Feeling Cornered

Krangodnzr

Captain of Team Murray
Joined
Jul 21, 2002
Posts
34,111
Reaction score
29,960
Location
Orange County, CA
Pass Rushers over CBs every day. I personally prefer interior pass rushers to Edge Rushers. I felt teams/QBs nowadays deal with edge pressure much better than interior pressure. A disruptive DT can be way more intimidating and do much more damage than an explosive DE/OLB.
Easier said than done though.

A guy who can consistently disrupt from the interior is worth his weight in gold.
 

Krangodnzr

Captain of Team Murray
Joined
Jul 21, 2002
Posts
34,111
Reaction score
29,960
Location
Orange County, CA
49ers are in the championship game with a bunch of nobodies at CB. Rams have Jalen Ramsey then some guys. Bengals are in the AFCCG with Eli Apple and Awuzie at CB.

Hell even the Chiefs with Ward, Sneed and Hughes aren't a stellar group.

The days of WR1 lined up vs CB1 are gone. Teams are spreading the ball around. You no longer need a star CB, you need a bunch of decent guys. And the league has adjusted to that.

The average spend on the CB room last season across the league was $12.6m over 6 players.

Wilson, Murphy, Alford, Hamilton and someone like Bryce Callaghan or Xavier Rhodes would be a good group. The FA market is pretty stacked with quality roster depth this offseason and the market is depressed.

Someone like Casey Hayward (who I said we should sign last season but was told was cooked and then had a great year) would be a good addition.

What our backfield lacked last year was vet experience when Alford was out. I'm not really keen to add another 21 year old to an already young defense.
I'd like to add a similar prospect to Marco Wilson and add a veteran CB.

Bringing back Alford is just begging for a FOURTH season ending injury.
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
20,956
Reaction score
36,916
Location
UK
I'd like to add a similar prospect to Marco Wilson and add a veteran CB.

Bringing back Alford is just begging for a FOURTH season ending injury.

If he's your 4th CB and playing 20 snaps a game, maybe coming in later in the season to cover for banged up players I don;t think the risk if that great. But for vet min it's worth the risk. Lots of value at vet min.
 

Stout

Hold onto the ball, Murray!
Joined
Dec 30, 2002
Posts
37,812
Reaction score
20,357
Location
Pittsburgh, PA--Enemy territory!
If he's your 4th CB and playing 20 snaps a game, maybe coming in later in the season to cover for banged up players I don;t think the risk if that great. But for vet min it's worth the risk. Lots of value at vet min.
He's not going to be the 4th CB and play a bunch of special teams, though, will he? Has to be able to do that so low on the CB depth chart.
 

JeffGollin

ASFN Icon
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
20,472
Reaction score
3,056
Location
Holmdel, NJ
We need to be two deep (or better) in qualitpy CB1's and CB2's. You can never have too many quality corners.
 

JohnnyCakes

Miserables
Banned from P+R
Joined
Oct 28, 2020
Posts
3,159
Reaction score
2,575
Location
Phoenix
We need to be two deep (or better) in qualitpy CB1's and CB2's. You can never have too many quality corners.

what is frustrating about this is Byron murphy and marco wilson ( based on where they were drafted ) should be our #1 and #2 for years.
 
Joined
Nov 15, 2002
Posts
13,271
Reaction score
1,133
Location
SE Valley
Good write up even though it was hard to get past Stingley being better than an 8 time pro bowler, 3 time first team all-pro, and likely HOF'er on his best day.
On the other hand, it doesn't take much to be better than PP on his best day, NOW! It has literally been years since that "likely HOF'er" played like one!
And I say this having loved seeing PP at his best; even then however he didn't come close to Aeneas' best!
 

