Let the debate begin

[Russ Smith]

He did good, but was getting confused by Bellicheck

NO Step was awful in the first half, Wilfork tossed him around like a rag doll.

 

[LVCARDFREAK]

Yeah, and guess what? That drafted QB would of looked of just as bad.

Man see this is why you cant talk football with people.


Let me recap. I wouldnt be starting a rookie QB right now. I would still have McCown playing. The difference is we would already have our future. Let McCown play this year if he does well then great we have 2 good QB's ont he roster-imagine that!!! If he doesn't? Cut him loose, here comes the rookie!

What has made me upset was Green'e ego. Coming in, annointing McCown the starter and not even looking to draft a QB for the future. Saying this team is a 10 win team and going to the playoffs-please!

I like what he has done-to a degree- since he took over, but his biggest bunngle to date was not looking towards the future!

 

[conraddobler]

That's what you get as a coach when you set yourself up as the man with all the power. It's your team and your decisions to make and you get to take the credit when they go right and the blame when they go wrong.

Today's game was against a really good team and not fair to judge entirely on this, but virtually every "personnel decision" DG made, came up short in this game. Josh struggled, Step got destroyed, Fitz didn't get open, Dansby was ok, Dockett made 2 plays all day.

I thought big was pretty mediocre, had the hold and the false start on one drive, had some ok moments, but basically he looked good because the right side looked so bad it made him look good in comparison. AC and Spikes just stink. The OL was reshuffled but today it looked as bad as ever. I still say by the end of the year LJ will be the LT, Big not sure where and AC will be on the bench.

Josh today looked like a confused football player, didn't see the field, didn't have time to throw, and when he did was too skittish.

Fitz looked like a guy who didn't understand the coverage, he seemed to not understand why he wasn't getting the ball more, because he wasn't getting open. He's in a tough situation because he's getting keyed on, but he's making a ton of money and the team needs him to get open.

Overall the disappointments for me today were Dockett, Step and josh.

We hung tough with a very good team, but I want a win.

I think it is fair to blame DG since they were his decisions but still it's the Patriots and all.

That defense makes a lot of teams look bad and we certainly looked bad. The defense is ok and improving much faster though still giving way too many yards it's got some fight in it.

I think the O line is our single biggest problem and in pausing to think about it I don't blame McCown too much. He stank but then again that's happend to new QB's a few times in their first year starting.

Let's see how he responds and note to DG, work on picking up the blitz because until other teams notice we beat it we are going to see it a ton. Think screens and think about them often.

 

[MrY]

Pasch and Mistler said this is because the OLineman arent pushing them down.

Pasch and Mistler were defending McCown a little, and ragging on the OL and WR's a little.

Actually, I thought they ragged on them the whole second half. Said Denny should fire the whole bunch....etc etc

 

[Buckybird]

I think we have a pretty solid backup in King, but the problem is he's just that--a solid backup.

This offense would be better with Shaun King under center. Experience. Quick
decisive throws and knowing where to go quickly.

 

[LVCARDFREAK]

Let's see how he responds and note to DG, work on picking up the blitz because until other teams notice we beat it we are going to see it a ton. Think screens and think about them often.

Thats a good point. and it takes us full circle back around tot he debates we used to have with Plummer.

Every team-if smart-is gonna stick 8 men in the box, and blitz the hell out of this team until McCown and proves he can beat you. We used to havethe same debates about Plummer.


McCown had single coverage all day long on Williams and Bryant but instead choose to force into coverage to Fitz.

When that many guys are blitzing 7 or 8, there is gonna be someone open and in single coverage. McCown just couldnt find them todaY!

 

[slanidrac16]

Cmon gang.....

this game went just about how we thought it would go. I said this was going to be Dillons coming out party as a patriot(actually predicted 146 yds on 22 carries and a 23 to 9 final) and that the Pats would be methodical. This is the same team that intercepted Manning 4 times in the AFC championship game.

I'm proud that we fought our guts out after falling behind 14-0. Last years team would have lost 35-3.

 

[Russ Smith]

I
I think the O line is our single biggest problem and in pausing to think about it I don't blame McCown too much. He stank but then again that's happend to new QB's a few times in their first year starting.

Let's see how he responds and note to DG, work on picking up the blitz because until other teams notice we beat it we are going to see it a ton. Think screens and think about them often.

Absolutely, the problem for me is right now I think our OL is as bad as it ever was in past years, and we don't have injuries yet to blame except for LJ, and Green wouldn't have started him anyways. So this is one of those you can't blame a problem that you helped create.

I do think what Green is doing is identifying guys he wants to step up and giving them the chance to do it, Big, Step, Dansby, Dockett, it won't happen overnight but it has to happen eventually for this team to be better.

I do think Green has a plan, I never believed Mac did. boy I hope that's the worst game we see from Josh though because he looked really skittish today.

 

[Zeno]

We have one of the higher paid OLines in the league(if you include LJ Shelton in the mix) and it looks absolutely horrible.

I don't care who we had at QB or at RB today the result wouldn't have been much different.

The only positive I can get is that the defense is getting turnovers...still can't stop the run at all though.

This was a team loss...the blame falls to everywhere but the Special Teams.

 

[Pariah]

This offense would be better with Shaun King under center. Experience. Quick
decisive throws and knowing where to go quickly.

But, would we be better in the long-run? I don't know. If pressed for an answer, right now I'd say "no."

 

[Pariah]

I do think what Green is doing is identifying guys he wants to step up and giving them the chance to do it, Big, Step, Dansby, Dockett, it won't happen overnight but it has to happen eventually for this team to be better.

