Josh Childress (info and other stuff)

[SunsTzu]

Next to say...Spiderman...Childress is probably not considered super athletic.

Otherwise he described him pretty well.

According to pre-draft measurements he stacks up pretty well against Igoudala. Little little better vert, little worse on sprints. Iggy had significantly better agility test and Childress did much better with the bench press.

 

[Gaddabout]

Childress ISN'T super athletic. He's a good athlete with a great vertical, but he's not Kobe. He isn't going to blow by every defender and he can be beaten on the perimeter on defense.

 

[Joe Mama]

Childress ISN'T super athletic. He's a good athlete with a great vertical, but he's not Kobe. He isn't going to blow by every defender and he can be beaten on the perimeter on defense.

I'll take this one step further. I like the addition of Childress, but I'm not too happy with paying him $6.5 million per season for the next five seasons. He is a very good defender and a pretty good three point shooter. He isn't going to initiate a lot of offense himself. The biggest problem I have with signing him is that we didn't NEED him. We would have been better off holding that money for free agency next summer or whatever they start negotiating free agents for the new CBA or maybe even extending Jared Dudley.

Joe Mama

 

[AzStevenCal]

Childress ISN'T super athletic. He's a good athlete with a great vertical, but he's not Kobe. He isn't going to blow by every defender and he can be beaten on the perimeter on defense.

Matt, you've made a living with words. It was not unreasonable for any of us to assume you used "is not super athletic" the way it's commonly used. For example: Dudley isn't super athletic but he makes up for it with his hustle and court sense. If you meant he was a good athlete but not a great one this was a curious way to approach it.

Steve

 

[Chaplin]

I'll take this one step further. I like the addition of Childress, but I'm not too happy with paying him $6.5 million per season for the next five seasons. He is a very good defender and a pretty good three point shooter. He isn't going to initiate a lot of offense himself. The biggest problem I have with signing him is that we didn't NEED him. We would have been better off holding that money for free agency next summer or whatever they start negotiating free agents for the new CBA or maybe even extending Jared Dudley.

Joe Mama

You don't think the signing is preparation for the middle of this coming season or the end of the year, when JRich most likely will be traded? There's no way we'll be signing him to a big deal next summer.

 

[AzStevenCal]

You don't think the signing is preparation for the middle of this coming season or the end of the year, when JRich most likely will be traded? There's no way we'll be signing him to a big deal next summer.

I agree. I think the planned absence of Jason had a lot to do with signing Childress. I'm sure the familiarity Babby has with Josh's situation helped but he was almost definitely intended to help replace Richardson.

Steve

 

[Chaplin]

It's a formality, but this deal is done now. He's officially a Phoenix Sun.

 

[taz02]

There has to be some conflict with a player agent being the president of basketball operations. Seems a bit coincidental that two of babby's clients were signed just prior to him taking the job. I' m sure that in addition to childress being a good signing it is also part of a larger picture.

It's probably better to look at all of this as part of one big deal. The signing of childress, the hiring of babby and the trade for turk including the waived trade kicker.

 

[Chaplin]

There has to be some conflict with a player agent being the president of basketball operations. Seems a bit coincidental that two of babby's clients were signed just prior to him taking the job. I' m sure that in addition to childress being a good signing it is also part of a larger picture.

It's probably better to look at all of this as part of one big deal. The signing of childress, the hiring of babby and the trade for turk including the waived trade kicker.

Childress is not Babby's client and hasn't been for a while. And I'm sure he has severed ties with all his other clients. The NBA would never approve his hiring if they did.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

And I place JRich above many of the guys you mentioned because some of those guys are just pure jump shooters. JRich can still jump out of the gym, play above the rim, rebound and post up smaller guards. Some of the players you mentioned above can't do all the things he can. At one point in the season all the analysts were saying that he was playing as well as any SG in the league and that is not even counting what he did in the playoffs.

It's just my opinion but he is definitely in that 2nd tier and I think to a certain extent the way we use him limits what he can really do. People put alot of credit on what Amare was doing to our success last year. I say JRich was a huge part of that run and definitely just as important as any player on the court during the playoffs.

I am not saying you can get Tim Ducan for him but if the Suns were to get a scrub or bench player in return it only points to how badly run this front office is.

uh, redd is the ONLY pure jumpshooter that i listed. no one would argue that kobe, wade, roy, mayo, evans, etc. are pure jumpshooters. notice i didn't list ray allen. all those guys are likely MORE versatile than is jrich.

and don't get me wrong, i realize how important jrich was to the team. i'm not downplaying his role. i just think you're exaggerating his talent and waaay overvaluing him.

and i do agree, if all we got for him (and his contract) was a scrub, it'd be further indictment of the FO.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

you're right... you must have imagined JRich taking guys off the dribble and driving right past them.

seriously, I don't remember that AT ALL. I remember him being a flame-thrower from 3 though and doing a solid job when they'd get him the ball in the post.

he scored off cuts to the basket too. but he was definitely NOT taking guys off the dribble.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

What is with this sudden desire to tear JRich down? I've never seen you do something like this before.

why is it when someone on this board tries to make an objective assessment of a player and his contract it is always considered "tearing down" with you, chap?

he's just pointing out jrich's strengths (shooting, scoring, rebounding, and expiring contract) and weaknesses (defense and large $$ contract).

 

[Chaplin]

why is it when someone on this board tries to make an objective assessment of a player and his contract it is always considered "tearing down" with you, chap?

he's just pointing out jrich's strengths (shooting, scoring, rebounding, and expiring contract) and weaknesses (defense and large $$ contract).

Matt never speaks negatively this much about a player, I was just asking why he was in this instance.

