Deandre Ayton discussion

[Covert Rain]

Ayton had a few mini relapses of regular-season-Ayton last night. Fumbled a few passes and such. Was there another play where he just made a bad turnover, idr, i'm trying to recall the play.

Not really. He didn't have a great numbers night but he did his job. They didn't need him to put up offense. He still managed 7 rebounds and he altered shots all night. He made Lebron pass out of the paint multiple times last night. He made other guys take really tough shots. Something I have been saying all season long....Ayton has been altering shots all season long and not getting credit for it from the fans because his numbers were not great. There is a reason most of Lebron's points came from the 3.

 

[WhyAlwaysMe]

Ayton got doubled in the paint off the ball almost every possession.


BUT HIS NUMBERZ

 

[Covert Rain]

P.S. Did you watch the pre-game? The Lakers wanted more Gasol to pull Ayton away from the paint. They figured if Gasol was making threes it would pull Ayton away from the bucket and allow Lebron to drive. So, even the Lakers don't want Ayton down there.

 

[Hoop Head]

Lol just stop

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That doesn't change the fact that he had a few mental lapses. Its fine, no need to get.all bent.out of shape because someone points that out. Booker also had a poor stretch when Paul got hurt in the 3rd and posters pointed that out. Its possible to be happy with a players performance while pointing out a couple of things they didn't do well.

 

[Covert Rain]

That doesn't change the fact that he had a few mental lapses. Its fine, no need to get.all bent.out of shape because someone points that out. Booker also had a poor stretch when Paul got hurt in the 3rd and posters pointed that out. Its possible to be happy with a players performance while pointing out a couple of things they didn't do well.

That's fair but the good was not also called out in that same post.

 

[Hoop Head]

That's fair but the good was not also called out in that same post.

True but the post wasn't really that negative. It seemed to mention a couple of plays. Pointing out some small issues shouldn't require balancing with talk of his positive plays. Especially when it wasn't that negative.

Ill admit I'm overly critical of Ayton a lot of the times, and I'm not alone in the regard. I've also noticed that his defenders seem overly defensive of him, especially when he has a good game.

 

[Treesquid PhD]

No, I'm fully prepared to admit I was wrong in the fall of 2022, once we get the full story. I never doubted that Paul would make the Suns better in the short term, if he could stay healthy. As far as the regular season is concerned, he surpassed my expectations, but that really doesn't impact the equation.

If the Suns lose this series in 6, they take a step backward next year, Paul is no longer on the roster for the 2022-23 season, and Booker has decided he's ready to move on to a real contender, is that still a success to you? And if not, what makes you so confident that we'll avoid that scenario?

Booker isn't going to leave the Suns now, the Suns will extend him through age 30. The Suns are one legit star from being a championship team. While you all froth at the mouth over Frank Kaminsky and Dario Saric. James jones knows what needs to get done.

If this was Babby or RMD, sure Id agree, but I have a hard time believing James Jones would just dismantle the core, and stack it with fan favs.

If anything I'd ditch Frank and pick up that guy from LA who is a really good 6th man, but isn't playing for some reason.

I'd also move on from Dario, yes I know this board loves Dario, but he is losing coordination quickly and he is only 26/27, the dude will be Joe Klein by 29/30.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

That's fair but the good was not also called out in that same post.

Doesn’t really have to be for the criticism to still be a valid point.

that said, Ayton had a slightly invisible first quarter and then erupted (for him) in the second quarter. Eventually not much was needed from him.

 

[Chaplin]

Booker isn't going to leave the Suns now, the Suns will extend him through age 30. The Suns are one legit star from being a championship team. While you all froth at the mouth over Frank Kaminsky and Dario Saric. James jones knows what needs to get done.

If this was Babby or RMD, sure Id agree, but I have a hard time believing James Jones would just dismantle the core, and stack it with fan favs.

If anything I'd ditch Frank and pick up that guy from LA who is a really good 6th man, but isn't playing for some reason.

I'd also move on from Dario, yes I know this board loves Dario, but he is losing coordination quickly and he is only 26/27, the dude will be Joe Klein by 29/30.

Who exactly is frothing at the mouth about Frank and Dario?

 

[Cheesebeef]

Booker isn't going to leave the Suns now, the Suns will extend him through age 30. The Suns are one legit star from being a championship team. While you all froth at the mouth over Frank Kaminsky and Dario Saric. James jones knows what needs to get done.

If this was Babby or RMD, sure Id agree, but I have a hard time believing James Jones would just dismantle the core, and stack it with fan favs.