Russ Smith

The Original Whizzinator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
84,165
Reaction score
32,731
Do we need to trade up to get the Edge guy or can we get him where we are picking? My suspicion is we might have to trade up. Not saying we shouldn't, I think we have the same issue if we go WR or CB, I think we're picking too late to guarantee any of those 3 spots getting good value, especially with Keim picking.
 

oaken1

Stone Cold
Supporting Member
Banned from P+R
Joined
Mar 13, 2004
Posts
16,138
Reaction score
12,315
Location
Modesto, California
Which is why we should go EDGE over CB with our first pick & build a foundation from there.
I agree we need to address the defensive front in a big way...and we need chans replacement almost desparately.
but there is only....three guys?? in this draft....and they will all be gone before 20...as much as folks hate it...our best value chance in the first round....maybe WR2.
I mean, im the crazy guy....I would draft a center in round one... but there aint a round 1 center in this draft..... folks are hyping the iowa kid but he is too small and limited by what blocking schemes he can play...Lyle Seindlein 2.0
value wise, for edge...our best bet is probably with our 2nd round pick.

be nice if Vance gets that miami job so we get a free third. but as it sits right now I am thinking

1. WR2
2. Edge
3. Center/guard
3. Runningback
4. DE/CB
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
20,956
Reaction score
36,916
Location
UK
I agree we need to address the defensive front in a big way...and we need chans replacement almost desparately.
but there is only....three guys?? in this draft....and they will all be gone before 20...as much as folks hate it...our best value chance in the first round....maybe WR2.
I mean, im the crazy guy....I would draft a center in round one... but there aint a round 1 center in this draft..... folks are hyping the iowa kid but he is too small and limited by what blocking schemes he can play...Lyle Seindlein 2.0
value wise, for edge...our best bet is probably with our 2nd round pick.

be nice if Vance gets that miami job so we get a free third. but as it sits right now I am thinking

1. WR2
2. Edge
3. Center/guard
3. Runningback
4. DE/CB

I don't think you can take WR high in a class so deep. There will be guys going late round 2 and early round 3 barely any drop off from guys in the top 20.
 

oaken1

Stone Cold
Supporting Member
Banned from P+R
Joined
Mar 13, 2004
Posts
16,138
Reaction score
12,315
Location
Modesto, California
I don't think you can take WR high in a class so deep. There will be guys going late round 2 and early round 3 barely any drop off from guys in the top 20.
yeah well...25 or wherever it is we pick... that aint high. for this draft,...corner and wr... thats where the value is in the late first. this season proved without a doubt that our offensive system cant work without an absolute badass at WR... and we cant be dependent on DHop forever,...so we need another... we need a Jamarr Chase
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
20,956
Reaction score
36,916
Location
UK
yeah well...25 or wherever it is we pick... that aint high. for this draft,...corner and wr... thats where the value is in the late first. this season proved without a doubt that our offensive system cant work without an absolute badass at WR... and we cant be dependent on DHop forever,...so we need another... we need a Jamarr Chase

We can take WR in the 2nd if needed.

We pick at #23. The average WR's taken before pick #23 in round 2 the last 5 years is 6.6. It's only been over 7 once.

This class is stacked.

Wilson, Williams, London, Olave and Burks are almost certainly gone. But still bunch will be available from Skyy Moore, Metchie, Dotson, Pickens, Bell, Ross etc.

I like Justyn Ross personally.
 

DVontel

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 28, 2015
Posts
12,328
Reaction score
20,938
We can take WR in the 2nd if needed.

We pick at #23. The average WR's taken before pick #23 in round 2 the last 5 years is 6.6. It's only been over 7 once.

This class is stacked.

Wilson, Williams, London, Olave and Burks are almost certainly gone. But still bunch will be available from Skyy Moore, Metchie, Dotson, Pickens, Bell, Ross etc.
I’m pretty sure Pickens, Dotson, or Bell won’t make it to our 2nd.

The others are WR3s at best.
 

Crimson Warrior

Dangerous Murray Zealot
Joined
Oct 27, 2002
Posts
7,519
Reaction score
7,205
Location
Home of the Thunder
We can take WR in the 2nd if needed.

We pick at #23. The average WR's taken before pick #23 in round 2 the last 5 years is 6.6. It's only been over 7 once.

This class is stacked.

Wilson, Williams, London, Olave and Burks are almost certainly gone. But still bunch will be available from Skyy Moore, Metchie, Dotson, Pickens, Bell, Ross etc.

