2024 Draft Countdown/NFL Prospects thread

Mulli

...
Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 16, 2004
Posts
52,529
Reaction score
4,587
Location
Generational
Do you just say this stuff without looking it up? Honestly, it's soooooo easy to check your facts and then adjust your opinion.

Vea had 8.5 sacks in his last two years at Washington and 3.5 his Jr season. That sits alongside his 12 TFLs and 5 PDs (5.5 and 4 his last year).

Sweat's Super-senior season (where he's playing against a bunch of relative children much of the time), he has 2 Sacks (which is the total for his last two years) and 8 TFLs. This dude in a run-stuffer.
Isn't it ironic, don't you think
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
21,269
Reaction score
37,659
Location
UK
Do you just say this stuff without looking it up? Honestly, it's soooooo easy to check your facts and then adjust your opinion.

Vea had 8.5 sacks in his last two years at Washington and 3.5 his Jr season. That sits alongside his 12 TFLs and 5 PDs (5.5 and 4 his last year).

Sweat's Super-senior season (where he's playing against a bunch of relative children much of the time), he has 2 Sacks (which is the total for his last two years) and 8 TFLs. This dude in a run-stuffer.

I mean, Sweat in his 2nd year starting and final year had 6 PDs, 26 hurries, 3 hits, and 2 sacks playing mostly in the B gap.

Vea in his 2nd year as starter and final season had 3 PDs, 29 hurries, 9 hits, and 3 sacks playing mostly in the B gap.

Yeah, Vea had better stats, but then that's why I said "Vea territory" and I don't expect Sweat to go top 15. I know reading is hard.
 

oaken1

Stone Cold
Supporting Member
Banned from P+R
Joined
Mar 13, 2004
Posts
16,724
Reaction score
13,336
Location
Modesto, California
You are going to hate this comment, but you shouldn't take a NT in round 1 who can only play 40% of snaps. That was the argument against Dan Williams when we drafted him. Regardless of the benefit, if he can't play passing downs, a defensive linemen's impact is going to be limited.
agree. I am a huge Sweay fan but dude should be a third round pick.

but...but...the media draftnics are really pushing his bullrush and framing it such that he specializes in collapsing the pocket...which is a passing down skill.
But a 370 pound dude just cant stay on the field for an 8 minute drive,lol

I think its mostly the fact that the kid is literally so massive and yet still athletic that has folks so captivated
 

MadCardDisease

Moderator
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
20,019
Reaction score
12,390
Location
Chandler, Az
Dumpster Dan was ultimately considered a disappointment. There are easier ways to find run stuffing defensive tackles.

If you just want a big body to clog the middle then yes you can find them all over FA or later in the draft.

If you want a big guy who can clog the middle and collapse the pocket then I think it is worth investing more in that player. I have the Cardinals taking Sweat with their 2nd round pick which I think is the perfect spot to take him. I believe that Sweat can be one of those collapse the pocket type of guys.

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media
 

oaken1

Stone Cold
Supporting Member
Banned from P+R
Joined
Mar 13, 2004
Posts
16,724
Reaction score
13,336
Location
Modesto, California
the bright side is...even though sweat is a fifth year senior he is still only 22.... so his production is not just a sign of reaching physical maturity as he still has a few years to go.

as opposed to a Jared Verse who will turn 24 in the middle of his rookie season
 

Krangodnzr

Captain of Team Murray
Joined
Jul 21, 2002
Posts
35,541
Reaction score
32,397
Location
Orange County, CA
He’s more than just a big run stuffer. That guy will collapse pockets.
That's the hope. We've seen other guys like him that didn't end up that way in the NFL. Vince Wilfork comes to mind. He was a freak athlete in college but he ended up being an OK DT because he didn't really have enough pass rush juice.

The hope is he can be a Dexter Lawrence or Vita Vea, but if he's Dumpster Dan you've wasted a good asset.
 

Stout

Hold onto the ball, Murray!
Joined
Dec 30, 2002
Posts
38,437
Reaction score
21,373
Location
Pittsburgh, PA--Enemy territory!
That's the hope. We've seen other guys like him that didn't end up that way in the NFL. Vince Wilfork comes to mind. He was a freak athlete in college but he ended up being an OK DT because he didn't really have enough pass rush juice.

The hope is he can be a Dexter Lawrence or Vita Vea, but if he's Dumpster Dan you've wasted a good asset.
Dumpster Dan wasn't a waste of a good asset by a large stretch. I think this is the disconnect between us on these positions. Was it less than a perfect pick because he was only a run stuffer? Absolutely. Was it a wasted pick? Far from it. A wasted pick is a bust, and DD wasn't at all a bust. A lot of late firsts are busts or worse than DD. Could we have picked better? Yes, definitely.
 

Sparky16

All Star
Joined
Jul 1, 2021
Posts
653
Reaction score
656
Location
Phoenix
Just saying, if MHJ gets snagged in top 3 and Maye is the QB that falls..... i say take him and shop Kyler, how about ATL for B Robinson and their #1? I can dream. Don't doubt that this GM/Coach wouldn't mind having "their" QB to build around. MN, LV could also be trade partners
 

Krangodnzr

Captain of Team Murray
Joined
Jul 21, 2002
Posts
35,541
Reaction score
32,397
Location
Orange County, CA
Dumpster Dan wasn't a waste of a good asset by a large stretch. I think this is the disconnect between us on these positions. Was it less than a perfect pick because he was only a run stuffer? Absolutely. Was it a wasted pick? Far from it. A wasted pick is a bust, and DD wasn't at all a bust. A lot of late firsts are busts or worse than DD. Could we have picked better? Yes, definitely.
Agree the phrasing is wrong.

