D-Back implicated in steroids probe.

Southpaw

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sly fly said:
Too bad Bonds wasn't caught the same way.

Imagine the look on Grimsley's face when the Feds came a knockin'?

Bonds has always said, " I never failed a drug test I have taken ". Those were all urine tests. HGH requires a blood test, which baseball does not do, because the MLB heirarchy and unions won't allow it. Gee, I wonder what Bonds is using?
 

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HooverDam said:
You know if you take a picture of someone when they are like 21, and another at age 30, they do look different. Especially after a career of weight lifting and training.
You could say the same for Bonds?????
 

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insider said:
You could say the same for Bonds?????

What exercise makes your head bigger. The guy is carrying around a watermelon on his neck.
 

devilalum

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devilfan02 said:
It's MLB's problem. They didn't ban steroids, now they have to deal with it. However, to say there's nothing wrong with Durazo doing steroids because he's from Mexico is rediculous. Sure, it's legal there but it's still cheating and thats the bottom line. If he were to fail a steriod test in the U.S., whether he did them in mexico or not, it would still be a crime.

Not the cheating arguement.:bang:

Baseball is all about cheating.
  • Stealing signs
  • scuffing balls
  • spit balls
  • corked bats
  • stepping into pitches
 

devilalum

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wallyburger said:
What exercise makes your head bigger. The guy is carrying around a watermelon on his neck.

Eternal constipation.:shrug:
 

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Gonzo? Are you kidding me? The guy has the EXACT same body he has had his entire career.

How is that relevant? When did Grimsley get big? Or for that matter, when did Palmeiro get big? Not every cheater looks like Bonds, McGwire, Caminiti or Canseco.

There is nobody on the D-Backs who is more suspect than Gonzo. We are talking about a guy who didnt hit 57 home runs in his 1st 6 years in the big leagues. In his 1st 3 years of minor league ball, he never hit more than 7 homes runs. Then out of nowhere he hits just a handful less than Maris? I think it is incredibly naïve to think that Gonzo is one of the good-guys.

I had a great time watching that magical season, but it was tainted. The whole sport was tainted, and it still is.

.

In regards to other D-Backs who were juicing. One name that has not been mentioned is Unit.

Anyone who subscribed to bodybuilding mags in the late 1990's/early 2000's remembers seeing Randy Johnson mug everywhere pimping AST Sports Science products. AST-SS found its niche in the supplement market by selling products that contain ephedra and pro-hormones most of which are now illegal (and tested for by MLB).

http://www.ast-ss.com/dev/qa_search/full_text.asp?ID=1213

AST-SS has since modified Dymetadrine Extreme due to the ephedra ban, but as few as 2 years ago it was on the market and legal.

I know...just because Unit pimped a supplement doesnt mean that he used steroids. I understand that it may be a stretch. The fact is however, he looked to drugs...err supplements...to gain an edge. Supplements that are now banned. I may be wrong, but at this point I think the players are guilty and need to prove themselves innocent.

.

My own feelings on baseball? It is a mess right now. I don’t believe that any player is above suspicion. Over the past couple years we have had more than one MVP admit to using and everyone from future HOF’ers to countless scrubs busted with MLB’s weak attempt at testing. There is a huge problem, and it is only going to get uglier from here.
 
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Smizik: In sharp contrast to Bonds, Clemens avoids scrutiny

Sunday, May 15, 2005
By Bob Smizik, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

A strong body of evidence is slowly emerging that points to what so many have long believed: Barry Bonds is a steroid abuser.

Virtually no one is surprised because Bonds long has been under such suspicion. After all, he went from being a Hall-of-Fame caliber player to an all-time great, whose hitting prowess matched and often surpassed the likes of Babe Ruth and Ted Williams. Baseball fans and the media were skeptical of such accomplishments. It was believed such prodigious feats could not be achieved without chemical assistance.

No question, Bonds' deeds have been staggering.

In 2001, he hit 73 home runs to break Roger Maris' record, which had stood for 40 years. That same season, he had an .863 slugging percentage, which broke Ruth's record that had stood for 80 years.

In 2002, he had an on-base percentage of .582, which broke Williams' record that had stood for 60 years.

He had won three MVP awards, two with the Pirates, by the time he was 29. When he added what would be the first of four more when he was 37, doubts increased.

No one was that good.

Of course, it was more than the majesty of Bonds' achievements that raised suspicion. The size of his body also screamed steroids use.

Where he was once a sleek greyhound, he now bulged with muscles. He had gained at least 40 pounds.

Although there was not an iota of concrete evidence and was not against the rules of baseball at the time, Bonds was widely believed to be a cheater.

It all made sense, even to those -- including this column -- that had long defended Bonds.

So why aren't people saying the same thing about Roger Clemens? Why hasn't this bulked-up, overperforming baseball senior citizen received the same treatment as Bonds?

