Suns updates and discussion for the 2019-20 season

[Mainstreet]

Alex Caruso... really?


Kellan Olson‏Verified account @KellanOlson

Devin Booker has jumped to 8th among Western Conference guards in All-Star voting. He's up to 381,071 votes, now trailing Alex Caruso by 147,175.

11:03 AM - 9 Jan 2020

 

[WildBB]

Alex Caruso... really?


Kellan Olson‏Verified account @KellanOlson

Devin Booker has jumped to 8th among Western Conference guards in All-Star voting. He's up to 381,071 votes, now trailing Alex Caruso by 147,175.

11:03 AM - 9 Jan 2020

But really he needs to only concentrate on W's for this team. Which is what he says he wants to do. Let's get the W's. We need more than just his scoring, but I give him credit for that for most of the time.

 

[Raindog]

Alex Caruso... really?

11:03 AM - 9 Jan 2020

Alex Caruso is having a breakout year - averaging 9 points and over 3 assists. He has emerged as one of the NBA's top 250 players this year, if not the top 240.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

Alex Caruso is having a breakout year - averaging 9 points and over 3 assists. He has emerged as one of the NBA's top 250 players this year, if not the top 240.

It's actually 5 points and 2 assists, but he is single handedly carrying the end of their bench and that CAN NOT be overlooked..

 

[Phrazbit]

And the Suns are over the cap due to the deals for Booker, Oubre and Rubio, so not all of the number for Tyler Johnson's contract will be available to sign free agents. A trade before the NBA year is over is the only option to get a player for at least $19 million with Tyler's cap space.

No. They're going to be around 25 million under the cap this summer if they sit on Johnson's contract.

 

[1Sun]

No. They're going to be around 25 million under the cap this summer if they sit on Johnson's contract.

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/phoenix-suns/cap/

Think again.

The Suns are currently $11,719,344 over the cap.

For next year, the Suns have $91,769,395 already committed for a $116,000,000 cap.

They would have to renounce Saric, Baynes, Carter and Harper, in addition to Tyler Johnson, just to get to $24,230,605.

 

[95pro]

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/phoenix-suns/cap/

Think again.

The Suns are currently $11,719,344 over the cap.

For next year, the Suns have $91,769,395 already committed for a $116,000,000 cap.

They would have to renounce Saric, Baynes, Carter and Harper, in addition to Tyler Johnson, just to get to $24,230,605.

well the rest you mentioned are only with us for this year i think

 

[Phrazbit]

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/phoenix-suns/cap/

Think again.

The Suns are currently $11,719,344 over the cap.

For next year, the Suns have $91,769,395 already committed for a $116,000,000 cap.

They would have to renounce Saric, Baynes, Carter and Harper, in addition to Tyler Johnson, just to get to $24,230,605.

So.... they do what they will obviously do and they will get to the exact number I stated...

Think again...?

In addition, Kamanski's contract is a team option, so they can get to 30 million under.

So...

I guess, yeah, "think again."

 

[1Sun]

So.... they do what they will obviously do and they will get to the exact number I stated...

Think again...?

In addition, Kamanski's contract is a team option, so they can get to 30 million under.

So...

I guess, yeah, "think again."

They already can't get to the number you stated unless they also renounce Kaminsky, and they still need the room for their lottery pick, unless they trade it away, which based on 2019 numbers (meaning it will be slightly more than this) means $3.285 million to $9.757 already committed.

And that's also not factoring in that there will be a lot more than 1 roster spot to fill.

And yet you accuse me of fudging facts to suit my agenda. Project much?...

 

[Phrazbit]

They already can't get to the number you stated unless they also renounce Kaminsky, and they still need the room for their lottery pick, unless they trade it away, which based on 2019 numbers (meaning it will be slightly more than this) means $3.285 million to $9.757 already committed.

And that's also not factoring in that there will be a lot more than 1 roster spot to fill.

And yet you accuse me of fudging facts to suit my agenda. Project much?...

Seriously... the number is virtually exactly what I ball parked and that is BEFORE they renounce Kaminsky, which seems like something they'll obviously do.

You trying to dig your feet in on this number is ridiculous, even by your standards.

I said they'd be around 25 million under... even by your math, it comes out to 30-20 million under.

Before I corrected you, you were claiming they'd be OVER the cap...

So...

Think again...?

Go fudge some more numbers.

