2023 1st round pick is #6 Paris Johnson

Card'em

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A lot can happen in 5 years. If 5 years down the road you have 2 very good tackles and you can't afford both of them, I would think an adroit GM would trade one to get a return of value. I'd draft the highly rated and needed tackle in a heartbeat. The next 4-5 years with 2 very good tackles would do wonders for Murray and the Cardinals.
 

kerouac9

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A lot can happen in 5 years. If 5 years down the road you have 2 very good tackles and you can't afford both of them, I would think an adroit GM would trade one to get a return of value. I'd draft the highly rated and needed tackle in a heartbeat. The next 4-5 years with 2 very good tackles would do wonders for Murray and the Cardinals.
You have to make the first decision in three years with PJJ’s fifth-year option.
 

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That's an easy one. If he plays at the level that the Cards expect, you give him his second contract with your other tackle still on his first rookie contract. The decision time comes when you have to negotiate the second contract for your "other" tackle.
 

kerouac9

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That's an easy one. If he plays at the level that the Cards expect, you give him his second contract with your other tackle still on his first rookie contract. The decision time comes when you have to negotiate the second contract for your "other" tackle.
Yes. Obviously. Although the money you pay to PJJ is obviously not going to be there to pay Joe Alt.

People are kind of mis-remembering how poisonous the Anquan Boldin situation ended up. Q got a nice little contract upgrade after his second season (2004) from a second-round rookie contract to ~$4 million a year.

Fitz got his first major contract extension ahead of the 2009 season to over $10 million a year. Anquan Boldin was a Raven in 2010. (Some of these dates might be a little off; I have a hard time reading OTC's tables).

Interesting that Q was on the sideline for the Ravens' game. He must hate the Cards so much.
 

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Yes. Obviously. Although the money you pay to PJJ is obviously not going to be there to pay Joe Alt.

People are kind of mis-remembering how poisonous the Anquan Boldin situation ended up. Q got a nice little contract upgrade after his second season (2004) from a second-round rookie contract to ~$4 million a year.

Fitz got his first major contract extension ahead of the 2009 season to over $10 million a year. Anquan Boldin was a Raven in 2010. (Some of these dates might be a little off; I have a hard time reading OTC's tables).

Interesting that Q was on the sideline for the Ravens' game. He must hate the Cards so much.
He has cause. I believe him when he says Cardinals made promises they didn't keep. Seems like a pattern.
 

Chopper0080

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You have to make the first decision in three years with PJJ’s fifth-year option.
Free agency will have a little say in this. Outside of that, what players do you think we will be paying significantly money to in three years?

I do understand your point, and don't disagree. I also recognize the Cardinals are devoid of young talent so right now, the books look wide open. Also, if PJJ develops into a 15+ mil RT, we are probably very lucky. Honestly, just tough for me to be concerned about financials when we are so bereft of talent.
 

kerouac9

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Free agency will have a little say in this. Outside of that, what players do you think we will be paying significantly money to in three years?

I do understand your point, and don't disagree. I also recognize the Cardinals are devoid of young talent so right now, the books look wide open. Also, if PJJ develops into a 15+ mil RT, we are probably very lucky. Honestly, just tough for me to be concerned about financials when we are so bereft of talent.

Free agency will say a lot about that, especially if we plan to compete while filling in roster spots for 2025 free agents that include:

Budda Baker
James Conner
Kyzir White
Will Hernandez

Matt Prater
Zaven Collins
Dennis Gardeck
Hjalte Froholdt
Zach Pascal
Rondale Moore

That's 10 starters in 2023 who are pending free agents for 2025. I expect the bolded names to be extended at some point. Are they going to get top 15 money at their position? Probably not, but if we're going to have a plan to be good, you're going to have to bring in people who are getting paid in that range while also keeping guys like this.

To the second bolded point, I think that if you keep PJJ at RT you should expect him to become a $15 MM per year RT. That will be top 20 RT salary in three years. If he can't develop into that, why did we draft him #6 overall? He's gotta be better than Terence Steele.

I just don't think you can have a functional offense with $17 MM invested at RT, $25 MM invested at LT, and $45 MM invested at QB. There's just no room to do anything but be extremely lucky at the other 9-10 offensive positions (especially if you're also extending Trey McBride for $13 million per year+).

It's bad that we suck. We're only going to get better by bringing in better players. I still believe that if we think Joe Alt has a chance of being as good as Joe Thomas, you forget about PJJ's future and move forward. But if you project Alt as Andrew Thomas or something, you're better off not drafting into a contract challenge in the near future.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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Free agency will say a lot about that, especially if we plan to compete while filling in roster spots for 2025 free agents that include:

Budda Baker
James Conner
Kyzir White
Will Hernandez

Matt Prater
Zaven Collins
Dennis Gardeck
Hjalte Froholdt
Zach Pascal
Rondale Moore

That's 10 starters in 2023 who are pending free agents for 2025. I expect the bolded names to be extended at some point. Are they going to get top 15 money at their position? Probably not, but if we're going to have a plan to be good, you're going to have to bring in people who are getting paid in that range while also keeping guys like this.

