Booker Question

[1tinsoldier]

if Booker can improve his defense with a good coach and defensive minded supporting cast, there's no reason Lillard can't. he's strong, agile, and focused.

i'd only hesitate because you could get twice as many good years out of Booker than Lillard (but if Lillard wants out, Portland could sweeten the deal)

 

[AzStevenCal]

when he isn't frustrated, he might indeed be mature for 24. there's a lot of bright, mature people who get stupid when agitated.

Okay but you're talking about a handful of minor incidents; no road rage, no tower climbing with a sniper rifle, just minor reactions. He hasn't thrown a punch, hasn't attacked a referee - and the list of players that have gone much further over the line than Devin has is long. And that list includes some pretty big names.

I have some problems with his decision making but they aren't centered around emotional outbursts as your concerns seem to focus on. He is quite probably the worst decision maker (or executor of said decisions) when looking at a 2 for 1 situation. Additionally he takes an ill-advised shot or two almost every game and he makes an occasional wild or lazy pass almost every game. These are the kind of decision making issues that drop him from incredible to very good.

If he eliminated those kind of things he'd be in the conversation for the best player in the game IMO. Right now he's probably just barely in the top 20. Regardless, you don't look for opportunities to trade 24 year old stars even if they peak at 20th best in the game. And I have no reason to believe he's peaked.

 

[Covert Rain]

if Booker can improve his defense with a good coach and defensive minded supporting cast, there's no reason Lillard can't. he's strong, agile, and focused.

i'd only hesitate because you could get twice as many good years out of Booker than Lillard (but if Lillard wants out, Portland could sweeten the deal)

What?!? History in the NBA says you are wrong. A 31 year old (next year) will not transform his game. Players at that age are what they are. Booker is 24 and still basically a kid in the NBA. There is no comparison at all.

There is no world in which this trade not only makes the team worse defensively but is outright dumb.

 

[1tinsoldier]

making the team smarter is not "dumb", and i doubt Lillard is so awful defensively that, suddenly, we just can't bare to part with Booker's defense!

don't Booker the ball by letting your emotions get the best of you

Lillard's the better player. but that trade is just my opinion and will never happen because of Booker's age and upside and the fact that his flawed decision-making can be managed by a good coach and point guard

like some posters here, he's smart enough until his bumped

 

[Covert Rain]

making the team smarter is not "dumb", and i doubt Lillard is so awful defensively that, suddenly, we just can't bare to part with Booker's defense!

don't Booker the ball by letting your emotions get the best of you

Lillard's the better player. but that trade is just my opinion and will never happen because of Booker's age and upside and the fact that his flawed decision-making can be managed by a good coach and point guard

like some posters here, he's smart enough until his bumped

Smarter? Lillard only averages .5 less turnovers per game. Books TO average is slightly inflated because of all the time he was forced to play PG. Lillard has been in the top 5 worst defenders list before. Booker also has to be smart in other aspects of his game. Lillard is a great offensive player but your entire logic has to do with his clutch shooting which only comes into play if the game is close.

Giving up defense for more offense is dumb when every pro analyst has said that is the reason for our turnaround. Giving up a 24 year old that has gotten better every year for a 31 year old that won't change is dumb.

Emotions has nothing to do with it. Logic does. I have blasted Book the past 3 games and plenty throughout his career here. If there was a way to add Lillard without giving up Book? That is an entirely different discussion. I have never questions Lillard's ability to score.

 

[1tinsoldier]

couple of problems:
1. when you say "Books TO average is slightly inflated because of all the time he was forced to play PG," you are conceding that if his position was point guard, like Lillard's is, his turnovers would be even higher.
2. you say, in the "past" Lillard was rated poorly in defense, but don't mention how Booker was rated in that past
3. when games aren't close it doesn't matter if you have Booker or Lillard. but many are, and Lillard is a much better closer. it's critical in the playoffs

statistics and player rankings favor Lillard
and that's not considering Booker's team deflating:
T's
frustration fouls
bad shot selection
on-court barking at teammates
holding the ball and forcing shots instead of playing team offense (like Harden used to do before CP3 dissed and ditched Houston)

age and potential favor Booker

enough said
now let's both hope Booker gets back to his better self tonight for a glorious return to the Finals

 