 

[1Sun]

Seriously... the number is virtually exactly what I ball parked and that is BEFORE they renounce Kaminsky, which seems like something they'll obviously do.

You trying to dig your feet in on this number is ridiculous, even by your standards.

I said they'd be around 25 million under... even by your math, it comes out to 30-20 million under.

Before I corrected you, you were claiming they'd be OVER the cap...

So...

Think again...?

Go fudge some more numbers.

They ARE over the cap. At the end of the season, they will have to pare down their roster by renouncing players just to get under the cap. And even if they renounce everyone and trade away their lottery pick, they still have less than $30 million to fill at least 6 roster spots. Look at the bloody link. The facts are right there for you to see.

 

[Phrazbit]

They ARE over the cap. At the end of the season, they will have to pare down their roster by renouncing players just to get under the cap. And even if they renounce everyone and trade away their lottery pick, they still have less than $30 million to fill at least 6 roster spots. Look at the bloody link. The facts are right there for you to see.

Good lord... I know they are, I looked at the facts before I corrected you.

Thank you for confirming virtually the exact number I quoted.

Take a breath.

 

[1Sun]

Good lord... I know they are, I looked at the facts before I corrected you.

Thank you for confirming virtually the exact number I quoted.

Take a breath.

Not virtually the exact number, and in quoting your not exact number, you failed to disclose that to get to that number the Suns would have to renounce an additional $25,254,008 in contracts, plus their first round draft slot, in addition to renouncing Tyler Johnson, just to get to that less than $25,000,000. Even if we now factor in cutting Kaminsky and his $5,005,350 cap number, which you only brought up after I called you out on your inaccuracy, that still leaves you over $20 million off in your statement.

Not virtually exact at all...

 

[Cheesebeef]

this fight is boring.

 

[1Sun]

this fight is boring.

I just don't like being accused of fudging facts by someone who is knowingly or deliberately over $20 million off in the numbers he/she presents.

 

[Phrazbit]

Not virtually the exact number, and in quoting your not exact number, you failed to disclose that to get to that number the Suns would have to renounce an additional $25,254,008 in contracts, plus their first round draft slot, in addition to renouncing Tyler Johnson, just to get to that less than $25,000,000. Even if we now factor in cutting Kaminsky and his $5,005,350 cap number, which you only brought up after I called you out on your inaccuracy, that still leaves you over $20 million off in your statement.

Not virtually exact at all...

So... they renounce the rights to a bunch of guys that we know they're going to renounce. That your factoring in that they will need to renounce Tyler Johnson shows how dramatic this straw grasping is.

Are you arguing just to argue?

This is sad.

this fight is boring.

Also boring.

 

[Phrazbit]

I just don't like being accused of fudging facts by someone who is knowingly or deliberately over $20 million off in the numbers he/she presents.

You were the one who started the fact fudging accusation... my original response was merely a correction.

Then you went all buck wild with histrionics... claimed I was fact fudging... you proceeded to confirm the accuracy of what I said... while simultaneously claiming it showed your were right and I was wrong.

All in all... this is a stupid argument.

Moving on.

 

[1Sun]

So... they renounce the rights to a bunch of guys that we know they're going to renounce. That your factoring in that they will need to renounce Tyler Johnson shows how dramatic this straw grasping is.

Are you arguing just to argue?

This is sad.



Also boring.

Really? We know they're going to renounce Saric AND Baynes? Because several on this board, including you, have chastised me for saying that both are gone after this year. And that's $10 million each right there.

Carter as well? I have heard nobody speculating that he's gone, and he's the closest thing we currently have to a point guard of the future.

And even still, these are facts you knowingly or intentionally omitted in your numbers in order to call my numbers fake.

At this point, I am arguing as a matter of principle. The numbers from both your initial post and your follow post are way off. Either admit your error, or admit that you, not I, are the one fudging facts for an agenda.

 

[Phrazbit]

Really? We know they're going to renounce Saric AND Baynes? Because several on this board, including you, have chastised me for saying that both are gone after this year. And that's $10 million each right there.

Carter as well? I have heard nobody speculating that he's gone, and he's the closest thing we currently have to a point guard of the future.

And even still, these are facts you knowingly or intentionally omitted in your numbers in order to call my numbers fake.

At this point, I am arguing as a matter of principle. The numbers from both your initial post and your follow post are way off. Either admit your error, or admit that you, not I, are the one fudging facts for an agenda.