I look at it at a shot to add a real difference maker, and you wasted that opportunity by filling a less vital role.

I wish I could find the video now, but years ago I watched an analyst who showed that stopping the pass and passing better than your opponent has always been more important than running the ball and stopping the run. Even going back to Super Bowl I, the Packers were good at this aspect of football. He called it the passing differential.

So adding a defender who doesn't affect the pass at all is a waste of an asset. The same goes for offensive players; a TE who isn't a monster receiver is a wasted asset too.
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
21,269
Reaction score
37,659
Location
UK
If you just want a big body to clog the middle then yes you can find them all over FA or later in the draft.

If you want a big guy who can clog the middle and collapse the pocket then I think it is worth investing more in that player. I have the Cardinals taking Sweat with their 2nd round pick which I think is the perfect spot to take him. I believe that Sweat can be one of those collapse the pocket type of guys.

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

Sweat is the kind of guy that might not directly register a tonne of stats such as sacks, but will just wreck the line so those around him capitalise.
 

Cbus cardsfan

Back to Back ASFN FFL Champion
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
21,233
Reaction score
6,829
Had dinner with B-inlaw last night. We talked a little draft. Nothing earth shattering but after I told him, Monti may go missing if he passes on Marvin :lol: , he said Marvin is the best but he really, really likes Nabers then Oduzne.

I told him word is the Cards might go OT. He asked me which one then said you really can't go wrong. OT is absolutely loaded with talent this year. In fact, the entire OL is a very strong group.

Not alot of high end defensive talent. There was a CB he likes but I can't remember his name, not Kool-aid.

I know a couple guys the Raiders are targeting in FA. Not going to say who but will after the fact if they sign them.
 

Krangodnzr

Captain of Team Murray
Joined
Jul 21, 2002
Posts
35,541
Reaction score
32,397
Location
Orange County, CA
Sweat is the kind of guy that might not directly register a tonne of stats such as sacks, but will just wreck the line so those around him capitalise.
Maybe.

There is a big difference pushing back college centers and guards compared to doing the same against a 28 year old, 6 year NFL veteran. NFL blocking schemes tend to be more complex than college blocking schemes since there is a weekly cap in how long college players can spend working on their craft.

The problem with drafting a NT high is that while the upside is enticing the average is pretty underwhelming. It's the same with other non-premium positions.
 

Garthshort

ASFN Addict
Joined
Aug 11, 2002
Posts
9,169
Reaction score
5,155
Location
Scarsdale, NY
Just saying, if MHJ gets snagged in top 3 and Maye is the QB that falls..... i say take him and shop Kyler, how about ATL for B Robinson and their #1? I can dream. Don't doubt that this GM/Coach wouldn't mind having "their" QB to build around. MN, LV could also be trade partners
To me, that's not a dream, but a nightmare. Ask Atlanta fans how they're doing w/o a QB?
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
21,269
Reaction score
37,659
Location
UK
Maybe.

There is a big difference pushing back college centers and guards compared to doing the same against a 28 year old, 6 year NFL veteran. NFL blocking schemes tend to be more complex than college blocking schemes since there is a weekly cap in how long college players can spend working on their craft.

The problem with drafting a NT high is that while the upside is enticing the average is pretty underwhelming. It's the same with other non-premium positions.

Both Dexter Lawrence and Vita Vea were drafted top 20 and everyone here would draft them top 20 if they could.

Sweat dominated the Senior Bowl against the best interior linemen in the draft. If teams think Sweat can be close to either of those guys then he is worth a 1st round pick.

Guys that size that move like this are going in round 1

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media
 

RON_IN_OC

https://www.ronevansrealty.com
Joined
Mar 10, 2004
Posts
25,928
Reaction score
32,888
Location
BirdGangThing
Hope it turns out the way Daves' post describes. But I doubt that Robert Kraft will pass on a QB.
After the Mac Jones debacle, don't be surprised to see the Patriots make a run at a veteran QB...I wouldn't be shocked to see them try to get Cousins, Mayfield or Wilson....and an outside chance if the Steelers go for someone like Wilson, then the Patriots maybe send a 3rd or ???? for Pickett. Then they can use the #3 pick for an offensive weapon, like MHJ.
 

RON_IN_OC

https://www.ronevansrealty.com
Joined
Mar 10, 2004
Posts
25,928
Reaction score
32,888
Location
BirdGangThing
Both Dexter Lawrence and Vita Vea were drafted top 20 and everyone here would draft them top 20 if they could.

Sweat dominated the Senior Bowl against the best interior linemen in the draft. If teams think Sweat can be close to either of those guys then he is worth a 1st round pick.

Guys that size that move like this are going in round 1

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media
I want the Cards to draft Sweat, just so they can play C&C Music Factory when he's introduced or makes a play....Gonna make you sweat till you bleed...Is that dope enough? Indeed!

You must be registered for see images attach
 

CardNots

ASFN Lifer
Joined
Sep 12, 2002
Posts
3,887
Reaction score
3,420
Location
Jenks, Oklahoma
agree. I am a huge Sweay fan but dude should be a third round pick.

but...but...the media draftnics are really pushing his bullrush and framing it such that he specializes in collapsing the pocket...which is a passing down skill.
But a 370 pound dude just cant stay on the field for an 8 minute drive,lol

I think its mostly the fact that the kid is literally so massive and yet still athletic that has folks so captivated
Well if we pick Sweat keep in mind the chicken fried steak isn’t as widely available in Phoenix as it is in Texas. I think the post office serves chicken fried steak in Texas:)
 
Top