2019 O-line discussion

Discussion in 'Arizona Cardinals' started by Ronin, May 21, 2019.

  1. kerouac9

    kerouac9 #Stiff4Kliff

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    I dunno. This criticism seems over the top.

    To the Cam Newton thing, that was Ray Horton's first game as the DC, and Patrick Peterson's first game as a pro. Carolina had zero running game that day (56 yards from backs on just 19 total carries). I remember that being one of the most dominant performance by a wide receiver I've ever seen. Steve Smith, Sr. absolutely took Peterson to the woodshed.
     
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  2. Solar7

    Solar7 Also Skeptical

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    It's just a combination of both. To assume we're going to see our rookie QB and coach come out and just full on track meet it to record numbers seems low.

    If Kyler puts up 400 with Kliff in game 1, there will be a bonafide media circus around us.
     
  3. Krangthebrain

    Krangthebrain Captain of Team Murray

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    Andy Reid would call Kingsbury for play advice.

    I think it's pretty much a given at this point that Kingsbury is an offensive genius.

    But that doesnt mean he can run an NFL team.
     
  4. Stout

    Stout I gave my cards a victory...

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    Rimshot :)
     
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  5. Krangthebrain

    Krangthebrain Captain of Team Murray

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    It's not a crazy proposition though. The teams who have introduced Air Raid concepts (Chiefs, Patriots, Eagles, and Bears) have had a lot of success.

    I think you might see more of 285 passing yards, 85 rush yard type games.

    If Murray is successful (keyword is IF, dont get all crazy about this statement) he will be one of the hardest players in the NFL to defend. That's why drafting him number one overall makes sense to so many of us. I liked Q Williams and to a lesser extent Bosa, but neither of them could come remotely close to the impact that Murray could potentially create.

    But like I said in another thread, boom or bust. Nothing in between. The ultimate gamble on coach and player. And there my friend, is a reason to be excited.
     
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  6. Solar7

    Solar7 Also Skeptical

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    I'm from Vegas. I can't stand "ultimate gambles." That's what I constantly see from people who ruin their lives here, haha.

    I'm way more of a "hedge my bets, go with the safe play" kind of person. That doesn't mean you don't occasionally take your shots at something, but still.
     
  7. Krangthebrain

    Krangthebrain Captain of Team Murray

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    Safe plays are the route to mediocrity in sports.

    Just last night a team won the NBA title by making a crazy bet on Kawhi Leonard. They traded a really good all star for a guy with one year left on his contract. And now Toronto has an NBA title before Phoenix does.
     
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  8. Solar7

    Solar7 Also Skeptical

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    That wasn't a wild desperation play. There's a difference between going "All-In" on a proven player with experience like Kawhi, or spending big on proven players like Golden State, than saying "**** it, we're gonna disregard all conventional wisdom and just throw a hail mary."

    I guess safe isn't really what I mean, I mean manageable risks. Signing KK? Super risky, but manageable. Signing KK and Kyler, all while giving up what we did? That's a Hail Mary, 100% boom-or-bust kind of thing.
     
  9. Krangthebrain

    Krangthebrain Captain of Team Murray

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    Desperation? Wild?

    In your eyes.

    Not in mine. Murray had perhaps, the best season any college QB has ever had. Any it's not like hes Case Keenum who lacks any elite traits.

    And what The Raptors did is a huge gamble. They literally have been one of the top 3 teams in east over the past 3-5 years. If they didnt win the title and he moved on, they likely become a lottery team or 8 seed. Getting elite talent in basketball is rough.
     
  10. Solar7

    Solar7 Also Skeptical

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    For all of the "best season any college QB has ever had" talk, he sure wasn't considered even a first rounder until damn late in the process, and teams sure weren't clamoring to come up and get him.

    His ranking for most of the talking heads was not the consensus #1 overall player talent-wise, not even the best QB on all boards. If Kliff wasn't stiff for K1, you have to wonder where he gets drafted.

    I doubt Kyler would have been our QB if USC held Kingsbury to his contract and we had to look elsewhere.
     
  11. kerouac9

    kerouac9 #Stiff4Kliff

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    Welp. I'm ready to unsubscribe to this thread. There's no reason to re-litigate this with the same tired arguments.

    FWIW, I don't think the Leonard and Murray situations are comperable. Toronto had a roster that couldn't take them to a championship, so they took a risk to get them over the top. It reminded me of when the Bucs traded 1st- and 2nd round picks for Jon Gruden. For Toronto, they'd be in the same position if they were an 8-seed and getting bounced out of the playoffs by better teams.

    There isn't much precedent for lashing together a QB and a coach like this. I guess Carson Palmer and Marvin Lewis comes to mind, but Palmer was a more traditional prospect and Lewis a more NFL proven head coach.
     
  12. Solar7

    Solar7 Also Skeptical

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    Yeah, sorry, I agree with you. Just trying to soak up time at the office today. There's NOTHING going on. I wanna scream, haha. Agreed with you on all points.
     
  13. Krangthebrain

    Krangthebrain Captain of Team Murray

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    But Toronto DID have a championship roster. Kawhi is a great player, but Toronto has really depth throughout there roster.

    My point is that sometimes there is a player that you think can take your team to the next level, and IMO Murray is that type of player.
     
  14. Veer

    Veer Registered

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    It isn't that much of a risk considering we were dead last. KK is a great offensive mind, and the NFL is all about offense. The likes of Reid, McVay and the GOAT himself BB ask KK for his opinion on offense and schemes.

    We didn't give up a lot for Kyler. We didn't give up another pick or any future picks. We earned him because we sucked so bad. The hype around him and his size got so out of hand that people forgot about his greatness on the field. KM and KK are a perfect match. In the end it's just one pick and we took the most talented QB when we didn't have an established one.

    If Rosen had at least shown glimpses of greatness, we could've overthought the Murray selection. But Rosen can only dream of the talent Murray has. Darnold has shown glimpses, even Josh Allen who can't hit the broad side of a barn made made plays for his team. Neither had a good OL or good weapons. We cut ties early on Rosen and so be it. We wouldn't even get a 6th for Nkemdiche right now, for Reddick probably a 5th at best. Sunk cost is something all franchises have to live with. Actually I think the perennial winning franchises are smarter in cutting their losses sooner rather than later.
     
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  15. RugbyMuffin

    RugbyMuffin Uh,huhuhuhuhuh

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    So much for the offensive line talk.

    Can't we just pin a Murray debate thread.


    ..... I am not a big supporter of the direction of the team but I am over it. It is what it is, and while the QB is important, there are other issues on the table.

    I don't care if your QB is 5'5" and 140lbs or 6'10" 290lbs. You do not need them taking a lot of hits, and this offensive line has all sorts of things going on. Too bad.....

    Sent from my mystical communication warp drive device thingy
     
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