K1

[BritCard]

Do you even read what you write?

“what have other NFC QBs done to challenge pro bowl voting this year”

you’re literally saying Kyler deserves his NFC #3 QB spot

yet somehow Kyler is trash and nothing to be excited about

No. What I'm saying is that he had no competition in the "what names have I heard a lot this year" bowl.

 

[BritCard]

We should all adopt Zeem’s “nothing to see here, all’s well, move along” critical thinking as the 6-3 season burns down to the ground around him. Lol.

All Cards HCs need to do in future is start well. Then everything that happens after fans will just say "Yeah but that start"

 

[HGC]

Murray needs big time coaching to elevate his game and that’s not Kliff. Take away his ability to run and he’s shown next to no improvements as a quarterback.

 

[nashman]

It’s pretty simple if you offense depends on one guy playing hero ball and carrying the entire offense your scheme and probably a lot of your players suck!

 

[Chopper0080]

the only reason this team wins is KM that’s the ******* problem! He has to put them on his back and carry them it would be nice if the TEAM helped out, from ****** defense, dropped passes, terrible running game, piss poor coaching, playcalling, the list of what’s wrong with this team has KM at the BOTTOM!

Kyler looks really confused and makes multiple mental and fundamental mistakes every week. It is a QB driven league so his issues are more impactful than non-QB players. In order for him and the team to take the step forward, he has put in more work developing his fundamentals and understanding defenses. Kyler has to play hero ball a lot of times because Kyler puts himself in those situations. This isn't abnormal for young QBs and I don't know why you react like Kyler is being unreasonably critiqued.

 

[Chopper0080]

Kyler just has a lot of work to do on the little things that make QBs great. The difference between him and most players on our roster and in the league is that he has space to get better. His own drive and self awareness are the only things that will limit him.

 

[nashman]

Kyler just has a lot of work to do on the little things that make QBs great. The difference between him and most players on our roster and in the league is that he has space to get better. His own drive and self awareness are the only things that will limit him.

He is very young and of course he has a lot to learn he has very little experience at the pro level, and one could easily argue is playing for a poor NFL coach. My point was he has had a long season of CARRYING this team and is probably tired and fed up with having to carry everything in his legs! How good was the first half? Way better than the second right? One stud WR and a QB doesn’t equal a good offense we need more talent period, way too much being ask for him to carry this stupid ass offense! They can’t even go a game without false starting or burning timeouts because KK can’t get the freaking play in on time...ridiculous

 

[Stout]

We should all adopt Zeem’s “nothing to see here, all’s well, move along” critical thinking as the 6-3 season burns down to the ground around him. Lol.

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[82CardsGrad]

He is very young and of course he has a lot to learn he has very little experience at the pro level, and one could easily argue is playing for a poor NFL coach. My point was he has had a long season of CARRYING this team and is probably tired and fed up with having to carry everything in his legs! How good was the first half? Way better than the second right? One stud WR and a QB doesn’t equal a good offense we need more talent period, way too much being ask for him to carry this stupid ass offense! They can’t even go a game without false starting or burning timeouts because KK can’t get the ******* play in on time...ridiculous

No team in the NFL is blessed with a multitude of all-pro WR’s...
Every stud QB knows that at certain key points of most games, he has to stand in the pocket and make one or more of “those throws.” Of course, play-calling is a big part of this as well... but this far in his career, Kyler has yet to show the ability nor the desire to be that type of QB.
We can only hope that he eventually figures this out... but if I’m being honest, I believe the odds are greater that he’ll be playing ball for the A’s versus becoming “that” QB...

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Kyler looks really confused and makes multiple mental and fundamental mistakes every week. It is a QB driven league so his issues are more impactful than non-QB players. In order for him and the team to take the step forward, he has put in more work developing his fundamentals and understanding defenses. Kyler has to play hero ball a lot of times because Kyler puts himself in those situations. This isn't abnormal for young QBs and I don't know why you react like Kyler is being unreasonably critiqued.

Hmm, he’s definitely partially the culprit but all the offensive penalties and dropped balls and runs for 0-2 yards pits him behind the eight ball in the majority of drives is bet.

