Matt Flynn agrees with Seahawks

[Shane]

They were bidding against someone. They were bidding with Kolbs Agent. It doesn't matter one bit if no other teams were involved. To say they were bidding against no one is a fallacy, because they were bidding against a one year rental.

Maybe Flynn didn't get all that good of a deal because a very QB needy NFL was far, far skeptical of this kids ability. It isn't even a certainty that Flynn will be their starter. PFT alludes to much of this - http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/03/18/flynn-picks-the-seahawks/

I mean seriously, in a QB needy NFL all this so called next good QB could get was a 3 year deal worth 19 mill. The only way he could get up to 26 mill is if he meets incentives. Like you said this guy wasn't going to leave money on the table so if that is the best deal he could get, then what does that say about what the NFL thought of him.

Thanks Joe!

 

[Phrazbit]

Kolbs contract is irrelevant. Your just hate hime pure and simple and anyone who's post son here can clearly say that with the venom you spas his way everyday on this board. Length of contact can be a big deciding factor in a players choice. Especially if he feels he can land another MUCH bigger contract. In 3 years the cap is skyrocketing.

Kolb Had fantastic games against SF and ATL in 2010 and 2 more damn good games in 2009 against NO and KC. HE was highly though of by many more than just the Cards. That was widely known. The Cards were just the only ones that were desperate at the position and willing to give up as much as they did.

... people have been comparing the 2 for months, how is the contract Kolb got suddenly irreverent? The contract has a lot to do with it. And you honestly think the Dolphins were offering something like 6 years... 35 million? Youre reasonable, but that is a dumb argument. Money per year and guaranteed money is what decides these contracts. Who cares about length in the NFL without guaranteed contracts? Yes, I am shocked Miami didnt outbid 26 mil over 3 years. And it is a very strong condemnation on Kolb's idiotic contract.

And yes, I despise Kolb the player, the trade and the contract, but Im sure he is a nice person, I dont blame him at all for fleecing the team. In 1 year when he gets dumped by the Cardinals his 30 million down the tubes will arguably be the biggest waste in this franchises history.

Kolb's career numbers were medicore at best, he had far more bad showings that good ones and he had already had multiple injuries. That you try to toss his game against New Orleans as evidence of his talent is absurd. He sucked in that game.

Also, yes, the Cardinals were desperate, far more desperate than the ZERO other teams in trade negotiations with the Eagles. Making a trade out of desperation is not a good defense for the move, if anything it reflects very poor judgment.

 

[Mitch]

I find it hilarious that people continue to say that no one else was interested in Kolb. Before the lockout, there were several speculated teams that were interested. Since the only transactions that could be done during the lockout were draft picks, many teams, including Minnesota, Tennessee, Cincinnati, SF, and others chose to draft a QB in the first two rounds.

After the lockout, it was reported by PFT and Pat Kirwan that Seattle was also in the mix.

Who is saying that?

What you might be forgetting is that Kolb was under contract when he was traded for. There was NO reason whatsoever to throw millions his way, especially with the f-tag as a fall-back in year two.

The Cardinals had an opportunity to see what Kolb was made of for $1.4M last year. If he lit the world on fire you then do the deal---if he didn;t you still could negotiate a fair deal to have him stay in the mix to compete and prove himself. The Cardinals just had to pay an extra $7M to find this out after paying him in excess of $10M last year.

Why people don't get that is beyond me. The rest of the NFL took note of it, you can be assured of that.

 

[Phrazbit]

I find it hilarious that people continue to say that no one else was interested in Kolb. Before the lockout, there were several speculated teams that were interested. Since the only transactions that could be done during the lockout were draft picks, many teams, including Minnesota, Tennessee, Cincinnati, SF, and others chose to draft a QB in the first two rounds.

After the lockout, it was reported by PFT and Pat Kirwan that Seattle was also in the mix.

During the lockout almost all the teams you mentioned addressed QB during the draft. Then immediately after the lockout the Seahawks signed Tavaris...

