Seattle Pacific

[Gaddabout]

Freakin' A! What happened?

 

[ozzfloyd]

Too much youth and no serviceable center...

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

I know ASU fans are furiously tossing off over this but in reality this happens every now and then. 'Cuse lost against someone named Le Moyne in 2009 and ended up winning the Big East. Hell we probably should've lost to NAU last year. But we'll still beat ASU twice and go to the NCAA's. This is probably exactly what Sean Miller needs to get this team straightened out.

 

[Gaddabout]

That must've been one checked out squad. UA is the Pac's only hope for a decent tourney run this year. Hope you're right, Mao.

 

[Russ Smith]

I know ASU fans are furiously tossing off over this but in reality this happens every now and then. 'Cuse lost against someone named Le Moyne in 2009 and ended up winning the Big East. Hell we probably should've lost to NAU last year. But we'll still beat ASU twice and go to the NCAA's. This is probably exactly what Sean Miller needs to get this team straightened out.

yes and no, UA hadn't lost an exhibition since 1983 so 28 years is a long time between this happening.

UCLA nearly lost to Concordia in their first exhibition a couple of years ago and then had a horrible season. I don't think UA is going to do that and obviously not having Parrom exacerbated the situation but the concern would be your veteran guys weren't good enough to pull you through. Nick played great looked much better than I expected, Turner was hit and miss, Sidiki and Chol up and down, Chol looks overmatched right now just not strong enough inside but Poling is a D1 player.

But the concern would be the guys who've been there before didn't do much either.

I haven't seen a boxscore yet I missed large chunks of the game but what I saw looked like a team that's just not put in enough offense yet and was too easy to defend. Miller said the other day the freshmen only know 4 plays and that showed.

UA will get a lot better and it's a wakeup call but you gotta have some concerns about the interior, UA looked so small against SPU.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

That must've been one checked out squad. UA is the Pac's only hope for a decent tourney run this year. Hope you're right, Mao.

UCLA has a good shot if their backcourt plays well, maybe Cal too.

We obviously need Parrom on the boards and on defense to do anything significant this year so he will greatly help because our frontcourt either isn't good or isn't ready. I've seen enough of Josiah and Nick Johnson to know that they will both be terrific players. Turner is extremely fast just needs to be more assertive but that will come with time.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

I don't think UA is going to do that and obviously not having Parrom exacerbated the situation but the concern would be your veteran guys weren't good enough to pull you through.

With the exception of Solo Hill the veteran guys are either downright bad (Kyryl, Jacobsen) or just okay and are on the roster due to being recruited at a time when the program simply needed bodies due to missing recruiting years with the Lute fiasco (Perry, Fogg, Lavender). Last night was basically Hill and a bunch of freshman since Mayes, Fogg, and Perry played so poorly and when that happens this early in a season it will always be tough to win against anybody. KP coming back will help where we needed it last night - on the boards and playing defense. And the frosh will obviously get better as the year goes on. Just hope he can get back before Florida.

 

[Russ Smith]

With the exception of Solo Hill the veteran guys are either downright bad (Kyryl, Jacobsen) or just okay and are on the roster due to being recruited at a time when the program simply needed bodies due to missing recruiting years with the Lute fiasco (Perry, Fogg, Lavender). Last night was basically Hill and a bunch of freshman since Mayes, Fogg, and Perry played so poorly and when that happens this early in a season it will always be tough to win against anybody. KP coming back will help where we needed it last night - on the boards and playing defense. And the frosh will obviously get better as the year goes on. Just hope he can get back before Florida.

I guess the rebounds was 29-20 SPU, hard to run when you can't rebound.

I missed much of the first half so when I watched UA was already playing a bit scared because they knew they didn't want to be the team that lost an exhibition, and with that many young guys that's a tough thing to do.

nick was impressive I always thought he was an early developer that would be a good not great college player but so far the exhibition and last night I underrated him. Better shooter than I thought I expected even with his hops he'd have trouble getting that shot off in college but his release is quicker and he gets so high on the shot. Didn't see a ton of Turner what I did see is what I expected, great passer, goes for steals all the time on defense, needs work on jumpshot but will eventually be a terrific player.

Chol I don't know he's looked very raw both times now, I hadn't seen Sidiki until the scrimmage he's way ahead of Chol right now.

I guess UCLA beat Fullerton they're not allowed to say but Ben said they didn't outplay us. As you said guard play is the key.

They have some injuries too Stover subluxed his left shoulder could be weeks if not longer they don't know. That puts T Wear as backup C and lane in the mix at 4 and 5 but Lane has apparently been having stomach problems and had to have an endoscopy that didn't show what the problem was. So he's apparently behind in his conditioning and strength.

