OT: Kyler Murray Debacle Thread

[TJ]

Again you guys don't know what you are watching. The linebacker was right there for Marv, if Kyler hits him he gets destroyed or the LBer makes a break on it and it's a pick. You see him "open" after kyler has already started his throwing motion to the dump off, when the LB breaks on play. I beg of all of you wanna be film watchers to at least try to know what you are talking about!

So Kyler takes the easy play by throwing to his check-down with two defenders converging on the RB. he couldve thrown to his X receiver (I think that's Zay) or thrown MHJ open seeing that there's open field down the seam.

There are two better options on the play, and both happen to be WRs, which is the complaint that us fans have about Drew's offense and Kyler's lack of vision.

 

[urs]

So Kyler takes the easy play by throwing to his check-down with two defenders converging on the RB. he couldve thrown to his X receiver (I think that's Zay) or thrown MHJ open seeing that there's open field down the seam.

There are two better options on the play, and both happen to be WRs, which is the complaint that us fans have about Drew's offense and Kyler's lack of vision.

Throw him open down the seam? Dude, you are lost. They have routes, they run those routes, if there is an option involved they take it, but they can't just make stuff up.

EDIT: If there WAS an option then it's on Marv for not going up the seam, but that's highly doubtful

 

[Chopper0080]

Man, we're going to miss Conner. Just watching the 2nd drive and the first 4 plays have been 3 Conner runs and a screen to Conner.

Anyway, 3rd down before the 2nd drive ends. I just don't understand why he bails here. He has a great pocket. The DT only gets threw once he bails because the angle changes.

I debated if it was designed for him to run that way but nobody is looking to block and Kyler is looking for a pass the whole time.

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Yup. Kyler just gets uncomfortable instead of climbing the pocket. He was going to have some options open up underneath if he just hangs in the pocket a bit longer.

 

[TJ]

This is the following play.

One of the things that bothers me about this offense is how often Kyler predetermines his throws. I'm fine with some predetermination if what you see from the defense telegraphs what needs to happen, but the look here isn't great for Tip pre snap or post snap. So I don't understand why he's deciding this is the option considering it's well short of the chains.

If I'm looking for an easy pre snap read here it's Conner but the pass I'd like to see throw is to Marv who's covered by a linebacker with Higgins potentially lead blocking for him on a CB.

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Why TF do we run so much 13 personnel?

 

[TJ]

Throw him open down the seam? Dude, you are lost. They have routes, they run those routes, if there is an option involved they take it, but they can't just make stuff up.

Even if you dont think KM could've thrown MHJ open, he had the X receiver wiiiiiiiide open but opted for the check-down. He's either too scared to attack the outside, or he doesnt have the vision.

Nonetheless, these videos are pretty damning.

 

[BritCard]

Again you guys don't know what you are watching. The linebacker was right there for Marv, if Kyler hits him he gets destroyed or the LBer makes a break on it and it's a pick. You see him "open" after kyler has already started his throwing motion to the dump off, when the LB breaks on play. I beg of all of you wanna be film watchers to at least try to know what you are talking about!

This is only the 3rd drive and there's already at least 4 plays where Kyler fires it in to much tighter coverage than that. You're deluded.

 

[urs]

This is only the 3rd drive and there's already at least 4 plays where Kyler fires it in to much tighter coverage than that. You're deluded.

Buddy, you make a fool of yourself week in and week out with your horrific breakdowns. If YOU think I'm deluded, I know I'm on target

 

[urs]

Even if you dont think KM could've thrown MHJ open, he had the X receiver wiiiiiiiide open but opted for the check-down. He's either too scared to attack the outside, or he doesnt have the vision.

Nonetheless, these videos are pretty damning.

The only daming thing about them is that they show how awful our scheme is and how some here have no idea how to breakdown film

 

[urs]

For the record, I'm sure there are a handful of plays Kyler screwed the pooch on but the one shown in that video isn't one of em.