So yes, even by your logic the Cardinals were bidding against themselves.

 

[overseascardfan]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7...eahawks-matt-flynn-reach-26m-deal-source-says

Man, the Dolphins are having a horrible off season.

Hopefully Manning goes to the Titans and Smith the Miami and then Flynn is a bust.

MIA having a horrible offseason, ARZ is right up there with them especially since we are in the same division with SEA.

 

[joeshmo]

Also, yes, the Cardinals were desperate, far more desperate than the ZERO other teams in trade negotiations with the Eagles. Making a trade out of desperation is not a good defense for the move, if anything it reflects very poor judgment.

Who said we were the only team?

No one even knew the 49ers were in the Manning sweepstakes for 5 days. And It would have been way easier to keep a call about Kolb quiet then the Manning ordeal.

 

[Phrazbit]

They were bidding against someone. They were bidding with Kolbs Agent. It doesn't matter one bit if no other teams were involved. To say they were bidding against no one is a fallacy, because they were bidding against a one year rental.

Maybe Flynn didn't get all that good of a deal because a very QB needy NFL was far, far skeptical of this kids ability. It isn't even a certainty that Flynn will be their starter. PFT alludes to much of this - http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/03/18/flynn-picks-the-seahawks/

I mean seriously, in a QB needy NFL all this so called next good QB could get was a 3 year deal worth 19 mill. The only way he could get up to 26 mill is if he meets incentives. Like you said this guy wasn't going to leave money on the table so if that is the best deal he could get, then what does that say about what the NFL thought of him. And if the NFL does think he will be the next good QB, then the Kolb deal means jack squat, because some team would have paid him more then 3 years 19 mill if they truly thought he was going to be the next good QB. There are many bad deals that get thrown around and it doesnt stop teams from throwing around the next bad deal every year.

This is exactly my point... I agree, that was the best deal Flynn could get. And you're right, teams make bad deals every year, like the Cards did with Kolb. That this is what Flynn was looking at while on the open market reflects very poorly on what the Cards gave Kolb to keep him off the market.

 

[Shane]

Who is saying that?

What you might be forgetting is that Kolb was under contract when he was traded for. There was NO reason whatsoever to throw millions his way, especially with the f-tag as a fall-back in year two.

The Cardinals had an opportunity to see what Kolb was made of for $1.4M last year. If he lit the world on fire you then do the deal---if he didn;t you still could negotiate a fair deal to have him stay in the mix to compete and prove himself. The Cardinals just had to pay an extra $7M to find this out after paying him in excess of $10M last year.

Why people don't get that is beyond me. The rest of the NFL took note of it, you can be assured of that.

Mitch thats asinine and you know it. You dont give up what we gave up without some guarantee of having the guy for a good length of time.

If the Cards had traded away what we did and didn't extend Kolb and he had tore it up this year you would be slamming them left and right for not extending him prior to the trade. You would continue slamming them for having to let CC walk because we needed to use the tag on our franchise QB.

 

[Phrazbit]

Who said we were the only team?

No one even knew the 49ers were in the Manning sweepstakes for 5 days. And It would have been way easier to keep a call about Kolb quiet then the Manning ordeal.

Common sense says we were the only team. Every other mentioned team had addressed their QB hole. Every team that was not rumored had a starter in place.

The Niners with Manning is a team with a hole at QB and they're pursuing a free agent. Very different than the idea of teams who have addressed their QB going and paying out the nose in a trade to get another.

 

[TJ]

Mitch thats asinine and you know it. You dont give up what we gave up without some guarantee of having the guy for a good length of time.

If the Cards had traded away what we did and didn't extend Kolb and he had tore it up this year you would be slamming them left and right for not extending him prior to the trade. You would continue slamming them for having to let CC walk because we needed to use the tag on our franchise QB.

I was just about to post the same exact thing. Kolb's value goes up exponentially if he has a great year. Thank God we had the franchise tag this year; otherwise, CC is already on another team.