For sure, his accomplishments are equally astounding. In fact, the case could be made that the trajectory of Clemens' career should arouse more suspicion than Bonds'.

Unlike Bonds, whose career never faltered, Clemens had a four-year period, beginning when he was 30, when many people believed he was in decline. Included in that group were the Boston Red Sox, the team he played for during the first 13 years of his career. After the 1997 season, the Red Sox did not re-sign Clemens, who was eligible for free agency. It seemed like the right move.

After going 152-72 in his first nine seasons, Clemens was 40-39 from 1993-96. What's more, his winning percentage twice was below that of his team during that four-year stretch, something that had never happened in the previous nine seasons.

Also during the span, Clemens' earned run average twice was over 4.00, a level where it had never been before.

It was a clear picture of a player in decline. And why not? He was 34 when he finished the 1996 season with a 10-13 record on a team that was eight games over .500.

Except that he wasn't in decline. Not even close.

He signed with the Toronto Blue Jays in 1997 and, on a team that was 10 games under .500, he was 21-7. It was the first time he had won 20 games since 1990. His ERA of 2.05 was the second lowest of his career.

Once again, he was Superman. And, of course, it was all due to his incredible workout routine. There was never a word about chemical enhancement.

It's not like Clemens was some kind of media favorite. Like Bonds, he has a history of being a major jerk.

Clemens is 42 and pitching as well or better than ever.

Last year, he was 18-4 with the Houston Astros -- the third-best winning percentage of his career. He won his seventh Cy Young Award -- 18 seasons after he won his first.

Going into his scheduled start against the San Francisco Giants last night, he was averaging better than a strikeout an inning and his ERA was a ridiculous 1.10.

In his tell-all book, "Juiced; Wild Times, Rampant 'Roids, Smash Hits, and How Baseball Got Big," Jose Canseco wrote: "I've never seen Roger Clemens do steroids, and he never told me that he did. But we've talked about what steroids could do for you, in which combinations."

He also said Clemens showed "classic signs" of steroid use.

Clemens' agent, Randy Hendricks was furious. "He has passed all tests and will continue to do so in 2005."

The same tests Bonds passed.

There's never a word about Randy Johnson, who is 41, and steroids, but he might be the greatest overproducing baseball senior of them all. Bonds had offensive numbers that sometimes surpassed the great hitting masters. Johnson has strikeout totals that obliterate the performance of Nolan Ryan, the greatest strikeout pitcher of all time.

From ages 34 to 40 -- seven seasons -- Johnson had more than 300 strikeouts five times. He had 290 once.

When Ryan was between 34 and 40, he had no 300-strikeout seasons and only three 200-strikeout seasons.

Next to Johnson, Ryan is a junkballer.

But Johnson, too, is widely believed to be clean.

None of the above is to suggest I think Clemens and Johnson are steroid abusers.

Of course, I didn't think Bonds was either
 

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Charles V said:
How is that relevant? When did Grimsley get big? Or for that matter, when did Palmeiro get big? Not every cheater looks like Bonds, McGwire, Caminiti or Canseco.

There is nobody on the D-Backs who is more suspect than Gonzo. We are talking about a guy who didnt hit 57 home runs in his 1st 6 years in the big leagues. In his 1st 3 years of minor league ball, he never hit more than 7 homes runs. Then out of nowhere he hits just a handful less than Maris? I think it is incredibly naïve to think that Gonzo is one of the good-guys.

I agree with most your post and the fact that if any Dback should be accused of using, it's Gonzo. However, there are two sides to every allegation. For example, the size of players when they entered the majors compared to now is used as a indicator of steriod/hgh use. As you said, Palmeiro didn't get big like McGwire, Sosa, Bonds and neither did Grimsley. The same can be said for "breakout years." You mentioned Maris above.... Well he never sniffed the 61 homeruns he hit in 1961. In fact, the most home runs he hit in a season besides 1961 was 39 the year before. So does that mean he juiced? Absolutely not. The bottom line is that a failed test or a boatload of evidence (Bonds and Grimsleys case) is the only way we can truly find a player guilty, not by body type changes and breakout years
 

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He was one of my favorite players when he played here, but Junior Spivey is as clear candidate you would find. I remember everyone in the clubhouse would comment about his physique in mock awe. He was on the cover of the monthly D-back program this one time and his arms were the size of tree trunks.
 

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Spivey was DEFINITELY juicing. I saw him the other night at a Sidewinders game playing for the Cards AAA team, and I didn't even recognize him. He has shrunk SO MUCH. He is no bigger than a high school kid now with skinny arms and legs. His average last month was a whopping .162
 

Ryanwb

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Spivey is the poster child of why steroids are used. A low draft pick with nothing to lose, juices up and all of the sudden he's in the All Star game
 
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