And you apparently haven't been paying attention if you don't think JRich has become a goat here.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Matt never speaks negatively this much about a player, I was just asking why he was in this instance.

And you apparently haven't been paying attention if you don't think JRich has become a goat here.

i don't think i'd characterize the chatter as making jrich into a goat. rather, people view him as a tradable piece. no one is denigrating him, just trying to realistically judge his value. some of us overvalue him, others may undervalue him, and some of us (like me) know his exact value (i keed, i keed).

but i think everyone on this board has a great appreciate for what he brought to the table this past season and most likely respect his game a lot more now than the previous season.

 

[Chaplin]

i don't think i'd characterize the chatter as making jrich into a goat. rather, people view him as a tradable piece. no one is denigrating him, just trying to realistically judge his value. some of us overvalue him, others may undervalue him, and some of us (like me) know his exact value (i keed, i keed).

but i think everyone on this board has a great appreciate for what he brought to the table this past season and most likely respect his game a lot more now than the previous season.

Let me ask you this: Do you agree with a Kirilenko for JRich trade? I certainly do not, obviously.

Not saying you are, just having the conversation, but calling JRich redundant is misguided. If anything, why wouldn't they say Turk or Childress is redundant?

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Let me ask you this: Do you agree with a Kirilenko for JRich trade? I certainly do not, obviously.

Not saying you are, just having the conversation, but calling JRich redundant is misguided. If anything, why wouldn't they say Turk or Childress is redundant?

oh, i agree with you on both those points. a few years ago i was all for AK for marion. but wouldn't trade jrich for AK.

and i agree that turk/childress/hill/dudley/frye is more redundant than anyone and jrich.

 

[Gaddabout]

Let me ask you this: Do you agree with a Kirilenko for JRich trade? I certainly do not, obviously.

If I thought Kirilenko would be healthy I'd pull the trigger on that one in a heartbeat, because Kirilenko is a ++ defender at three positions and the ball moves freely when he's on offense. You can get some of what JRich brings to the table for a cheaper price, but what Kirlienko does as a post defender is a premium skill.

But Kirilenko's brittleness being what it is, JRich still holds more value because you're going to get his mostly consistent offensive production for 75+ games.

 

[Gaddabout]

Matt, you've made a living with words. It was not unreasonable for any of us to assume you used "is not super athletic" the way it's commonly used. For example: Dudley isn't super athletic but he makes up for it with his hustle and court sense. If you meant he was a good athlete but not a great one this was a curious way to approach it.

Fair enough, but realize the hyperbole flies like **** in a monkey cage around here. My instinct is to overreact and go the other direction to pull people back to reality.

Childress is a role player, probably a really nice piece on a good team, but at the end of the day I'm guessing his production is going to be hard to distinguish from Dudley's. Actually, if they get Dudley-like production from him it will be a good deal.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Fair enough, but realize the hyperbole flies like **** in a monkey cage around here.

It's a Fox News/ESPN bi-polar world!

 

[AzStevenCal]

Fair enough, but realize the hyperbole flies like **** in a monkey cage around here. My instinct is to overreact and go the other direction to pull people back to reality.

Childress is a role player, probably a really nice piece on a good team, but at the end of the day I'm guessing his production is going to be hard to distinguish from Dudley's. Actually, if they get Dudley-like production from him it will be a good deal.

Understood. Although I do think you're selling Childress a bit short. I love what Dudley brings to this team but the last time I saw Josh play he was quite a bit better than Duds. Despite his frame, he's tough and in my opinion, he's a winner. Like Dudley, he'll do whatever is necessary to help the team but he's much more athletic than Jarod so he's even more effective at it. The addition of a 3 point shot to Dudley's game narrows the field somewhat but I'd still give Josh the solid advantage.

I think you can win it all with Childress as a starter. He may not be the reason you win it all but he won't be an anchor dragging you down either. I don't know how much has changed in his game since he went overseas but I think he's going to help us quite a bit.

Steve

 

[devilalum]

Understood. Although I do think you're selling Childress a bit short. I love what Dudley brings to this team but the last time I saw Josh play he was quite a bit better than Duds. Despite his frame, he's tough and in my opinion, he's a winner. Like Dudley, he'll do whatever is necessary to help the team but he's much more athletic than Jarod so he's even more effective at it. The addition of a 3 point shot to Dudley's game narrows the field somewhat but I'd still give Josh the solid advantage.

I think you can win it all with Childress as a starter. He may not be the reason you win it all but he won't be an anchor dragging you down either. I don't know how much has changed in his game since he went overseas but I think he's going to help us quite a bit.

Steve

I'd pay admission just to watch Dudley attempt a 360 dunk.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I'd pay admission just to watch Dudley attempt a 360 dunk.

If Jarod buys a Nerf ball and hoop you're gonna be out a few dollars.

Steve

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I'd pay admission just to watch Dudley attempt a 360 dunk.

how someone can be 6'7 and not be able to 360 dunk is beyond me.

 

[Gaddabout]

how someone can be 6'7 and not be able to 360 dunk is beyond me.

I could never throw down, but at 5-11 I was still able to get the ball over the rim jumping off my left foot. And I was a very mediocre athlete. Anyone 6-2 or taller has no excuse, IMO.

That said, doing any kind of dunk in a game is an entirely different skill than dunking when no one's around. You don't have time to think or stabilize your body. It's why J-Rich needs to permanently end his showboating dunk attempts. Just because he can do that silly stuff in practice doesn't mean he can pull it off in a game. In the NBA, if you're by yourself at the hoop, you need to shoot 100 percent. Period. Take the easy 2.

 

[SunsTzu]

Anyone 6-2 or taller has no excuse, IMO.

Easy to say if you don't have flat feet.