 

[Chopper0080]

Hmm, he’s definitely partially the culprit but all the offensive penalties and dropped balls and runs for 0-2 yards pits him behind the eight ball in the majority of drives is bet.

I agree that his teammates do not do him favors sometimes and that needs to get better. On the flip side, there are an equal number of times where they do things correctly and he just doesn't deliver. He has to execute when they occur instead of wasting them. That is how you elevate a roster.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Right after the game, it was reported that Kyler skipped out on a scheduled postgame Zoom press conference. Poor baby.

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so he soccer players it up on the field and then skulks away without talking to the press like a baby?

not the leadership I want to see from my field general.

just makes him look like a little bitch.

 

[SoonerLou]

He is very young and of course he has a lot to learn he has very little experience at the pro level, and one could easily argue is playing for a poor NFL coach. My point was he has had a long season of CARRYING this team and is probably tired and fed up with having to carry everything in his legs! How good was the first half? Way better than the second right? One stud WR and a QB doesn’t equal a good offense we need more talent period, way too much being ask for him to carry this stupid ass offense! They can’t even go a game without false starting or burning timeouts because KK can’t get the ******* play in on time...ridiculous

Board has kinda jumped the shark.

Not sure I've seen a 23 yr pro bowl QB have an entire fanbase divided (at least here)

Usually fans just blame the coach when things go wrong (usually 3/4s). However, inherently there is bias against Kyler cause he wasnt some lock #1 pick QB like a Lawrence, Luck or Burrow. So there is some doubt there that causes such a dramatic shift even more than Kyler's play in recent weeks.

Happens when I lurk Browns fans message boards. When things are good "As it should be." When things go bad people fall back into their default beliefs. Some not even intentionally. Could make the case the same happens with Kliff here as well.

 

[ajcardfan]

I remember being on the old boards and if you dared to say the slightest thing negative about Jake Plummer you got slaughtered. I found that out when I mentioned after a season opener that his 3 or 4 turnovers killed our chances to win.

Compare that to Kyler. Some of you have been here long enough to know what I am saying is true.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

I remember being on the old boards and if you dared to say the slightest thing negative about Jake Plummer you got slaughtered. I found that out when I mentioned after a season opener that his 3 or 4 turnovers killed our chances to win.

Compare that to Kyler. Some of you have been here long enough to know what I am saying is true.

Well at least you could have some confidence in Jake bringing the team back from a deficit he helped put them in. He had 20 4th quarter comeback victories in the NFL. (For comparison - Russ Wilson currently has 23.)

Jake had 5 of them as a 2nd-year 23-year old QB...the year he helped get the Cards into the playoffs for the first time in AZ.

 

[ajcardfan]

Well at least you could have some confidence in Jake bringing the team back from a deficit he helped put them in. He had 20 4th quarter comeback victories in the NFL. (For comparison - Russ Wilson currently has 23.)

Jake had 5 of them as a 2nd-year 23-year old QB...the year he helped get the Cards into the playoffs for the first time in AZ.

Thanks for providing the perfect example to support my statement.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

Thanks for providing the perfect example to support my statement.

Well everyone seems to think it's cool to brush off Kyler's performance issues because he's a 23-year old kid. So was Jake when he took us to the playoffs - and then onto a road victory in Dallas. No excuses, Jake just manned the hell up. Scrappy player just like he was at ASU.

 

[BritCard]

Kyler looks really confused and makes multiple mental and fundamental mistakes every week. It is a QB driven league so his issues are more impactful than non-QB players. In order for him and the team to take the step forward, he has put in more work developing his fundamentals and understanding defenses. Kyler has to play hero ball a lot of times because Kyler puts himself in those situations. This isn't abnormal for young QBs and I don't know why you react like Kyler is being unreasonably critiqued.

This. Kyler getting himself out of situations with his legs that he created because he can't read defences, doesn't recognize blitz and doesn't go through his reads isn't "hero ball".

 

[BritCard]

Board has kinda jumped the shark.