 

[AzStevenCal]

That must've been one checked out squad. UA is the Pac's only hope for a decent tourney run this year. Hope you're right, Mao.

In addition to the other teams mentioned, Washington has a lot of talent and I wouldn't write them off just yet either. And for a lower division team, Seattle Pacific can be a handful. Also, until the Freshman learn Miller's system, this Cats team will struggle against most foes. Momo wasn't perfect but he was often a catalyst and there is nothing close to a replacement on this team for Williams. When they trotted out Perry and Kyryl as starters, I'm sure more than a few Cat fans cringed.

Steve

 

[ASUCHRIS]

I know ASU fans are furiously tossing off over this .

Why? Who cares? The only thing less interesting than regular season college hoops is college exhibition games. Wake me up in March. (Obligatory ASU won't be there comment preempted)

 

[AzStevenCal]

Why? Who cares? The only thing less interesting than regular season college hoops is college exhibition games. Wake me up in March. (Obligatory ASU won't be there comment preempted)

I take it you don't care much for college basketball. For me, it's the only sport that I can watch just about any 2 teams play and still enjoy it. March Madness has done a lot to raise the overall profile of college basketball but it's also taken it a bit down the NBA path where people start thinking that nothing matters until tourney time. That's too bad because there is a lot of great basketball to watch all season long. Especially now as the NBA is still in shutdown and Suns fans are still stuck with Sarver.

Steve

 

[ASUCHRIS]

I take it you don't care much for college basketball. For me, it's the only sport that I can watch just about any 2 teams play and still enjoy it. March Madness has done a lot to raise the overall profile of college basketball but it's also taken it a bit down the NBA path where people start thinking that nothing matters until tourney time. That's too bad because there is a lot of great basketball to watch all season long. Especially now as the NBA is still in shutdown and Suns fans are still stuck with Sarver.

Steve

Yeah, you're more enamored than I am with it. College basketball ranks behind NBA, NFL, College Football and Baseball for me, and at a distant fifth at that. Perhaps I would I it better if ASU were good on a consistent basis, but even then it would probably rank behind the other sports.

Mostly, the quality of play is the main reason, a problem that grows more stark every year. The quality of NBA hoops is so much better than college it's a chess to checkers relationship. In almost any situation, if I'm choosing between a NBA game and a college game, it's no contest.

Further, with the constant turnover and no teams sticking together anymore, you get teams like Butler in the championship solely based on the fact that they've played together for 3-4 years. Combine the lack of star power, the lack of continuity, and the dreadful 35 second shot clock, and you get a product that gets progressively worse. Even with the Suns being so hopeless, I still look forward to the NBA season.

All that being said, best of luck to the Cats, would be nice to have one of the AZ teams doing well.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Yeah, you're more enamored than I am with it. College basketball ranks behind NBA, NFL, College Football and Baseball for me, and at a distant fifth at that. Perhaps I would I it better if ASU were good on a consistent basis, but even then it would probably rank behind the other sports.

Mostly, the quality of play is the main reason, a problem that grows more stark every year. The quality of NBA hoops is so much better than college it's a chess to checkers relationship. In almost any situation, if I'm choosing between a NBA game and a college game, it's no contest.

Further, with the constant turnover and no teams sticking together anymore, you get teams like Butler in the championship solely based on the fact that they've played together for 3-4 years. Combine the lack of star power, the lack of continuity, and the dreadful 35 second shot clock, and you get a product that gets progressively worse. Even with the Suns being so hopeless, I still look forward to the NBA season.

All that being said, best of luck to the Cats, would be nice to have one of the AZ teams doing well.

I'm sure I'm not going to win you over but I can't really agree with most of what you've said. Yes, Butler went to the championship but in all fairness, how often has something like that happened? It's quite rare, much rarer than watching an NBA team get there on the strength of a recently purchased superstar or two.

I have no problem with the 35 second shot clock although a few coaches have used it to create 35 - 33 borefests. As for lack of star power, that just isn't the case. Perhaps the name familiarity isn't there for the casual fan but not so for those of us that watch a lot of games. And I loved the game long before the internet became sports fan heaven and if you think there is little name familiarity now just flash back to the late 70's. Unlike the NBA of the past 2 decades, the college game has always been more about the team than the individual.

I have no answer for the point you make about ASU not being a consistently decent program. I have ties to both schools and while I consider myself a Sun Devil in all ways, I've been a die-hard fan of UA basketball since the day Lute took the job. I wasn't sure if my passion would survive Olson's retirement but it turns out that once you get used to caring about a program, it's hard to flip the switch.

I have soured on the game a bit over the last decade or so but that's because I've become convinced that an increasing number of college referees have an agenda (financial?). But let's face it, the NBA is certainly not exempt in this area either. The NCAA (and hopefully, the NBA) is going to have to do something about that before much longer.