 

[BritCard]

Buddy, you make a fool of yourself week in and week out with your horrific breakdowns. If YOU think I'm deluded, I know I'm on target

Guy, you're like one of 5 people here that thinks Kyler is good. I'm pretty confident in which one is deluded. Now back to ignore.

 

[kerouac9]

Neither of us know what would’ve happened, but I know that Murray wasn’t a lock to do anything of substance in the NFL. All I know is that it’s year seven, and Kyler is massively under performing his draft position to the point in which he’s become expendable.

I think this is unfair. Kyler was a boom or bust prospect for sure. I don’t know if anyone expected him to end up so mid.

Kyler isn’t expendable, which is the entire problem. If he were Mitch Trubisky or Indiana Jones or Kirk Cousins it would be another story. Even down to down his ability to consistently win the corner and run for a first down drives a lot of strong metrics.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I think this is unfair. Kyler was a boom or bust prospect for sure. I don’t know if anyone expected him to end up so mid.

Kyler isn’t expendable, which is the entire problem. If he were Mitch Trubisky or Indiana Jones or Kirk Cousins it would be another story. Even down to down his ability to consistently win the corner and run for a first down drives a lot of strong metrics.

I bet the same arguments were made about Kirk Cousins, then Sam Darnold on the Vikings… and they were definitely made with Russell Wilson AND Geno Smith on the Seahawks. Both the Vikings and Seahawks had no problem getting rid of their mids and seemed to be able to band-aid the QB position well enough to stay competitive and likely in the playoff picture.

Meanwhile, we keep staying tethered to Kyler for fear of the unknown while not having even been in the playoff picture since 2021.

It’s time for the unknown.

 

[kerouac9]

Man, we're going to miss Conner. Just watching the 2nd drive and the first 4 plays have been 3 Conner runs and a screen to Conner.

Anyway, 3rd down before the 2nd drive ends. I just don't understand why he bails here. He has a great pocket. The DT only gets threw once he bails because the angle changes.

I debated if it was designed for him to run that way but nobody is looking to block and Kyler is looking for a pass the whole time.

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Is it even possible that both Zay and Trey ran the correct route on this play? They end up ~10 feet from each other. What is the point?

 

[602 Native]

Yup. Kyler just gets uncomfortable instead of climbing the pocket. He was going to have some options open up underneath if he just hangs in the pocket a bit longer.

He climbed the pocket in this game and got absolutely destroyed on a sack.

Next?

 

[kerouac9]

I bet the same arguments were made about Kirk Cousins, then Sam Darnold on the Vikings… and they were definitely made with Russell Wilson AND Geno Smith on the Seahawks. Both the Vikings and Seahawks had no problem getting rid of their mids and seemed to be able to band-aid the QB position well enough to stay competitive and likely in the playoff picture.

Meanwhile, we keep staying tethered to Kyler for fear of the unknown while not having even been in the playoff picture since 2021.

It’s time for the unknown.

I fully expect us to continue to stay competitive and in the playoff picture.

If we could get the bounty for Kyler that Seattle got for Russ, I’d do it in a heartbeat. Would I trade him for the third Seattle got for Geno? Ask me at the end of the year.

The Vikes had a plan for the future when they let both Cousins and Darnold walk as free agents. I’m just not ready to opt in to more terrible football. Who’s our most marketable offensive player if Kyler leaves?

 

[DVontel]

The only realistic choice other than Tua was Herbert.

It’s extremely difficult to hold the #1 pick in back to back years, so Burrow was out of the question.

Love and Hurts were seen as massive projects, hence them not getting drafted in the first round, so they were out of the equation.

What has & will continue to cost this organization is poor ownership with significant history of bad choices. Would you have really expected this franchise to make the right choice and draft Herbert over Tua? Be honest with yourself.