Not sure I've seen a 23 yr pro bowl QB have an entire fanbase divided (at least here)

Usually fans just blame the coach when things go wrong (usually 3/4s). However, inherently there is bias against Kyler cause he wasnt some lock #1 pick QB like a Lawrence, Luck or Burrow. So there is some doubt there that causes such a dramatic shift even more than Kyler's play in recent weeks.

Happens when I lurk Browns fans message boards. When things are good "As it should be." When things go bad people fall back into their default beliefs. Some not even intentionally. Could make the case the same happens with Kliff here as well.

Or it could just be that it's very easy to see (for most) that he's not where he should be mechanically or mentally and that a lot of that was covered by his running and has been exposed recently when he hasn't been able to run so much.

To me it's very obvious to see a bunch of flaws in his game I expect to be much better by now.

When you combine that with his body language and sideline sulking it makes you question his work ethic. Whether it's accurate or not.

 

[Harry]

Board has kinda jumped the shark.

Not sure I've seen a 23 yr pro bowl QB have an entire fanbase divided (at least here)

Usually fans just blame the coach when things go wrong (usually 3/4s). However, inherently there is bias against Kyler cause he wasnt some lock #1 pick QB like a Lawrence, Luck or Burrow. So there is some doubt there that causes such a dramatic shift even more than Kyler's play in recent weeks.

Happens when I lurk Browns fans message boards. When things are good "As it should be." When things go bad people fall back into their default beliefs. Some not even intentionally. Could make the case the same happens with Kliff here as well.

I think there’s a lot of confusion and unintentional misrepresentation of positions on Murray. I do think it’s a little early to canonize him, but his potential is obviously outstanding. My concerns are more about the coaching and handling he’s receiving. Clearly he needs a better surrounding cast. I’ll take that up at a later time. However, he must bear some of the responsibility for his own development. He’s a superior athlete but that’s true of multiple failed QBs. I’m just saying I’m concerned about things I would expect to be seeing at least on a sporadic basis. Can he be a great QB? Yes. Is he now? No. I want to see a sustain effort on fundamental improvement. Then we’ll truly know what we have.

 

[82CardsGrad]

I think there’s a lot of confusion and unintentional misrepresentation of positions on Murray. I do think it’s a little early to canonize him, but his potential is obviously outstanding. My concerns are more about the coaching and handling he’s receiving. Clearly he needs a better surrounding cast. I’ll take that up at a later time. However, he must bear some of the responsibility for his own development. He’s a superior athlete but that’s true of multiple failed QBs. I’m just saying I’m concerned about things I would expect to be seeing at least on a sporadic basis. Can he be a great QB? Yes. Is he now? No. I want to see a sustain effort on fundamental improvement. Then we’ll truly know what we have.

I don’t see anything wrong with calling out the glaring concerns we might have with Murray.
Personally, I refuse to place blame on coaching... I mean, this is the NFL and be it on the Cards staff or elsewhere, Murray has the means to receive all of the most appropriate coaching available to a young QB.

Murray’s insane physical gifts don’t even need to be mentioned any longer. They are that evident and that “next-level.” But as you correctly pointed out, there are loads of failed NFL QB’s who possessed freak physical gifts...

Murray’s troubles are simply too glaring to not point out. His throwing mechanics are amateurish. His inability to make, even moderate level pre and post-snap reads is alarming. His clear unwillingness to remain in the pocket, slide in the pocket, step up in the pocket to make “that read” and “that throw” are even more alarming.
And perhaps most concerning of all is what appears to be mounting evidence of a serious lack of leadership qualities. His remaining on the ground after being “gently” smacked on the last play of the 9er game, and then refusing to give a post game presser, are loud warning sirens.

If I were a betting man, I put the odds of Murray sticking in the NFL at very low levels... I am that concerned by what I’ve seen.
Hope I’m wrong...

 

[Veer]

This. Kyler getting himself out of situations with his legs that he created because he can't read defences, doesn't recognize blitz and doesn't go through his reads isn't "hero ball".

