Kokoskovs offense

[NashDishesDimes]

Kokoskov’s offense is a real head scratcher to me. Its basically a series of hand offs and picks 2 feet behind the three point line, literally every time down the floor. Not only does it never confuse a defense but it has Ayton setting these picks way too far out. If he doesnt get an alley oop its useless. It doesnt allow him to ever go down low and get good position. Even worse, the pick is set so high he gets the ball too far out of his range.

Perhaps the most frustrating part is it doesnt allow Book to go to work. I see Books body language isnt great this season and i wonder if it has something to do with ith this offense.

Terrible.

This offense should have the ball in Books hands once it crosses half court with ayton already established position and shooters spread out. Simple.

 

[JerkFace]

I’ve thought the same thing. It is super predictable and seems to cause a bunch of congestion. I know Igor said that he had to simplify it so that the players weren’t thinking so much, so hopefully once everyone is more comfortable with it and they expand it again it will have more wrinkles to it.

 

[Cheesebeef]

i remember when some people kept admonishing me that Koko's "motion" offense won't need legit distributors.... that all the passing/the ball whizzing around the floor/cutting will get open shots.

This ain't the Ivy League where Princeton's back door cuts can win and squeeze out a game every blue moon in the NCAA tourney. I don't care what you call your offense... if you don't have ANY legit PGs, you're freaking screwed... especially if you're not using a big man to draw double down in the block.

I've been very, very unimpressed by Koko, but I don't know why I'm surprised. Almost every decision McD and Co. made for years was a head-scratcher... especially at HC.

 

[Phrazbit]

I still like Koko and the offense. IMO, once guys have a better grip on where the looks are generated and know where to expect eachother to be, the offense will flourish.

Koko brought this same offense to Utah, their offense was terrible for the first half of last season, then it exploded and they had one of the best. It takes time and we've got a lot of really young players and no point guard.

I think Koko will be a really good coach if he's given a little time and, especially, a few more remotely consistent players. Hopefully he can coach up a few of our current guys up to that level.

I had little faith that Okobo, Melton, Canaan, Holmes, Bridges... even JJ too, would be consistent but it's really disappointing to see Anderson and Ariza play like crap so often. I don't know how I can blame the coach for their terrible play when (especially in Anderson's case) they're missing so many wide open shots.

 

[slinslin]

Kokoskov is a major disappointment imo and has proven that all his ideas and interviews are full of BS.

He consistenly talked about tailoring his system around the players he has but I see none of that. We should be pick and roll dominant team running all our offense through Booker and Ayton pretty much.

Instead he is trying to play a system that makes everyone a playmaker and it results in insane turnover production and little structure in the offense.

On top of that the defense is as bad as ever.

 

[Finito]

The motion offense and ball movement and all that work it's just this team sucks.

Our PG situation is the worse in the league, our forwards are all horrible JJ, Anderson and Ariza give us nothing at all, Warren is an empty stats guy at best.

Yeah this is bad

 

[slinslin]

The motion offense and ball movement and all that work it's just this team sucks.

Our PG situation is the worse in the league, our forwards are all horrible JJ, Anderson and Ariza give us nothing at all, Warren is an empty stats guy at best.

Yeah this is bad

motion offense is not the right offense for every team

 

[elindholm]

When a coach with no track record starts talking about a "system," you know it's going to fail. A "system" is a substitute for knowing how to coach. Real coaches adapt to the situation, adapt to their personnel, adapt to the opponent. They think flexibly in real time and know that predictability kills.

The big culprit in all of this "system" nonsense, predictably, is Phil Jackson, the greatest troll coach in history. He talked about The Triangle, got everyone else talking about The Triangle, and created this mysticism about how that offense was the secret to his success -- as if having Jordan, Pippen, O'Neal, Bryant, and great role players on both sides of the ball wasn't the real reason. You had other coaches saying with a straight face that they were going to run The Triangle so that they could have comparable success to Phil Jackson's teams. Tex Winter became one of the great geniuses of our age. The myth got amplified by claims that The True Triangle was so immensely sophisticated that no one could understand it -- on par with general relativity -- and that even the great Phil Jackson teams used only a tiny fraction of it, because that was potent enough. And the media lapped it up, because Jackson is an expert con man.