If anything I'd ditch Frank and pick up that guy from LA who is a really good 6th man, but isn't playing for some reason.

I'd also move on from Dario, yes I know this board loves Dario, but he is losing coordination quickly and he is only 26/27, the dude will be Joe Klein by 29/30.

i think the board has fallen out of love with Dario for quite a while now.

 

[Covert Rain]

Doesn’t really have to be for the criticism to still be a valid point.

that said, Ayton had a slightly invisible first quarter and then erupted (for him) in the second quarter. Eventually not much was needed from him.

Nobody was saying that. Just responding to the response really. People are already overlycritial and sensitive about Ayton. If you are going to take the time to be critical at least give him credit as well.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Who exactly is frothing at the mouth about Frank and Dario?

maybe he takes our TANK! posts as a sign we think he's great, instead of the elation that he actually contributes at all. I mean, at this point the TANK! SUPER DARIO! posts are firmly tongue in cheek. We know what those guys are, but doesn't mean we ain't gonna celebrate when they do something good.

 

[Covert Rain]

maybe he takes our TANK! posts as a sign we think he's great, instead of the elation that he actually contributes at all. I mean, at this point the TANK! SUPER DARIO! posts are firmly tongue in cheek. We know what those guys are, but doesn't mean we ain't gonna celebrate when they do something good.

I have a bunch of buddies that watch the game and talk on a Suns Messenger group during the game (sort of what we used to have here - Live chat). One of them kept saying Super Dario bring him in. Except he was serious.

 

[Treesquid PhD]

There is no way in hell that the Suns should be paying Paul $35M+ in 2022-23.

There is no way in hell the Suns should be paying Dario 8.3 million per. You can use this argument on any player. Paul is worth what the market bears, not how you feel about it. That's how a woman thinks, with feelings

I can easily see Jones, going to Paul and saying look we will extend you through 2024, but we also want to get one more guy to take us to the championship. If Paul can't handle that, poo Payne is entering his prime, he is a right hand away from being KJ with a 40% 3PFG.

Also, if Paul stays....This is a legit NBA destination with Booker being 26, Ayton 23, Bridges 25ish, Cam Payne 27, Can Johnson 25ish. They have a legit core, that's why Crowder wanted to be herein he is only 30.

Just clean up a few things get rid of Dario he is still young and you can use him as a trade piece, cut Kaminsky, resign Payne and Craig. And use Googles and Dario as part of a trade deal to complete the core, then go get a real back up big and this is a 60 win team.

Go suns!

 

[Covert Rain]

There is no way in hell the Suns should be paying Dario 8.3 million per. You can use this argument on any player. Paul is worth what the market bears, not how you feel about it. That's how a woman thinks, with feelings

I can easily see Jones, going to Paul and saying look we will extend you through 2024, but we also want to get one more guy to take us to the championship. If Paul can't handle that, **** Payne is entering his prime, he is a right hand away from being KJ with a 40% 3PFG.

Also, if Paul stays....This is a legit NBA destination with Booker being 26, Ayton 23, Bridges 25ish, Cam Payne 27, Can Johnson 25ish. They have a legit core, that's why Crowder wanted to be herein he is only 30.

Just clean up a few things get rid of Dario he is still young and you can use him as a trade piece, cut Kaminsky, resign Payne and Craig. And use Googles and Dario as part of a trade deal to complete the core, then go get a real back up big and this is a 60 win team.

Go suns!

Not sure what the market dictates a backup PF is worth but that's what he is. I wouldn't argue with he is not worth 8.3 million but I have not done the research. Off the top of my head I agree. Seems like the Cap space is better spent elsewhere.

 

[Treesquid PhD]

I have a bunch of buddies that watch the game and talk on a Suns Messenger group during the game (sort of what we used to have here - Live chat). One of them kept saying Super Dario bring him in. Except he was serious.

I have a lot of friends who love Dario and Frank. White role players are always incredibly popular. There is so much historical proof of this, let me bust out my Kurt Rambis free give away glasses from the game I went to in 2nd grade.

 

[Treesquid PhD]

Not sure what the market dictates a backup PF is worth but that's what he is. I wouldn't argue with he is not worth 8.3 million but I have not done the research. Off the top of my head I agree. Seems like the Cap space is better spent elsewhere.

It's probably a fair deal, I think Jalen Smith is making like 5M as a top 10 pick NBA money is so out of wack with reality, it makes no sense to almost anyone.