I thought Dansby had a really nice game.

 

[conraddobler]

Absolutely, the problem for me is right now I think our OL is as bad as it ever was in past years, and we don't have injuries yet to blame except for LJ, and Green wouldn't have started him anyways. So this is one of those you can't blame a problem that you helped create.

I do think what Green is doing is identifying guys he wants to step up and giving them the chance to do it, Big, Step, Dansby, Dockett, it won't happen overnight but it has to happen eventually for this team to be better.

I do think Green has a plan, I never believed Mac did. boy I hope that's the worst game we see from Josh though because he looked really skittish today.

I'd agree with all of that and I think DG knows he was going to take it in the shorts at least in the short run but I do believe he has the capacity to admit his mistakes and throw the offenders overboard. I in fact know he does and he does know football and he wants to win so whatever happens I am ok with.

Josh will get some protection from him as he should but there will come a point Josh is going to have to make a leap or he will be gone just like any other player that keeps messing up under DG.

I think I can read into some of what you said and say that you feel DG has miscalculated as to the extent of the damage his moves made and I'd agree with that. He is hurting more than I believe he thought he would but he will adjust.

Boldin did let slip that thing about King starting... Maybe he isn't just a great WR maybe he's a good judge of talent. Specifically a lack of talent on Josh's part who knows but I do think it will all get fixed, just not as fast as we'd all like.

 

[Russ Smith]

I thought Dansby had a really nice game.

He made some plays but he also took some really bad angles that gave Dillon some nice runs, and he seems to be hesitant. But he's got talent and he missed so much time in camp he's likely rusty.

 

[CaptTurbo]

I thought Dansby had a really nice game.

you must have been watching him the whole game because no one really stands out on defense except maybe Mackiln.

 

[MrY]

DG has miscalculated as to the extent of the damage his moves made and I'd agree with that. He is hurting more than I believe he thought he would but he will adjust.

I think he miscalculated just how bad the whole team was when he decided to take the job. Maybe none of us realized to the full extent just how bad we really are and the size of the hole DG has to dig us out of

 

[conraddobler]

I think he miscalculated just how bad the whole team was when he decided to take the job. Maybe none of us realized to the full extent just how bad we really are and the size of the hole DG has to dig us out of

Yeah that too but see his reputation is on the line now and he dosen't panic, he'll dig in and most importantly Michael B will give him what he wants. This whole thing is still on plan for playoffs in 2006.

I think in some ways, especially now days with the way they cater to expansion teams, it would have been easier to just start one than fix this.

 

[Brevity]

I am just a little surprised this thread appeared in our second loss in a row. I was thinking it would happen after the third.

McCown had no help from the O-line. Until that is addressed, he will look awful.

 

[Tangodnzr]

I don't even know about draftng, neccesarily, but at least some were talking about making some kind of move for one... any move, a little move... you know as a just in case kind of thing... The chickens and the baskets??? Or eggs or whatever...

Or maybe just the mush in the mouth of some.

 

[conraddobler]

I am just a little surprised this thread appeared in our second loss in a row. I was thinking it would happen after the third.

McCown had no help from the O-line. Until that is addressed, he will look awful.

I started it early for fun cause I knew it was comming.

I am still on the bandwagon but it did just hit a very big ditch and people are hanging on by fingernails.

 

[Tangodnzr]

I am just a little surprised this thread appeared in our second loss in a row. I was thinking it would happen after the third.

McCown had no help from the O-line. Until that is addressed, he will look awful.

I'm not surprised at all, and this day just further confirms suspicions I've had up to now....I call Sunday's "Dorm day" now, and will now log off as expecting to not see much worthwhile reading until tomorrow sometime.
Sunday's have become almost a total waste of time to read the boards anymore.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

To call for McCowns head would be a silly knee jerk reaction to say the least.

Did you honestly think that McCown would come out and throw for 200 yds and 2 TDs and no INTs against the Patriot D? Come on folks, this is the defence that confuses the best QB's in the NFL. McCown is still young and learning. Not to mention the growing pains of learning a new system.

McCown didn't have a good game. But be rational about this. You want to bench him in the second game because he didn't perform against the world championship defence?

How will Roth played doesn't matter. He isn't on our team and never was going to be. Plus he isn't facing the same team so the comparison is useless.

.... in addition, Roth the "Saviour" was intercepted twice...

 

[azdad1978]

The whole right side of the oline sucks.

 

[PJ1]

I thought Dansby had a really nice game.

I agree and he will only get better. Lot of pop when he hits and he wants to win badly.

 

[CardFan67]

I'm not surprised at all, and this day just further confirms suspicions I've had up to now....I call Sunday's "Dorm day" now, and will now log off as expecting to not see much worthwhile reading until tomorrow sometime.
Sunday's have become almost a total waste of time to read the boards anymore.

Your participation will be *cough* greatly missed...

 

[Rats]

Kneejerk? Some of us wanted to DRAFT a QB back in April!

That is why this is totally selfserving crap. I just got back from the game and for anyone here to say we need to replace the QB because he doesn't go thru his reads is just high. MCCOWN HAD ZERO TIME TO THROW THE BALL IN EITHER HALF. We had no running game at all. The WR had no seperation either half. If you would watch the game instead of automatically trying to say "We need a differant QB" maybe you would see where the real problems are on this team. The play calling was bad, the blocking by the OLine and especially the Tight Ends was the worst I have seen in person. No QB would have had a good day with that kind of suspect blocking. If you were not trying to push your agenda in regards to the QB you wouldn't have even brought this up. Not just you but everyone who is calling for Joshs Head after this game....Ridiculas