Suns open Las Vegas Summer League August 8th, 2021

[Phrazbit]

A decision was made not to play Jalen Smith as he reportedly got what he needed out of summer league play. He wasn't hurt. It doesn't eliminate your question though.

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I feel like this conversation happens every year. Notable players get the end of summer league off all the time.

I suspect fans put far more weight on Summer League than the franchises.

 

[Mainstreet]

I feel like this conversation happens every year. Notable players get the end of summer league off all the time.

I suspect fans put far more weight on Summer League than the franchises.

This may be true for "notable players" but I'm sure there are still some players looking for two-way contracts.

 

[Hoop Head]

I find it a little odd that Stix didn't play in a game against a team he's been linked to in trade talks. Not that it means much but it's interesting.

 

[Mainstreet]

I understand the DeMar DeRozan trade is complete and Thaddeus Young was traded to the Spurs.

The other mentioned trade rumor is Larry Nance Jr. but I'm not sure how that trade gets done with the difference in salries between Jalen Smith and Nance Jr.

 

[Mainstreet]

If the Suns are looking to fill their second two-way spot I hope they give Kyle Alexander a strong look.


By Kellan Olson, Arizona Sports:

Center Kyle Alexander had arguably the best performance of any Summer Sun in Vegas, finishing with 18 points, 14 rebounds and three blocks on 8-of-12 shooting. He said after Saturday’s win that the Suns’ style of basketball is the most fun way to play, and you could see that rubbing off on him in a positive way.


“He just cares,” Randle said of Alexander’s play in Vegas. “There are guys that just care about the game. Everybody has a different reason for playing, a different need for playing, and I think Kyle just loves the game and he gives up himself.”

Suns wrap up Summer League play in Las Vegas with loss to Cavaliers

Suns basketball will now be on hiatus. The team's Summer League squad played its finale in Las Vegas, falling to the Cavaliers 88-85.

arizonasports.com

 

[AzStevenCal]

If the Suns are looking to fill their second two-way spot I hope they give Kyle Alexander a strong look.

I think he's worth signing (cheaply) but I don't know how the 2 way contracts work. Can a player be signed to a 2 way more than once? From what I've read about him he was previously on a 2 way with Miami until a knee injury.

 

[Hoop Head]

@AzStevenCal a player can only be on a two-way contract for 2 years so if he was on one previously for a year then we can sign him to another for 1 year.

I can't recall how NBA experience meshes with that. I believe a player can't sign a two-way deal after they accumulate 3 years of service in the NBA.

There were a lot of changes made last season to Two Way deals and I'm not sure what will be kept and what will be rolled back but I'm fairly certain a player can't be on a Two Way deal for longer than 2 years.

 

[Hoop Head]

I understand the DeMar DeRozan trade is complete and Thaddeus Young was traded to the Spurs.

The other mentioned trade rumor is Larry Nance Jr. but I'm not sure how that trade gets done with the difference in salries between Jalen Smith and Nance Jr.

Both deals, for Nance or Young, would have the Suns sending Stix out with Saric. Saric more for salary matching purposes. Stix's salary doesn't come close to matching either of theirs so more needs to be added and Saric won't be available for us, which is why he's been included in trade rumors.

Also we can't trade him after applying for the DPE, which is a reason the Suns haven't done so.

 

[Hoop Head]

@AzStevenCal I found a little more info. Apparently any player can sign a two-way contract provided they have less than 4 years experience in the NBA. A two-way deal can't be for more than 2 years. So apparently a player can sign 2 deals for 2 years each, if they chose. The 4 year experience is the main cap that cuts them off. If a player has 3 years experience then they could only sign a 1 year Two-way deal. They can't exceed that.

Found most info here but I used some other sites also to gather that info.

NBA G League 101: Two-Way Contracts - The GLeague

Beginning in the 2017 offseason, NBA rosters expanded from 15 to 17 players with the addition of two spots for players under “Two-Way Contracts.” NBA teams may have up to two players under NBA Two-Way Contracts who will spend the bulk of the season in the NBA G League and not more than 45 days […]

gleague.nba.com

 

[Mainstreet]

@AzStevenCal a player can only be on a two-way contract for 2 years so if he was on one previously for a year then we can sign him to another for 1 year.

I can't recall how NBA experience meshes with that. I believe a player can't sign a two-way deal after they accumulate 3 years of service in the NBA.

There were a lot of changes made last season to Two Way deals and I'm not sure what will be kept and what will be rolled back but I'm fairly certain a player can't be on a Two Way deal for longer than 2 years.

I read a couple of articles where it indicated that Kyle Alexander would be eligible for a two-way spot so I mentioned it. Your research seems to support it.

From his play in summer league I was suggesting who else might be worth such a contract. He only played two games for the Heat.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I read a couple of articles where it indicated that Kyle Alexander would be eligible for a two-way spot so I mentioned it. Your research seems to support it.

From his play in summer league I was suggesting who else might be worth such a contract. He only played two games for the Heat.

Yeah I hadn't bothered to find anything out about the rules on 2 way contracts, just raised the question. From what HH posted it looks like he's eligible, hopefully we'll have interest.

I didn't get into the articles enough to see how their 2 way counts towards NBA tenure - is it based solely on the games they are up with the big club or does a season on a two way count as one NBA season?