The reason I think Dario should be gone is because, he is ok, but he is still young and tradable. Cash in now baby.

Sorry I was wrong here is Smith's deal. I mean right there, anyone complaining about Paul has no perspective on how little you have to do to make spaceballs money. Can you imagine making 4.2M for just being there? lol, I wouldn't even try hard because he is set for life.

J. Smith Season Phoenix Suns
2020/21 $4,245,720
2021/22 $4,458,000
2022/23 $4,670,160
2023/24 $5,954,454

I worked in tech and made great money, but my lifetime salary (35 years) would be 1.5 years of what Smith is making. And I drive Model 3 the fast one and own several properties. NBA money is so insane. I am hoping Paul restructures and gives Jones room to add the final pieces And Booker isn't going anywhere. If only someone like Larry Fitzgerald could mentor Booker about legacy and how to accomplish lifetime goals and be revered forever and rich?How amazing would that be for Booker to have that access, well to bad, I guess Booker is gone.

 

[WhyAlwaysMe]

That doesn't change the fact that he had a few mental lapses. Its fine, no need to get.all bent.out of shape because someone points that out. Booker also had a poor stretch when Paul got hurt in the 3rd and posters pointed that out. Its possible to be happy with a players performance while pointing out a couple of things they didn't do well.

Pointing out a few mental lapses is fine. Saying nothing else in a post about Ayton in this series is nothing short of hilarious.

 

[WhyAlwaysMe]

True but the post wasn't really that negative. It seemed to mention a couple of plays. Pointing out some small issues shouldn't require balancing with talk of his positive plays. Especially when it wasn't that negative.

Ill admit I'm overly critical of Ayton a lot of the times, and I'm not alone in the regard. I've also noticed that his defenders seem overly defensive of him, especially when he has a good game.

How about when he is the best player in a playoff series involving multiple hall of famers as a 22 y/o still figuring out his game?

 

[Hoop Head]

How about when he is the best player in a playoff series involving multiple hall of famers as a 22 y/o still figuring out his game?

He's been really good but claiming he's been the best player in this series is overstating his impact.

 

[Covert Rain]

He's been really good but claiming he's been the best player in this series is overstating his impact.

No it's not. You want to make the case Booker has been just as good. I am good with that. We are not in this series without Ayton.

 

[WhyAlwaysMe]

Doesn’t really have to be for the criticism to still be a valid point.

that said, Ayton had a slightly invisible first quarter and then erupted (for him) in the second quarter. Eventually not much was needed from him.

false

defense was hyper keyed on him and Book and Payne had ACRES of space to operate as a result. also played stellar d.

 

[WhyAlwaysMe]

He's been really good but claiming he's been the best player in this series is overstating his impact.

he has 100% been the best player

best RTG split of key players
best efficiency
Most WS
Best WS/48 of key players

 

[Hoop Head]

No it's not. You want to make the case Booker has been just as good. I am good with that. We are not in this series without Ayton.

Ill give Ayton game 1, game 2 was AD, game 3 was LeBron, game 4 was Paul, and game 5 was Booker. That's what I saw.

I would say Booker has been better in our wins than Ayton but Ayton was more consistent through the losses. I'd give Booker the edge now for how he played Schroeder the last 2 games on D and also how his performances have resulted in wins. Even though I said Ayton was the best player in game 1, Booker was not far behind in that one.

That's not knocking Ayton by any means. He's doing more than I expected of him. I hope to see this version of him more often. I just wish he expanded his offensive game more so he could be a real option we could go to for easy buckets when our outside shots aren't falling.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

There is no way in hell the Suns should be paying Dario 8.3 million per. You can use this argument on any player. Paul is worth what the market bears, not how you feel about it. That's how a woman thinks, with feelings

I can easily see Jones, going to Paul and saying look we will extend you through 2024, but we also want to get one more guy to take us to the championship. If Paul can't handle that, **** Payne is entering his prime, he is a right hand away from being KJ with a 40% 3PFG.

Also, if Paul stays....This is a legit NBA destination with Booker being 26, Ayton 23, Bridges 25ish, Cam Payne 27, Can Johnson 25ish. They have a legit core, that's why Crowder wanted to be herein he is only 30.

Just clean up a few things get rid of Dario he is still young and you can use him as a trade piece, cut Kaminsky, resign Payne and Craig. And use Googles and Dario as part of a trade deal to complete the core, then go get a real back up big and this is a 60 win team.

Go suns!

Good to see you wearing your misogyny on your sleeve. Yeesh