Steve

 

[overseascardfan]

Always embarrassing to lose to a D-III team, but considering no D-Will, no Momo, no Parrom, and the inexperience of 4 freshman its easy to see why this happened.

 

[Gaddabout]

Always embarrassing to lose to a D-III team, but considering no D-Will, no Momo, no Parrom, and the inexperience of 4 freshman its easy to see why this happened.

This wasn't in the story I read and definitlely explains the game more.

 

[Russ Smith]

Always embarrassing to lose to a D-III team, but considering no D-Will, no Momo, no Parrom, and the inexperience of 4 freshman its easy to see why this happened.

All true but UA is going to play without Williams and Momo all year.

I think the main thing is SPU as a D2 team can start practice earlier so they will be further along in their sets and stuff.

If you noticed at the end of the game UA was sort of winging it with few sets and that helped get them back in the game.

It's tough to play an offense you're still learning against a well coached team, and knowing a loss will look bad you start to press.

They will get better.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

That is another thing - Lute's vintage teams would've won this game by 30. One reason is obviously superior talent and second is Lute's Arizona was built on recruiting and off-court development at which point Lute would mostly roll the ball out and let the kids do their thing. Miller is a system guy (and a helluva recruiter) so his teams are going to start slower especially when there's a lot of new faces because they're not acclimated to what they are supposed to be doing out there on both sides of the floor.

Still...no excuse for losing.

 

[Lefty]

Not too concerned yet but I really like Nick Johnson. Miller said Nick could be playing some point guard due to make the team bigger. Also, want to see more Chol and less Kryl.

 

[wilycoyote24]

That is another thing - Lute's vintage teams would've won this game by 30. One reason is obviously superior talent and second is Lute's Arizona was built on recruiting and off-court development at which point Lute would mostly roll the ball out and let the kids do their thing. Miller is a system guy (and a helluva recruiter) so his teams are going to start slower especially when there's a lot of new faces because they're not acclimated to what they are supposed to be doing out there on both sides of the floor.

Still...no excuse for losing.

There is one GREAT excuse... this game DOESN'T count. How is this not an acceptable excuse?! Who cares? The only reason one should care at all about this is because we are all waiting for the regular season to start and are looking to anything to indicate how they'll do this season.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

I guess this would be the best place to mention Pepperdine, Middle Tennesee State, and Loyola Marymount right?

 

[Russ Smith]

I guess this would be the best place to mention Pepperdine, Middle Tennesee State, and Loyola Marymount right?

UCLA hasn't lost to Pepperdine yet.

All I can say is they made the right decision on Nelson and if Ben reinstates him instantly today(there's a meeting) i'll be very unhappy. He's a major distraction to the team, they need him on the court but he's gotta be a better teammate and that's not fixed by missing 2 days with the team.

But UCLA's issue on the court is that Ben is going to have to admit that the Wears just aren't that good and playing them that many minutes at the 4 and 5 is going to result in a lot of games like last night.

Nelson was the chemistry problem and that's being addressed, now the problem on the court is either keep playing the Wears in which case you will get brutalized inside all year, or make the Wears earn their PT by playing defense.

I expected to lose last night, I'm stunned at how we lost and I'm really annoyed with how Ben handled the big mintues. Burns a redshirt year for Lane by playing him 26 seconds each half. Sits Smith for big chunks of the 2nd half so Travis Wear can watch 6'6" guys dunk home putbacks. He has got to look in the mirror and see just he can't win playing the twins together that much. MTSU's entire offense in the first half was find a Wear attack, lather rinse repeat.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

How can he play Smith big minutes? The guy is a freaking blimp.

The Pepperdine comment was a dig at ASU.

 

[Russ Smith]

How can he play Smith big minutes? The guy is a freaking blimp.

The Pepperdine comment was a dig at ASU.

I know I was joking UCLA would lose to Pepp right now.

On Smith, Howland said at the presser it was his ankle(he rolled it in the first half very clear) but he seemed to be fine when he was out there so I'm not sure I believe him.

15 points 9 offensive boards in 21 minutes. No defensive boards but guess what, Travis played 26 minutes without a single defensive board either.

Smith needs to lose weight we all get that but UCLA is a totally different team with him on the court and I don't see the point in not playing him until he's exhausted now to get that point home to him. You're not in good enough shape to play right now, see how tired you are.

He said they'd find out more abotu the ankle today so maybe it got worse as the game went on that certainly happens with sprained ankles and at his size maybe that was it. But to then play Lane so little was unreal. the kid had as many D boards in 53 seconds as teh Wears had combined in 58 minutes last night. He's no great player but he at least challenges shots on defense.