Mocks for Suns

[se7en]

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Commish
A guy that I'm keeping an eye on is Nicholas Batum - he shot up the boards last year and then decided to withdraw. He had a decent but not great year and is suddenly being overlooked. I think he would be a solid addition to this club if he's available. The downside: he's French.

Not only is he French, his biggest criticism is that he is passive and seems to underperform too often.

**** that noise.

You guys do realize how rude those statements are to French Suns fans who frequent this forum? Not cool and kind of embarrassing to read.

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

Oh shut up. He is a mirror image of the most frustrating player in the National Basketball Association, and it warrants being brought up. Getting embarrassed by it sounds like a personal problem.

 

[Andrew]

I don't follow NCAA basketball, so who would be the best fit for the Suns?

 

[hafey]

France is my favorite country outside the US. Love that place.

 

[se7en]

Oh shut up. He is a mirror image of the most frustrating player in the National Basketball Association, and it warrants being brought up. Getting embarrassed by it sounds like a personal problem.

Well then I guess this makes you a jerk on many levels.

 

[Mainstreet]

I have no problem drafting a French player. I think Tony Parker turned out very well and it appears Diaw has been playing out of position. Really I don't know why the French are being singled out here. It's in poor taste.

 

[nowagimp]

I have no problem drafting a French player. I think Tony Parker turned out very well and it appears Diaw has been playing out of position. Really I don't know why the French are being singled out here. It's in poor taste.

Parker was good enough to be finals MVP, and Diaw was the suns most reliable defender against Parker and one of the suns best %FG shooter against the spurs. But you know, this is a board where steven hunter gets compared favorably with shaq, so I hope french suns fans take it(the insult) with a grain of salt.

 

[LV-Suns]

How many more years does Batum have with his French club?

 

[The Commish]

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Commish
A guy that I'm keeping an eye on is Nicholas Batum - he shot up the boards last year and then decided to withdraw. He had a decent but not great year and is suddenly being overlooked. I think he would be a solid addition to this club if he's available. The downside: he's French.



You guys do realize how rude those statements are to French Suns fans who frequent this forum? Not cool and kind of embarrassing to read.

The French fans can have Doris back. Tell them I want a player that has gonads and a work ethic.

 

[JoRain]

I think Tony Parker turned out very well

Just to get all the facts right. Though Tony Parker is playing for France international team, he is not infact a french. He is from Belgium.
The difference isn't big, but still....

 

[Irish]

The draft after the first half dozen is going to be very hard to judge. Every player has strengths and weaknesses. They guy that most interests me after the top six is Anthony Randolph of LSU, but nobody has him dropping to #15. http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Anthony-Randolph-1069/

There are several very interesting bigs that could be available at #15, but none seems to be without major issues. For wings, Batum is possibly as talented as anybody but is really young. Augustine is the only PG worth considering (Westbrook is too much of combo), but most mocks have him gone.

 

[cly2tw]

Batum, Westerbrook, McGee sound like good picks for us.

 

[mathbzh]

Just to get all the facts right. Though Tony Parker is playing for France international team, he is not infact a french. He is from Belgium.
The difference isn't big, but still....

He grew up in France, learn basketball in France... does the place were he is born really matter?

Where I disagree with your comments about French player is that you just look at Diaw and think "all the french are like this". This just sounds stupid. Look at the character of french players in the NBA, they are all very differents.
Look at Turiaf, he has more heart that 90% of the players in the NBA. Of course he is not the more talented player but is a warrior (he is my favorite french player). Pietrus has a very high opinion of himself. Parker also but he also has a great work ethic. Petro, Diawara, Gelabale... not one is like Diaw (I don't say they are better they are just different).

This is exactly like the Bargnani flop hurting the European players stocks... do you stop drafting US players because of Kwame Brown, Adam Morrison or any other flop?

 

[mathbzh]

For wings, Batum is possibly as talented as anybody but is really young.

So are Beasley, Rose, Bayless... Galinari...
But Batum and Gallinari are the only one in the top 20 with pro experience.
Why do scout always talk about young european being too young or not ready when they could say it about 70% of the lotery picks.

 

[JoRain]

He grew up in France, learn basketball in France... does the place were he is born really matter?

It doesn't really matter, but as I said, it's just to make the facts right. Technically Parker is Belgian !

Where I disagree with your comments about French player is that you just look at Diaw and think "all the french are like this". This just sounds stupid. Look at the character of french players in the NBA, they are all very differents.

which one of my comments ???

personally I have nothing against french players and France team is one of my favorites when it comes to international competition (of course after my Latvian team )
and for inventing and spreading out the art of flopping you can say thanks to Argentinians !

In Batums case I am not a fan of Suns drafting him because I think there will be few better options available which could fill Suns needs as well.

 

[Ollie]

Just to get all the facts right. Though Tony Parker is playing for France international team, he is not infact a french. He is from Belgium.
The difference isn't big, but still....

So Dominique Wilkins is french, then ? Damn, too bad no one ever called him to play with our national team during the 80's...

 

[Ollie]

It doesn't really matter, but as I said, it's just to make the facts right. Technically Parker is Belgian !

Technically he's dutch-french-american. Damn, you know it's off-season when you start disserting about private international law and freaking Tony Parker...

 

[mathbzh]

which one of my comments ???

Sorry, it was not about your comments, just about comments in this thread.

In Batums case I am not a fan of Suns drafting him because I think there will be few better options available which could fill Suns needs as well.

We could agree on this one. As I said I am not sure how good Batum really is.