I chastised you for saying it was going to cost a fortune to keep Baynes, I argued the potential cost... I feel pretty vindicated on that point.

And your numbers confirmed my numbers... yelling about me for not accounting for cap holds on guys that they obviously will not care about the rights to is just... inane. You accuse me of having an agenda when your argument involves me not factoring stuff like Tyler Johnson's cap hold. The hypocrisy is astounding.

Again... ignoring all this utter non-sense...

My original post said they'd be around 25 million under the cap, even you have stated how obviously that figure can landed upon.

Your argument here is... astounding.

 

[1Sun]

I chastised you for saying it was going to cost a fortune to keep Baynes, I argued the potential cost... I feel pretty vindicated on that point.

And your numbers confirmed my numbers... yelling about me for not accounting for cap holds on guys that they obviously will not care about the rights to is just... inane. You accuse me of having an agenda when your argument involves me not factoring stuff like Tyler Johnson's cap hold. The hypocrisy is astounding.

Again... ignoring all this utter non-sense...

My original post said they'd be around 25 million under the cap, even you have stated how obviously that figure can landed upon.

Your argument here is... astounding.

For the record, and to present the TRUE facts, that's $24.4 million ONLY IF ALL of Tyler Johnson, Baynes, Saric, Carter and Harper are renounced, plus an additional $5 million if Kaminsky is also cut, MINUS the cap hold for the first round lottery pick, which the Suns will have to fill at least 6 and up to 8 roster spots (with only Rubio, Booker, Bridges, Ty Jerome, Lecque, Oubre and Ayton left on the roster), with approximately $1 million required to be held for each remaining open roster spot after filling the minimum required spots (as is currently demonstrated as a cap hold).

The point to this whole debate is that the Suns are far better off acquiring players in a trade of Tyler Johnson than just letting his contract lapse and using the corresponding space (or, rather, lack thereof) to sign free agents.

 

[Phrazbit]

For the record, and to present the TRUE facts, that's $24.4 million ONLY IF ALL of Tyler Johnson, Baynes, Saric, Carter and Harper are renounced, plus an additional $5 million if Kaminsky is also cut, MINUS the cap hold for the first round lottery pick, which the Suns will have to fill at least 6 and up to 8 roster spots (with only Rubio, Booker, Bridges, Ty Jerome, Lecque, Oubre and Ayton left on the roster), with approximately $1 million required to be held for each remaining open roster spot after filling the minimum required spots (as is currently demonstrated as a cap hold).

The point to this whole debate is that the Suns are far better off acquiring players in a trade of Tyler Johnson than just letting his contract lapse and using the corresponding space (or, rather, lack thereof) to sign free agents.

lol...

Thank you for confirming what I originally said.

I hope your hissy fit over the "TRUE FACTS" of some cap holds, at rates that will obviously be declined, was worth it.

 

[Phrazbit]

One more note.

The way cap holds work... they don't matter at all anyway when it comes to pursuing free agents. It's just a hold that can be renounced whenever. They can hold onto Saric or Baynes or Tyler Johnson's bird rights right up until the moment we reach a deal with a free agent, then waive those rights.

So... again confirming the stupidity of this argument.

 

[1Sun]

One more note.

The way cap holds work... they don't matter at all anyway when it comes to pursuing free agents. It's just a hold that can be renounced whenever. They can hold onto Saric or Baynes or Tyler Johnson's bird rights right up until the moment we reach a deal with a free agent, then waive those rights.

So... again confirming the stupidity of this argument.

And in the end, the MAXIMUM amount the Suns will have to fill 6-8 spots (not counting minimum signings and the MLE) is likely to be less than $20 million.

 

[Phrazbit]

And in the end, the MAXIMUM amount the Suns will have to fill 6-8 spots (not counting minimum signings and the MLE) is likely to be less than $20 million.

They can easily make it over 25 million just by dumping Kaminsky... which seems rather obvious.

Also... lol.... the E in MLE stands for exemption.

Just stop on this one... it is so freaking stupid.

 

[1Sun]

They can easily make it over 25 million just by dumping Kaminsky... which seems rather obvious.

Also... lol.... the E in MLE stands for exemption.

Which leaves the remaining amount to fill 5-7 remaining roster spots instead of 6-8. And that doesn't count the 3, possibly 4, roster spots already taken up by players who don't belong in the NBA.

Trades are the only way to get this team out of this mess.