[Covert Rain]

couple of problems:
1. when you say "Books TO average is slightly inflated because of all the time he was forced to play PG," you are conceding that if his position was point guard, like Lillard's is, his turnovers would be even higher.
2. you say, in the "past" Lillard was rated poorly in defense, but don't mention how Booker was rated in that past
3. when games aren't close it doesn't matter if you have Booker or Lillard. but many are, and Lillard is a much better closer. it's critical in the playoffs

statistics and player rankings favor Lillard
and that's not considering Booker's team deflating:
T's
frustration fouls
bad shot selection
on-court barking at teammates
holding the ball and forcing shots instead of playing team offense (like Harden used to do before CP3 dissed and ditched Houston)

age and potential favor Booker

enough said
now let's both hope Booker gets back to his better self tonight for a glorious return to the Finals

None of that is a problem.

#1 - Huh? that makes no sense. What I am saying is that his TO are inflated because he was playing out of position. Before we had competent PG's he was being forced into a role that wasn't his natural position therefore his turnovers were inflated compared to if he was playing his natural position the entire time. Taking that into consideration had Booker been playing his natural position this entire time their TO's would likely be a wash. Lillard on the other hand has been playing his natural position and only averages a half less turnover. It completely destroys your smarter narrative even with Book playing out of position.

#2 - No, I am saying Lillard IS a poor defender AND ALSO been rated in the top 5 lists of worst defenders in the NBA. Booker on the other hand has improved his defense every single year. They have talked about it this entire playoffs. There is zero reason to believe he won't continue to improve at 24. Lillard will not improve at the age of 31 next year or beyond.

#3 - No it's not critical unless there is a close game. You are also assuming that Booker or one of the other players CAN'T make those shots. They can. They have. So the few situations where it would actually matter are rare. Plus show me a team that has to constantly rely on clutch shooting at the ends of the games and I will show you a team that hardly ever goes deep into the playoffs. LOCK DOWN DEFENSE at the end of games is way more important than having to constantly rely on clutch shooting.

Book is 24 years old. He will mature. Booker is not the only one stupid enough to let the other team get under his skins this playoffs. See Crowder. See a couple of Payne's timely techs.

So let's recap:

Age - Booker
Potential to improve - Booker
TO's - Wash if not barely in favor of Lillard
Individual Defense - Booker
Team defense - Booker

Enough said.

 

[Hoop Head]

We have a really young team that has a super bright future for many years to come. Lets abandon the idea of a dynasty to trade its All-Star guard and leading scorer for a guy who doesn't play defense and also plays the same position that our aging veteran leader plays, who is also nearing the end of his prime. Why? because that second PG we'd trade for is marginally better at shooting while the game is close in the 4th.We can teach that PG to play defense, maybe, even though he never has and he'll be out of position. Even if he doesn't play defense, at least.....um....he doesn't date a Kardashian! Yeah, that's it!

That makes a ton of sense, you sold me.

 

[1tinsoldier]

don't waste everyone's time
Booker HAS been playing his position all year and is ranked 15 in most turnovers, while Lillard is at 23 with more ball responsibilities and you can't say Booker is better at team defense when the Suns have much better defensive personnel.

you and that troll going along for the ride should quit while your behind before someone starts digging into the rest of the stats

Lillard is better today. better luck making your case in the future

 

[Hoop Head]

don't waste everyone's time
Booker HAS been playing his position all year and is ranked 15 in most turnovers, while Lillard is at 23 with more ball responsibilities and you can't say Booker is better at team defense when the Suns have much better defensive personnel.

you and that troll going along for the ride should quit while your behind before someone starts digging into the rest of the stats

Lillard is better today. better luck making your case in the future

If Lillard is so much better then why couldn't his unstoppable clutch shooting get past Denver? I mean, he's clutch, and he can play D when he wants or its needed so surely he was turning the screws in round 1 of the playoffs, right?

The worst part about this idiotic trade idea is I really like Lillard, he's one of my favorite players that isn't a Sun. Regardless of that, it makes absolutely zero sense to trade Booker for him. Age, positional fit, defensive fit, and contract status are all on Booker's side. I can't believe this is even a discussion on a Suns board.

Why would you want to blow up a team that is 1 game away from the NBA finals to go back to the 2 Headed PG nonsense unless you're either Jeff Hornacek or Ryan McD? The good news is we could sign Isaiah Thomas to back them up also.