Love also sat for 3 years behind Rodgers. Is he even the same player he is(Good, but not great imo) here being thrown into the fire from start?

I think Burrow & Herbert the only QBs from the 2020 list bust-proof regardless of situation.

 

[Chopper0080]

I fully expect us to continue to stay competitive and in the playoff picture.

If we could get the bounty for Kyler that Seattle got for Russ, I’d do it in a heartbeat. Would I trade him for the third Seattle got for Geno? Ask me at the end of the year.

The Vikes had a plan for the future when they let both Cousins and Darnold walk as free agents. I’m just not ready to opt in to more terrible football. Who’s our most marketable offensive player if Kyler leaves?

This is so unintentionally sad. James Conner and Trey McBride but I get your point.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I fully expect us to continue to stay competitive and in the playoff picture.

If we could get the bounty for Kyler that Seattle got for Russ, I’d do it in a heartbeat. Would I trade him for the third Seattle got for Geno? Ask me at the end of the year.

The Vikes had a plan for the future when they let both Cousins and Darnold walk as free agents. I’m just not ready to opt in to more terrible football. Who’s our most marketable offensive player if Kyler leaves?

There was no more plan when Cousins walked than there would be for the Cardinals. They drafted a QB and signed a band-aid vet and we’d have to do the same. The only difference is the Vikings would have moved on from a QB who was at least consistently taking them to the playoffs every other year as opposed to Kyler who’s taken this team to the playoffs 1 time in 6 years, soon to be 7.

 

[BooksOrangePlanet]

I fully expect us to continue to stay competitive and in the playoff picture.

If we could get the bounty for Kyler that Seattle got for Russ, I’d do it in a heartbeat. Would I trade him for the third Seattle got for Geno? Ask me at the end of the year.

The Vikes had a plan for the future when they let both Cousins and Darnold walk as free agents. I’m just not ready to opt in to more terrible football. Who’s our most marketable offensive player if Kyler leaves?

kyler and 2 first round picks for burrows

 

[Mr X]

I don't think anyone here hates Kyler. We are just sick of his limitations- physically, mentally, leadership and ability to win. It's been 7 years of this. He's not an easy out but it's time to bite the bullet. I don't think he deserves another chance if we don't make the playoffs this year.

Would a veteran QB run this offense better while we draft a QB of the future? Can we get a late 1st or a few 2nds for him?

 

[BritCard]

He climbed the pocket in this game and got absolutely destroyed on a sack.

Next?

Lol

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[kerouac9]

There was no more plan when Cousins walked than there would be for the Cardinals. They drafted a QB and signed a band-aid vet and we’d have to do the same. The only difference is the Vikings would have moved on from a QB who was at least consistently taking them to the playoffs every other year as opposed to Kyler who’s taken this team to the playoffs 1 time in 6 years, soon to be 7.

Minny had built the draft capital to trade up and get a QB prospect high in the draft. That’s a plan; they didn’t walk into that pick.

 

[Stout]

The only daming thing about them is that they show how awful our scheme is and how some here have no idea how to breakdown film

So there is nothing in any of the videos week in, week out, that shows that Kyler missed anything? Now that's a damning opinion.

 

[TJ]

I think this is unfair. Kyler was a boom or bust prospect for sure. I don’t know if anyone expected him to end up so mid.

Kyler isn’t expendable, which is the entire problem. If he were Mitch Trubisky or Indiana Jones or Kirk Cousins it would be another story. Even down to down his ability to consistently win the corner and run for a first down drives a lot of strong metrics.

He's expendable because he's in the 7th year of playing for this franchise, is not improving, and not making the team better. This is like Jared Goff when he was with the Rams. He was just mediocre and not helping the team. Perhaps a new team makes Kyler better, but it's not going to happen here and he needs to go.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I haven't read through the latest transgressions on here but the bottom line is, whether you're a Kyler fan or not, you can't have a Qb averaging 4 YPA and that's what Kyler is this year.