It's the risk the organization needed to take seeing as it had the worst production from the QB position in 2010 and Kolb was the best option available at the time.

 

[joeshmo]

Anyways, we are debating nothing but speculation here.

Lets get to the real nitty gritty.

How horrible is Miami's sales pitch? They are turning into the red headed step child. Harbaugh, Fisher, Manning, and the one that hurts the most Flynn.

 

[Shane]

Anyways, we are debating nothing but speculation here.

Lets get to the real nitty gritty.

How horrible is Miami's sales pitch? They are turning into the red headed step child. Harbaugh, Fisher, Manning, and the one that hurts the most Flynn.

I hope Alex Smith goes there.

 

[TJ]

Anyways, we are debating nothing but speculation here.

Lets get to the real nitty gritty.

How horrible is Miami's sales pitch? They are turning into the red headed step child. Harbaugh, Fisher, Manning, and the one that hurts the most Flynn.

I don't think the Miami brass could sell insulin to a diabetic.

 

[Phrazbit]

I was just about to post the same exact thing. Kolb's value goes up exponentially if he has a great year. Thank God we had the franchise tag this year; otherwise, CC is already on another team.

It's the risk the organization needed to take seeing as it had the worst production from the QB position in 2010 and Kolb was the best option available at the time.

Very debatable.

And so instead of playing out the year and risking having to pay Kolb like a pro bowler... they went ahead and paid him like one anyway. Not sound logic.

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

I was just about to post the same exact thing. Kolb's value goes up exponentially if he has a great year. Thank God we had the franchise tag this year; otherwise, CC is already on another team.

It's the risk the organization needed to take seeing as it had the worst production from the QB position in 2010 and Kolb was the best option available at the time.

That is a huge IF.

 

[Mitch]

Mitch thats asinine and you know it. You dont give up what we gave up without some guarantee of having the guy for a good length of time.

If the Cards had traded away what we did and didn't extend Kolb and he had tore it up this year you would be slamming them left and right for not extending him prior to the trade. You would continue slamming them for having to let CC walk because we needed to use the tag on our franchise QB.

I was slamming them not for the trade but for the ridiculous contract...and I still will. It was a hope and a prayer deal for a player who hadn't proven himself as an everyday NFL QB. Which part of that do you not understand?

The reality is that as it turned out we wouldn't have needed the f-tag on Kolb. And we would have an added $20M+ to work with in FA this year, and we still could negotiate a fair deal with incentives for Kolb.

 

[Shane]

I was slamming them not for the trade but for the ridiculous contract...and I still will. It was a hope and a prayer deal for a player who hadn't proven himself as an everyday NFL QB. Which part of that do you not understand?

The reality is that as it turned out we wouldn't have needed the f-tag on Kolb. And we would have an added $20M+ to work with in FA this year, and we still could negotiate a fair deal with incentives for Kolb.

AND LIKE I SAID oops caps..if he went out and tore it up this last year you would be SLAMMING them hard for not having a franchise tag to use on CC and you know it. Your always looking for a way to slam them and that would have been your in.

 

[Broseph]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/7...eahawks-matt-flynn-reach-26m-deal-source-says

Man, the Dolphins are having a horrible off season.

Hopefully Manning goes to the Titans and Smith the Miami and then Flynn is a bust.

Wouldn't that be the **** dude?

 

[Phrazbit]

AND LIKE I SAID oops caps..if he went out and tore it up this last year you would be SLAMMING them hard for not having a franchise tag to use on CC and you know it. Your always looking for a way to slam them and that would have been your in.

Thats not a defense! They went out and paid him as though he had already gone out there and torn it up!!!

And he DIDNT tear it up. It was a dumb contract a year ago, it looks even stupider now. They could have kept him for beans, or they could have let him walk and been done with the mistake!