If good coaching at the NBA level could be boiled down to a three-page pamphlet of a system and general strategies, everyone would do it. A coach who comes in believing that that's the answer shows only that he has no idea what he's up against.

 

[95pro]

I'm going jump off in another direction and just point out our execution. It stinks. Canaan bad hand offs. Pick and roll, it needs to be a quick pick and quick roll, the players are going through the motions and not execution with any precision.

Ayton needs to just shoot or dribble, he can be too passive. Booker gets in the lane and should be hitting that midrange all the time. We find ourselves going for the home run too often.

I like Canaan, he's come a long way and is starting to be a good shooter. But as pg he just throws everyone off their game. He doesn't hit Ayton on the pick and rolls, and lobs. Just seems he doesn't have the athletics to get that extra step on his guy for that bounce pass or that angle to get the ball to them. I don't think he'll ever have "It" as a pg.

 

[Hoop Head]

I'm going jump off in another direction and just point out our execution. It stinks. Canaan bad hand offs. Pick and roll, it needs to be a quick pick and quick roll, the players are going through the motions and not execution with any precision.

Ayton needs to just shoot or dribble, he can be too passive. Booker gets in the lane and should be hitting that midrange all the time. We find ourselves going for the home run too often.

I like Canaan, he's come a long way and is starting to be a good shooter. But as pg he just throws everyone off their game. He doesn't hit Ayton on the pick and rolls, and lobs. Just seems he doesn't have the athletics to get that extra step on his guy for that bounce pass or that angle to get the ball to them. I don't think he'll ever have "It" as a pg.

The execution is definitely not there. It's slowed down since the Mavericks game, in which we looked much better and played with a jump in our step. If you watch the energy everyone had in that one game vs 2 games later, after the Denver game, they looked defeated. I think a lot of that blame falls on Igor. I know players were riding high after thumping the Mavericks but Igor should have brought them back down to earth at that point. We played a bad team that wasn't capable of taking advantage of our mistakes. Once we played a decent team, Denver, the margin of error shrunk and it was obvious we weren't as far as some thought after the Dallas game. Easy wins can throw a team off, especially bad teams and young teams. A bad young team with a big win to kick off the season hurt us by setting expectations too high for fans, and players. I think they bought into it too much and once they faced adversity they struggled and didn't know what to do.

 

[taz02]

Whatever is going on its obviously not working. A pass heavy offensive system with no PG and no defense translates to turnovers and easy lay ups.

This should be a two man system centered on Booker and Ayton. Ayton needs to play closer to the basket and score instead of thinking pass first.

Everyone else should fill a role shooting, slashing and defense....

its brutal watching Ayton stand 18 feet out with his back to the basket looking to make a pass while the defender sags off ten feet....

 

[GatorAZ]

So what do we do if he’s still clearly in over his head at the end of the year? Another coaching change or stick with him to give the players some regularity? That’d be what five coaches in 4 years?

 

[JCSunsfan]

Canaan is a problem, his success comes at the expense of others.

Okobo is worse for now, but we might have to go with him in order to succeed long term'

Our vet players seem to have quit (Ariza and Anderson). It's like they saw Chandler get out and thought "That is what I want."

Warren is consistently good, but then has horrible games thrown in there every once in a while.

Our forwards, across the board, are horrible (maybe with the exception of Bridges), is that a personnel problem or a problem with the offense itself?

If players have checked out, I do not think it is about the coach, but more about the team and ownership. But that is just my guess. If this is all about the owner, I might just have to not pay as much attention to this team anymore. I will always be a Suns fan, but life is too short to waste as many brain cells worrying about the mess that Robert Sarver has made.

 

[ArizonaSportsFan]

I think he/we are kind of stuck for the moment. The OP says the offense isn't tailored to Booker - I disagree. This offense, run correctly, is perfect for Booker. The OP says Booker should be handling the ball once it crosses half-court. I disagree - with these players. Too easy to trap Book and force a bad shot/pass. We see it happening time and again because there is no other credible threat and the movement stops as players are watching Booker. A few of the players may get there. Ayton would have plenty of scoring if he gave an effort. He had shots for days with this very offense last night. Was hesitant, unsure, and inaccurate.
So, should the system be tailored to players (other than Book, because this one IS when it works) or should the green players be taught the system? Pick and rolls are great and all with good passers and shooters. We have a great shooter and a talented but very raw rookie. And not a whole lot else at this point?
And no offense can overcome the laziness on defense/rebounding, which must have the staff in fits. But again, are you going to pull anyone who can actually score in favor of defense?
Making knee-jerk changes at this point is just more damaging. I do believe that Coach needs to use the bench to motivate a little more.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Warren is consistently good, but then has horrible games thrown in there every once in a while.

