsiders OL Rankings - Rush (Based on adjusted line yards)/Pass (based on Adjusted sack rate)
2013: 17/13
2014: 24/6
2015: 3/5
2016: 7/21

People love to complain about bad offensive line play because they don't really understand what good offensive line play looks like, and so it's easy to blame a fairly opaque unit. I think that everyone would have voted that the offensive lines in this season were bad, even though they were Actually Good.

What I do think is that something changed — and I think it was the pressure of having to start D.J. Humphries — that shifted the equation. If Jonathan Cooper had worked out and if some of those midround picks had turned into serviceable players, I think we'd be telling a different story right now.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I don't know -- did we really not have an average offensive line from 2013 - 2016?

Football Outsiders OL Rankings - Rush (Based on adjusted line yards)/Pass (based on Adjusted sack rate)
2013: 17/13
2014: 24/6
2015: 3/5
2016: 7/21

People love to complain about bad offensive line play because they don't really understand what good offensive line play looks like, and so it's easy to blame a fairly opaque unit. I think that everyone would have voted that the offensive lines in this season were bad, even though they were Actually Good.

What I do think is that something changed — and I think it was the pressure of having to start D.J. Humphries — that shifted the equation. If Jonathan Cooper had worked out and if some of those midround picks had turned into serviceable players, I think we'd be telling a different story right now.

forcing Humphries into the fire began the entire shift of the O-line. The line in 2015 with Hulk LT, Iupati, Sendlein, Whoever, Massie actually played incredibly well as a unit... opened up big enough holes for CJ to be leading the league in rushing and for DJ to dominate when given a chance and Palmer had big pockets to operate in.

Then, they forced out Massie for Humphries at RT and he sucked, so they switched him over to LT and then Hulk sucked at RT, all while losing Sendlein (who was average at best) for his back-up Shipley who was worse than Sendlein.

 

[Ronin]

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[LoyaltyisaCurse]

forcing Humphries into the fire began the entire shift of the O-line. The line in 2015 with Hulk LT, Iupati, Sendlein, Whoever, Massie actually played incredibly well as a unit... opened up big enough holes for CJ to be leading the league in rushing and for DJ to dominate when given a chance and Palmer had big pockets to operate in.

Then, they forced out Massie for Humphries at RT and he sucked, so they switched him over to LT and then Hulk sucked at RT, all while losing Sendlein (who was average at best) for his back-up Shipley who was worse than Sendlein.

Massie was very underrated.

 

[CFLredzoned]

Massie was very underrated.

Yeah they should have just paid him the extra $2 mil or so overvalue he wanted. That would have made things so much easier.

 

[Chopper0080]

so...we cut Andre Smith without making sure DJ was healthy and now we are having to start Will Holden? WTF?

 

[don7031]

^ I was at WTF on Monday.

 

[MadCardDisease]

Was it just me or did the Cardinals makeshift OL against the Packers in GB have a better game than any game with the original starters.

 

[Chopper0080]

Was it just me or did the Cardinals makeshift OL against the Packers in GB have a better game than any game with the original starters.

I didn't see that. It still looked like terrible pass protection and bad offense.

 

[don7031]

Comparatively they did play better, but that could be due to the ineptitude of the Packers defense.

For the most part, Rosen had time to throw. Which in turn allowed him to play much better.

 

[CFLredzoned]

I didn't see that. It still looked like terrible pass protection and bad offense.

Yeah he was still under alot of pressure and getting flushed right away.

Then again, 182 yards rushing, 6.3 ypc. And there really weren't many long runs to account for that. They were getting good push.