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

My comments were not directed at French players. My comments were at players who are talented, unmotivated, passive and french. Why was the least significant characteristic out of those singled out of that argument? THAT is what truly seems racist. Why arent we talking about which players seem the most motivated and with the best work ethic? I would LOVE to rank which prospects are the most tenacious and hard working. Yet we feel more compelled to talk about someone who brought up a European country that is looked down upon in the US?

I see zero reason to garner up interest in a player that is a mirror image of Boris Diaw. It's a lethal combination, and I am sure anyone with delicate sensibilities may not want to dwell on that concept too long. I am, however, baffled that ANY Suns fan would be excited about another Diaw-esque prospect.

If you guys want to dissolve it down to racism and nationality technicalities, be my guest, but dont expect me to play ball.

For the record, I hate Boris Diaw. Not because he is French, because I find his attitude toward playing the game just as offensive as players who cant stay out of trouble with the law or cant keep their personal business out of the media. Anyone who has a child who loves basketball should feel the same way. He is a bad role model who cashed in during a contract year, came to camp overweight, denied any shortcomings and bushed off any criticisms. His "C'est la vie" attitude crippled the team's already blatant weaknesses when we truly needed him to give 100%.

I also believe Dantoni's lack of discipline was quite the catalyst in my loathing for Diaw. Management obviously saw it as well, and with him gone, and rumors already floating around that diaw is being shopped, it looks like my hunches have been similar to the front office thus far, which gives me hope for Kerr.

You may now proceed with your shocks of culture criticisms and nationality technicalities. Im gonna go eat some freedom fries.

 

[carey]

For the record, I hate Boris Diaw. Not because he is French, because I find his attitude toward playing the game just as offensive as players who cant stay out of trouble with the law or cant keep their personal business out of the media. Anyone who has a child who loves basketball should feel the same way. He is a bad role model who cashed in during a contract year, came to camp overweight, denied any shortcomings and bushed off any criticisms. His "C'est la vie" attitude crippled the team's already blatant weaknesses when we truly needed him to give 100%.

This is exactly how I feel about him. I've wanted him gone for ages now and every other post I made this past season was about how much he sucked.

 

[LV-Suns]

How many more years does Batum have with his French club?

 

[mathbzh]

I will not talk about racism with you freedom fries eater.

All I want to know is how you know Batum and Diaw have the same character and work ethic. I am sure that the fact he is french has nothing to do with this.

Why arent we talking about which players seem the most motivated and with the best work ethic?

Werer did you read Batum is not motivated?

This comes from Batum's note on DraftExpress

His shot looks to be improving all the time it seems, even if his mechanics aren’t perfect, he’s clearly putting in a ton of work from what we saw over the four days we spent here.
...
Vincent Collet (who really seems to enjoy working with the young players here from what we can tell) is putting in a ton of time on an individual basis with Batum every single day, working with him on all the little things he needs to improve on to be successful in the NBA.
...

I never read a report about him not being a hard worker. If you find one please send me a link.

You will probably not trust me but a 19 yo player that is passive can't average more than 12 ppg and be its team best scorer in the french league. I believe Batum passivity was most a confidence issue than a consequence of his character. That makes him very different from Diaw.

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

You cite draftexpress and dont even bother to read his profile? Come on man

Batum should be topping this chart, he should have taken this edition of the Euroleague by storm. Nobody, not a single player, comes close to combining his physical gifts and skill repertoire. Instead, we’re hearing an already familiar tune: inconsistency, a certain lack of character and… perhaps some softness(?) mixed in with stretches of impressive play that only a freakish athlete like him is capable of deliver.

Unlike Gallinari, Batum hasn’t been able to emerge as the team leader Le Mans needed in order to overcome a pretty forgettable regular season (2-12 record), especially considering the very poor situation they had at the point guard position and the excellent creative skills Nicolas enjoys. But he barely ever came up aggressive enough to command his team’s offensive efforts for long periods. He wasn’t fearless enough attacking the basket, and his jumper is still a work in progress. And particularly, he disappeared again from the court in crunch time with concerning regularity--which didn’t help his team avoid some painfully close losses.

However, whenever he figured things out, he really impressed with his abilities. The guy can be simply unstoppable, able to create his own shot at will, to easily set up his teammates for easy baskets, to play lock down defense taking advantage of his freakish wingspan and athleticism, and come up with a slew of highlights in the form of blocks, dunks, long-range off-the-dribble shots, etc.

Batum needs to realize that he’s the clear-cut best player on his team, and start playing accordingly. It would be a crime to waste such an impressive collage of basketball goods. Indeed, he should be a lock for the lottery, but even if we can easily project him there, there’s no solid ground to protect him from slipping, given the concerns his game draws.

Sound familiar?

Im not going out and consolidating every other similar critique when you dont bother to read the full page you quote just to prove my point to you.

 

[mathbzh]

This is a report about Euroleague. I already read it and this kind of report is exactly why I posted about Batum in the first place.
Just read my previous posts to have my feeling about it.

One fact is this report does not speak about his motivation or work ethic.

This is the first season Batum is asked to be a leader in Le Mans... and the Euroleague is the highest level outside the NBA. Can't you understand he had to adapt to this new situation?
I have posted evidences that Batum has emerged as his team leader this season, something Diaw could not have done when he was in France. But if you want to see Batum as the next Diaw, do as you want cause none of us as influence on the Suns next pick.

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

So he is a hard working, passive, inconsistent, unaggressive, forward with a questionable jumper that doesn't take full advantage of his skill advantages.

Well sign me up then....