 

[Covert Rain]

don't waste everyone's time
Booker HAS been playing his position all year and is ranked 15 in most turnovers, while Lillard is at 23 with more ball responsibilities and you can't say Booker is better at team defense when the Suns have much better defensive personnel.

you and that troll going along for the ride should quit while your behind before someone starts digging into the rest of the stats

Lillard is better today. better luck making your case in the future

The only time being wasted is you making completely illogical arguments.

Be my guest. Pull out all the stats you want. You know what you can't change? The half less turnover than Booker which was a big part of your dumb argument. You know what you can't change? Lillard's defense. You know what you can't change his age.

The funny thing is the ONLY thing you can hang your hat on is that he is slightly better than Booker on offense.....but then that falls apart when you realize Booker is only going to get better in every aspect of his game.

You seem to think people are arguing Lillard can't score and isn't fun to watch score. He is. Everybody knows it. Nobody here has disputed that at all.

Stop....it's embarrassing.

 

[sdscard4]

Books last 3 games is like 22 -65
It's the damn nose man

 

[Cheesebeef]

Books last 3 games is like 22 -65
It's the damn nose man

He was bad in Game 2 pre-nose, though. Beverly plays him extremely tough.

 

[nashman]

He was bad in Game 2 pre-nose, though. Beverly plays him extremely tough.

you mean fouls him repeatedly and Book gets no calls, and that clown can openly mock Paul on the floor in front of everyone and not get a T? Or constantly berate officials and never gets T’d up? The refs are getting pretty disgusting when they ignore blatant stuff and call ticky tack crap on the Suns! We take the lead then blatant PG travel so they call it, no instead let’s give him an and 1 while ignoring the clear violation. But they never miss Cams stutter step and call that traveling repeatedly? Just too much one way officiating getting in their heads and the fans too it’s total horseshit!

 

[Covert Rain]

you mean fouls him repeatedly and Book gets no calls, and that clown can openly mock Paul on the floor in front of everyone and not get a T? Or constantly berate officials and never gets T’d up? The refs are getting pretty disgusting when they ignore blatant stuff and call ticky tack **** on the Suns! We take the lead then blatant PG travel so they call it, no instead let’s give him an and 1 while ignoring the clear violation. But they never miss Cams stutter step and call that traveling repeatedly? Just too much one way officiating getting in their heads and the fans too it’s total horseshit!

Let's be real. The best defenders in this league could be called for fouls constantly. The NBA rewards tenacious defenders in this league. That will never change. Like it or not that makes Bev an effective defender. We have seen other really good defensive players in this league come under the same scrutiny.

 

[Vacard]

Booker needs to get stronger in the offseason. Jordan did the same thing when the Pistons hacked him.

 

[Hoop Head]

Booker needs to get stronger in the offseason. Jordan did the same thing when the Pistons hacked him.

I agree. We need to make the finals so he skips the Olympic games. I read something about how the first day of team USA practice is 1 day after the finals, if it goes 7 games. With the first game being within a week. So any players whose team makes the finals is likely to withdraw.

It'd be a good opportunity but not without any rest. This offseason will be short also, not like last year but shorter than normal since the season is running so late.

 

[Hoop Head]

Team USA training camp starts July 6th so the finals won't be over yet. First game is July 10th. So if we make it, Booker will need to withdraw.

Nba.com/news/usa-basketball-announces-2021-olympic-team-roster

 

[AzStevenCal]

Booker needs to get stronger in the offseason. Jordan did the same thing when the Pistons hacked him.

Yeah I think Devin has good core strength but he needs to work on his hands, wrists and forearms.

 

[dscher]

Booker needs to get stronger in the offseason. Jordan did the same thing when the Pistons hacked him.

Booker and Ayton could benefit greatly from putting on a little more muscle..

 

[Chaplin]

Team USA training camp starts July 6th so the finals won't be over yet. First game is July 10th. So if we make it, Booker will need to withdraw.

Nba.com/news/usa-basketball-announces-2021-olympic-team-roster

Why would he need to withdraw? You don't think USA Basketball took the Finals into consideration when they did the scheduling?

 

[Hoop Head]

Why would he need to withdraw? You don't think USA Basketball took the Finals into consideration when they did the scheduling?

They obviously didn't factor it in much considering the finals will definitely overlap with training camp, and its likely a game or two may overlap as well.

 

[Mainstreet]

Devin Booker is why Chris Paul is in Phoenix.

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[Weenus O'Baggins]

Lol to all this

 

[Hoop Head]

Lol to all this

But Lillard is more clutch!