That seems to fly in the face of what consistency means? But whatever, its been the story of TJ's career with us. TJ is mostly a solid player but he disappears with alarming regularity IMO. As opposed to Booker, for example, who is usually a good player but he has most than his share of disappointing games along the way. But he doesn't disappear like TJ does.

 

[Raindog]

Ayton would have plenty of scoring if he gave an effort. He had shots for days with this very offense last night. Was hesitant, unsure, and inaccurate.

I think a lot of guys are confused by their supposed roles on offense. Ayton isn't getting the ball in his natural floor position of strength at the post, so he's undoubtedly uncertain about what he is supposed to be doing to generate offense. Igor's system and the pathetic lack of decent PG play isn't helping.

 

[slinslin]

My frustration level is at an all-time high.

Partially because it turns out I was afterall 100% right on Dragan Bender and Josh Jackson and partially because there is no way we should be as bad as we are regardless of that.

Who wants to guess what Sarvers frustration level is right now?

 

[Hoop Head]

My frustration level is at an all-time high.

Partially because it turns out I was afterall 100% right on Dragan Bender and Josh Jackson and partially because there is no way we should be as bad as we are regardless of that.

Who wants to guess what Sarvers frustration level is right now?

Good thing you being frustrated won't effect the ratings.

 

[ArizonaSportsFan]

My frustration level is at an all-time high.

Partially because it turns out I was afterall 100% right on Dragan Bender and Josh Jackson and partially because there is no way we should be as bad as we are regardless of that.

Who wants to guess what Sarvers frustration level is right now?

You forgot 100% wrong on Chriss. But who is counting, right?

 

[slinslin]

The first alarm bell was how little he got out of a stacked summer league roster that did not play to it's strength.

Igor mismanaged this team since June.

Should have used summer league to establish Ayton as a go to player on offense. Instead he let inefficient perimeter players run wild and take control of the team. He had a stacked roster in summer league that should have rolled over the competition instead he managed to lose to the Blazers and Lakers summer league teams.

 

[slinslin]

You forgot 100% wrong on Chriss. But who is counting, right?

We would be a better team right now if we had Chriss instead of Ryan Anderson.

 

[Hoop Head]

We would be a better team right now if we had Chriss instead of Ryan Anderson.

He sure has helped Houston get off to a great start. He can't get playing time there even with them lacking depth at forward also. Chriss sucks and as bad as Anderson is, at least he doesn't clog the lane like Chriss would. He also doesn't pout like Chriss. Please though, tell us what Chriss has done in his whopping 11 minutes played so far that gives you the idea he would be better than Anderson here. Better because he's an expiring contract but that's it. On the court he wouldn't help, at all.

 

[slinslin]

He sure has helped Houston get off to a great start. He can't get playing time there even with them lacking depth at forward also. Chriss sucks and as bad as Anderson is, at least he doesn't clog the lane like Chriss would. He also doesn't pout like Chriss. Please though, tell us what Chriss has done in his whopping 11 minutes played so far that gives you the idea he would be better than Anderson here. Better because he's an expiring contract but that's it. On the court he wouldn't help, at all.

He was out with an ankle injury.

 

[Carolinacacti]

I think a lot of guys are confused by their supposed roles on offense. Ayton isn't getting the ball in his natural floor position of strength at the post, so he's undoubtedly uncertain about what he is supposed to be doing to generate offense. Igor's system and the pathetic lack of decent PG play isn't helping.

My god its the defense that's bad and Chriss would have helped that.

 

[1Sun]

Looks like Kokoskov was just yet another in a long line of horrendous decisions by McDonough. Bring in a new, hopefully competent GM, and let him hire a coach who knows what he's doing.