Reading the whole field, recognizing blitzes and going through multiple reads isn't something the vast majority of seasoned franchise QBs had from the start. It develops over years. Maybe Kyler will never be the best full field reader or protection caller, but what he can create with his legs is what makes him special. It's very unfortunate that his running ability is often kinda held against him in here. It's a big bonus, not a burden. Take away the running from Lamar Jackson, Kyler Murray beats him by miles as a pure passer. Kyler is already in the top 15 or top 12 of NFL QBs. Probably top 10 if you make a league-wide poll. Once the game slows even more down, he matures in game management, and is calm enough to find receivers on the run, he will be in the elite QB tier for years.

 

[Russ Smith]

I remember being on the old boards and if you dared to say the slightest thing negative about Jake Plummer you got slaughtered. I found that out when I mentioned after a season opener that his 3 or 4 turnovers killed our chances to win.

Compare that to Kyler. Some of you have been here long enough to know what I am saying is true.

I literally had Plummer fans plotting to get me banned from one of those boards ages ago because I was probably the most outspoken guy pointing out the reason he had so many comebacks is he consistently played so poorly in the first half of games.

That said Jake is a good argument here too, while he wasn't elite, playing for a great coach in Shanahan turned him into a very effective QB. In the end Shanahan decided he was never going to win a SB with Jake and moved on, but it DID prove that coaching was important. Of course one of the main things we learned after Jake left for Denver is how little he actually did to get better in ARizona, never went to the voluntary off season stuff. Kyler didn't have that this year due to Covid it'll be very important to his future that he does that work now when he's 23 and doesn't wait until later in his career like Jake did.

 

[Veer]

I don’t see anything wrong with calling out the glaring concerns we might have with Murray.
Personally, I refuse to place blame on coaching... I mean, this is the NFL and be it on the Cards staff or elsewhere, Murray has the means to receive all of the most appropriate coaching available to a young QB.

Murray’s insane physical gifts don’t even need to be mentioned any longer. They are that evident and that “next-level.” But as you correctly pointed out, there are loads of failed NFL QB’s who possessed freak physical gifts...

Murray’s troubles are simply too glaring to not point out. His throwing mechanics are amateurish. His inability to make, even moderate level pre and post-snap reads is alarming. His clear unwillingness to remain in the pocket, slide in the pocket, step up in the pocket to make “that read” and “that throw” are even more alarming.
And perhaps most concerning of all is what appears to be mounting evidence of a serious lack of leadership qualities. His remaining on the ground after being “gently” smacked on the last play of the 9er game, and then refusing to give a post game presser, are loud warning sirens.

If I were a betting man, I put the odds of Murray sticking in the NFL at very low levels... I am that concerned by what I’ve seen.
Hope I’m wrong...

Your concerns have a point. Although the glass is certainly half-empty after recent performances. It can easily be half-full again a week from now. But what I put bold is something that I'm 100% sure doesn't warrant any warning sirens.

 

[Chopper0080]

I think there’s a lot of confusion and unintentional misrepresentation of positions on Murray. I do think it’s a little early to canonize him, but his potential is obviously outstanding. My concerns are more about the coaching and handling he’s receiving. Clearly he needs a better surrounding cast. I’ll take that up at a later time. However, he must bear some of the responsibility for his own development. He’s a superior athlete but that’s true of multiple failed QBs. I’m just saying I’m concerned about things I would expect to be seeing at least on a sporadic basis. Can he be a great QB? Yes. Is he now? No. I want to see a sustain effort on fundamental improvement. Then we’ll truly know what we have.

and I believe that it is Kyle's inconsistencies that make it tough to really evaluate the offensive scheme and some situational decisions.

A couple concerns of mine that I really don't know the answer to.

1-Is there are reason Kyler does not audible or utilize hot routes at that LOS? This is a very important aspect of playing QB and running a solid offense. Getting out of plays that the defense has the correct call for and into better plays is something every top QB does in the NFL. I feel like I have a guess about this, but I wish I knew.

2-Why does Kyler not set the protection? Maybe I am missing it but it seems like Cole is the one who I hear calling out the Mike and setting the protections.

3-Does Kyler call motion pre-snap? Or is that limited to a coaching or play decision. I have seen coaches do this two ways and I am really curious about this. Some coaches will design plays with pre-snnap motion and others will task their QB to determine how much pre-snap movement they want to try and identify coverage pre-snap.