To the second bolded point, I think that if you keep PJJ at RT you should expect him to become a $15 MM per year RT. That will be top 20 RT salary in three years. If he can't develop into that, why did we draft him #6 overall? He's gotta be better than Terence Steele.

I just don't think you can have a functional offense with $17 MM invested at RT, $25 MM invested at LT, and $45 MM invested at QB. There's just no room to do anything but be extremely lucky at the other 9-10 offensive positions (especially if you're also extending Trey McBride for $13 million per year+).

It's bad that we suck. We're only going to get better by bringing in better players. I still believe that if we think Joe Alt has a chance of being as good as Joe Thomas, you forget about PJJ's future and move forward. But if you project Alt as Andrew Thomas or something, you're better off not drafting into a contract challenge in the near future.
I stopped reading when you said “10 starters” and had paschal and Moore listed.
 

Chopper0080

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Free agency will say a lot about that, especially if we plan to compete while filling in roster spots for 2025 free agents that include:

Budda Baker
James Conner
Kyzir White
Will Hernandez

Matt Prater
Zaven Collins
Dennis Gardeck
Hjalte Froholdt
Zach Pascal
Rondale Moore

That's 10 starters in 2023 who are pending free agents for 2025. I expect the bolded names to be extended at some point. Are they going to get top 15 money at their position? Probably not, but if we're going to have a plan to be good, you're going to have to bring in people who are getting paid in that range while also keeping guys like this.

To the second bolded point, I think that if you keep PJJ at RT you should expect him to become a $15 MM per year RT. That will be top 20 RT salary in three years. If he can't develop into that, why did we draft him #6 overall? He's gotta be better than Terence Steele.

I just don't think you can have a functional offense with $17 MM invested at RT, $25 MM invested at LT, and $45 MM invested at QB. There's just no room to do anything but be extremely lucky at the other 9-10 offensive positions (especially if you're also extending Trey McBride for $13 million per year+).

It's bad that we suck. We're only going to get better by bringing in better players. I still believe that if we think Joe Alt has a chance of being as good as Joe Thomas, you forget about PJJ's future and move forward. But if you project Alt as Andrew Thomas or something, you're better off not drafting into a contract challenge in the near future.
I would support extending Fro, White, and Hernandez. I think we are headed towards paying McBride. I just don't think those guys will cost that much (outside of maybe McBride).

In terms of PJJ being a top 20 RT. He should be. I hope he will be. I just am not passing on a great player on that hope. Right now the 11th highest paid RT is 12 mil. PJJ is already the 17th highest at 7 mil. If that doubles, I don't see a problem right now.

I do agree that WR may offer more talent, and more contract versatility at 4 than OT. I also feel if MHJ is gone at 4, the Cardinals are trading back because someone is going to want a QB. Because of these two beliefs, argument is kinda moot IMO.
 

kerouac9

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I would support extending Fro, White, and Hernandez. I think we are headed towards paying McBride. I just don't think those guys will cost that much (outside of maybe McBride).

In terms of PJJ being a top 20 RT. He should be. I hope he will be. I just am not passing on a great player on that hope. Right now the 11th highest paid RT is 12 mil. PJJ is already the 17th highest at 7 mil. If that doubles, I don't see a problem right now.

I do agree that WR may offer more talent, and more contract versatility at 4 than OT. I also feel if MHJ is gone at 4, the Cardinals are trading back because someone is going to want a QB. Because of these two beliefs, argument is kinda moot IMO.

Those guys aren't going to cost much, but they're not going to cost the basically nothing they cost now. They'll maybe get 3x what they're currently making. It adds up when you have to fill in a roster.

I guess you have to decide where you project PJJ as an LT. If you think he can be a top 12 LT, I think you flip him now and draft a midround RT or bring in a midlevel free agent. If you think that PJJ projects as a top 10 RT but not one of the three to five best? Ooof. What a blown pick, and Monti better help he does magic with the Texans pick.

I expect that if MJH isn't there (and maybe even if he is), Monti will look to trade out.
 

football karma

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Obviously you can’t predict the future, but if we never drafted PJJ, accounting for Hump’s injury, I think Alt over MHJ is way more likely than the current situation at hand.
it would be close to a requirement
 

Chopper0080

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@Chopper0080 Assuming they are correct.....thoughts?
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I never assume they are correct. I am holding onto Kyle's OL proj.

Ultimately, right now DJ is still on the roster as is Beachum. Until that changes, why would the Cardinals share that anything would change. I think The Captain will be a June 1 cut, which means the Cardinals have zero rush to make that roster move until after the draft. If MHJ is available at 4, Monti takes him, and we add a RT at 27 or in round 2...then you can cut DJ and have the plan be move PJJ to LT. If MHJ is gone and Monti decides to take Alt or Fashanu, then you cut DJ, and the plan stays keeping PJJ at RT. Even with inside sources, the plan is to keep things as they are until the draft comes which will dictate any changes.
 

Chopper0080

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I’m surprised by this if at all accurate.
IMO, from an organizational perspective, this statement makes sense. The plan has been DJ at LT and PJJ at RT for the foreseeable future, and that doesn't change until you cut DJ and add another player into the mix. Why telegraph your draft plans by commenting on something you don't have to comment on? It is why I expect DJ to be cut after the draft and not before.
 
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