 

[Mainstreet]

Both deals, for Nance or Young, would have the Suns sending Stix out with Saric. Saric more for salary matching purposes. Stix's salary doesn't come close to matching either of theirs so more needs to be added and Saric won't be available for us, which is why he's been included in trade rumors.

Also we can't trade him after applying for the DPE, which is a reason the Suns haven't done so.

I can't see why the Cavaliers trade Nance Jr. for Saric (out) and Smith without wanting further compensation. The Suns giving up additional assets doesn't seem to make a lot of sense to me.

I don't recall the Suns announcing they have applied for a DPE for Saric. There is no downside although it is rarely used.

 

[Mainstreet]

Yeah I hadn't bothered to find anything out about the rules on 2 way contracts, just raised the question. From what HH posted it looks like he's eligible, hopefully we'll have interest.

I didn't get into the articles enough to see how their 2 way counts towards NBA tenure - is it based solely on the games they are up with the big club or does a season on a two way count as one NBA season?

Kyle Alexander played solid for the summer Suns but there might be other players of interest to them that might be released from other teams if they decide to add a two-way contract.

Last season he would have been an even more tempting option.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I don't know if I can learn anything from summer league anymore. It seems to have little relevance to real NBA basketball.

 

[Hoop Head]

Yeah I hadn't bothered to find anything out about the rules on 2 way contracts, just raised the question. From what HH posted it looks like he's eligible, hopefully we'll have interest.

I didn't get into the articles enough to see how their 2 way counts towards NBA tenure - is it based solely on the games they are up with the big club or does a season on a two way count as one NBA season?

One season under a Two-Way deal counts as one season in the NBA. Regardless of what sort of deal they sign, it could be a 10 day contract, appearing on a league roster during the season makes that season count as a years experience.

 

[Hoop Head]

I can't see why the Cavaliers trade Nance Jr. for Saric (out) and Smith without wanting further compensation. The Suns giving up additional assets doesn't seem to make a lot of sense to me.

I don't recall the Suns announcing they have applied for a DPE for Saric. There is no downside although it is rarely used.

The downside to the DPE is they can't trade Saric all season. So it limits them in trade talks.

I know Saric has no real value this year but his salary would need to be added to Stix deal if they hope to get a veteran. In Nance Jr's case, he wants out of Cleveland and he has another year of salary on his deal, which matches Saric's as far as guaranteed length.

 

[Mainstreet]

The downside to the DPE is they can't trade Saric all season. So it limits them in trade talks.

I know Saric has no real value this year but his salary would need to be added to Stix deal if they hope to get a veteran. In Nance Jr's case, he wants out of Cleveland and he has another year of salary on his deal, which matches Saric's as far as guaranteed length.

I really think the Suns don't plan to use the DPE so maybe it's better not to apply for it now.

Actually it may not matter if the Suns apply as long as they don't use it. If Saric is traded the other team can't use it.

 

[GatorAZ]

I don't know if I can learn anything from summer league anymore. It seems to have little relevance to real NBA basketball.

Can’t believe this went 22 pages. Literally nothing interesting happened.

 

[Hoop Head]

Can’t believe this went 22 pages. Literally nothing interesting happened.

To be fair I'd say half the discussion has been talk about trading Stix.

 

[Mainstreet]

To be fair I'd say half the discussion has been talk about trading Stix.

Do we know if Ty-Shon Alexander is still on a two-way contract this upcoming season?

It seems to be the assumption but wouldn't the Suns have to do a new contract unless there is a team option for a second season but the Suns would still have to pick up the option.

 

[Hoop Head]

Do we know if Ty-Shon Alexander is still on a two-way contract this upcoming season?

It seems to be the assumption but wouldn't the Suns have to do a new contract unless there is a team option for a second season but the Suns would still have to pick up the option.

From what I could find he apparently signed a 2 year Two Way contract before last season so he should be returning.

 

[Phrazbit]

Summer League is a glorified, extended try out session that happens to be televised.

 

[Yuma]

I know for Summer League and G League, I basically divide stats in 40% to 50% to try and make them equivalent to NBA stats. Like if a guy scores 20 and grabs 10 boards, I figure maybe that's 8-10 points and 4-5 boards. I kinda figure that may be where Stix' game is right now if you apply that formula to his Summer League averages: In four games, Smith averaged a league-best 12.5 rebounds with 16.3 points. Using my Summer League guess numbers: 6.52 to 8.15 points and 5 to 6.25 rebounds.

 

[Phrazbit]

I know for Summer League and G League, I basically divide stats in 40% to 50% to try and make them equivalent to NBA stats. Like if a guy scores 20 and grabs 10 boards, I figure maybe that's 8-10 points and 4-5 boards. I kinda figure that may be where Stix' game is right now if you apply that formula to his Summer League averages: In four games, Smith averaged a league-best 12.5 rebounds with 16.3 points. Using my Summer League guess numbers: 6.52 to 8.15 points and 5 to 6.25 rebounds.

Nah, I don't think there is any way to make the numbers translate at all. Routinely there are guys who light up the Summer league and come even the preseason reveal themselves to be totally unworthy of NBA level play. (Dionte Christmas)

It's a bunch of guys who, literally, just met a few days before their first game, most of whom will never see an NBA minute.

All you can really look for is guys to not embarrass themselves, that is a red flag.

 

[Mainstreet]

Jalen Smith makes All-Summer League First Team.

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