 

[Mitch]

AND LIKE I SAID oops caps..if he went out and tore it up this last year you would be SLAMMING them hard for not having a franchise tag to use on CC and you know it. Your always looking for a way to slam them and that would have been your in.

Did it ever occur to you that the FO could have then made the necessary offer to Kolb or CC before using the tag on one of them?

Your logic is weak in this argument. I already told you I was slamming them for the contract---I would not have been slamming them for making that same deal one year later, if as you suggest, Kolb teared it up. Then he would have been proven. And I believe that the FO would have been wise enough to come to terms with CC if it had to use the f-tag on Kolb. They would have had an added $20M+ at their disposal to do so. Think about it.

 

[TJ]

Did it ever occur to you that the FO could have then made the necessary offer to Kolb or CC before using the tag on one of them?

Your logic is weak in this argument. I already told you I was slamming them for the contract---I would not have been slamming them for making that same deal one year later, if as you suggest, Kolb teared it up. Then he would have been proven. And I believe that the FO would have been wise enough to come to terms with CC if it had to use the f-tag on Kolb. They would have had an added $20M+ at their disposal to do so. Think about it.

I don't get it. In one breath you're saying the organization was silly for giving Kolb the contract he got; yet, saying the FO would have been "wise enough" to come to terms with CC? Truth be told, a CC extension does not happen whether or not Kolb is under contract. I contend if Kolb had a great year, he would have gotten the tag and CC is on his way out of town.

 

[Phrazbit]

I don't get it. In one breath you're saying the organization was silly for giving Kolb the contract he got; yet, saying the FO would have been "wise enough" to come to terms with CC? Truth be told, a CC extension does not happen whether or not Kolb is under contract. I contend if Kolb had a great year, he would have gotten the tag and CC is on his way out of town.

... why? This argument is completely inane.

If Kolb has a good year they can pay him JUST LIKE THEY DID!!! They still have a franchise tag for CC.

And what would you even call this kind of argument? Anti-hindsight? The deal was dumb a year ago, its worse now. To claim "It would have been good if he didnt suck" isnt an argument, its insanity.

 

[azsportsfan01]

Guess who has the most passing yards in a single game in Packers history?

The most passing TD's in a single game in Packers history?

Matt Flynn. 480 and 6.

Small sample size I know, but I was very impressed when I saw him play. The Hags just got better.

Guess who has the most RBI in a game in MLB history. Mark Whiten.

If baseball isn't your thing how about the most passing yards in a game in the history of the NFL? Norm Van Brocklin. Most passing TDs? Adrian Burk. I don't think people were knocking down their doors to make them their QB of the future.

This is just a stupid example and I can't believe anyone would use this as a serious way to make their point.

 

[Mitch]

I don't get it. In one breath you're saying the organization was silly for giving Kolb the contract he got; yet, saying the FO would have been "wise enough" to come to terms with CC? Truth be told, a CC extension does not happen whether or not Kolb is under contract. I contend if Kolb had a great year, he would have gotten the tag and CC is on his way out of town.

Your point is totally moot. Obviously, there's NO way Kolb earned an f-tag with his performance last year. If you lose him at least you still have the millions saved and the Cardinals might have gotten Mario Williams with that money instead.

 

[40yearfan]

Thats not a defense! They went out and paid him as though he had already gone out there and torn it up!!!

And he DIDNT tear it up. It was a dumb contract a year ago, it looks even stupider now. They could have kept him for beans, or they could have let him walk and been done with the mistake!

Yes it is a defense and Shane is entirely right. If Kolb had only been signed for one year and had a good year, you would be all over the FO for not having the foresight to sign him to a multi-year contract.

You have no idea whether anyone else was bidding for Kolb's services, but it makes for a better argument if they weren't, so you assume to the negative. It just drives me nuts that people use hindsight to propel an argument and never stop to realize that that hindsight wasn't available at the time the agreement was proposed.

Did the Cards make a mistake? The jury is still out, but we should know a few games into the season. How about waiting until it is proved either way before you pass judgement?