I like Justyn Ross personally.

Good info to know at least man, thanks.
 

oaken1

Stone Cold
Supporting Member
Banned from P+R
Joined
Mar 13, 2004
Posts
16,138
Reaction score
12,315
Location
Modesto, California
We can take WR in the 2nd if needed.

We pick at #23. The average WR's taken before pick #23 in round 2 the last 5 years is 6.6. It's only been over 7 once.

This class is stacked.

Wilson, Williams, London, Olave and Burks are almost certainly gone. But still bunch will be available from Skyy Moore, Metchie, Dotson, Pickens, Bell, Ross etc.

I like Justyn Ross personally.
there are lots of guys. but with there only being one QB at the moment,... about three edge, a couple OT's.... the entire depth of quality in this draft is at WR and CB... the problem with CB is the same as last year... the dudes who would go late first or early second all have injury issues... that leaves WR as the place to find value.
I mean.... we can reach for an edge guy that should be picked around 40... it aint a huge reach. I just think we will get better value at edge with our second pick.
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
20,956
Reaction score
36,916
Location
UK
I’m pretty sure Pickens, Dotson, or Bell won’t make it to our 2nd.

The others are WR3s at best.

Everyone always says "X, Y and Z won;t make it to X spot" they said the same thing about DK Metcalf. All teams have their needs but the last couple of classes have been deep at WR too and a lot of teams have already drafted high pick WRs. They have other needs they need to take care of.

I disagree guys like Justyn Ross are WR3's. He was the #15 player in his recruiting class. As a Freshman he had 1000 yards and 9 TDs at 21.7 average. He missed all 2020 with an injury but he's very talented and guys like Skyy Moore are going to be great NFL receivers.
 

DVontel

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 28, 2015
Posts
12,328
Reaction score
20,938
Everyone always says "X, Y and Z won;t make it to X spot" they said the same thing about DK Metcalf.
No they don’t. Also, no they didn’t. A lot of people expected DK to fall due to his previous neck injury + 3 cone time.


I disagree guys like Justyn Ross are WR3's. He was the #15 player in his recruiting class.
Ah okay, something that happened 5-6 years ago. It’s not like his production or traits have gotten worse or anything.




We should definitely wait until Day 2 to draft a WR, especially with Steve Keim’s track record & all.
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
20,956
Reaction score
36,916
Location
UK
No they don’t. Also, no they didn’t. A lot of people expected DK to fall due to his previous neck injury + 3 cone time.



Ah okay, something that happened 5-6 years ago. It’s not like his production or traits have gotten worse or anything.




We should definitely wait until Day 2 to draft a WR, especially with Steve Keim’s track record & all.

Sorry you're right, only the top 4 players at WR are ever any good...
 

DVontel

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 28, 2015
Posts
12,328
Reaction score
20,938
Sorry you're right, only the top 4 players at WR are ever any good...
I thought YOU of all people would learn the most after being so anti-1st round WR in 2020, especially under this regime.

I guess not.
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
20,956
Reaction score
36,916
Location
UK
I thought YOU of all people would learn the most after being so anti-1st round WR in 2020, especially under this regime.

I guess not.

Learn what? I'm always anti 1st round every position that's deep. Which is often WR's and RB's.

Your 1st round picks should be spent on players that cost the most to pay and are in the shortest supply. Tackles, QB's, Edge rushers, Cornerbacks (not this year as it's deep but most years).

Personally if I was GM I might not ever draft anything but those 4 positions unless I was stacked and then I would move on to others.
 

Chopper0080

2021 - Prove It
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
26,584
Reaction score
34,566
Location
Colorado
Stingley going to go lower than people think. His tape the past two years has been average at best.
 

Crimson Warrior

Dangerous Murray Zealot
Joined
Oct 27, 2002
Posts
7,519
Reaction score
7,205
Location
Home of the Thunder
Stingley going to go lower than people think. His tape the past two years has been average at best.

Here's a mock that has us trading up to #10 to get Stingley!

 
Top