Ayton sorta sucks

[Carolinacacti]

Anthony Davis stat line from Pacers game. 3-14 8 boards 4 turnovers. I'm really upset at Ayton and If I was the coach or GM SPARKS is all I will say.

 

[Hoop Head]

I hope you're right . . . but it's going to take more than, "He'll be fine."

It is going to take strong coaching to convince Deandre to overcome
his inherent Bahamian passive personality on the court. And, evidently,
off the court.

Until we see differently, it's a dream. The only aggressive Suns team
we've ever seen was the Barkley team.

And a very short spurt of Maurice Lucas and Dennis Johnson, before
John MacLeod convinced Jerry to dump them, because he preferred
passive players who wouldn't challenge his unimaginative approach.

What does him being from the Bahamas have to do with being passive? Honestly, that sounds like a stereotype at best and racist at worst. You mention it frequently as a reason for his attitude though so I'd like to know what you're basing that off of.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

I didn't know that. That's pathetic.

I didn't either until I went to grab lunch and was listening to Bickley. They played the clip from the Woj interview while they were excoriating him over it.

 

[BC867]

What does him being from the Bahamas have to do with being passive? Honestly, that sounds like a stereotype at best and racist at worst. You mention it frequently as a reason for his attitude though so I'd like to know what you're basing that off of.

Have you ever visited the Bahamas? I have twice. As well as
other locations in the Caribbean.

It is not an insult. It is a reality. Life in the Caribbean is more
laid back than in the U.S. There is nothing racist about it.

Just as the pace in Phoenix is different than New York or Chicago.

To not recognize it is to bury one's head in the sand.

It is difficult to solve a problem without first identifying it.

 

[Chaplin]

Have you ever visited the Bahamas? I have twice. As well as
other locations in the Caribbean.

It is not an insult. It is a reality. Life in the Caribbean is more
laid back than in the U.S. There is nothing racist about it.

Just as the pace in Phoenix is different than New York or Chicago.

To not recognize it is to bury one's head in the sand.

It is difficult to solve a problem without first identifying it.

Still doesn't invalidate Hoop Head's post. No difference between that and saying, "He's from Mexico, he must like tortillas."

 

[itlnsunsfan]

Dude is not dependable.

 

[Cheesebeef]

He needs to grow up and act like a professional.

Add to this him saying on a podcast yesterday that he never watched game film until his suspension.

Nothing on his opponents, nothing on classic big men...nothing unless he was in it.

jesus.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Bridges has gone nutso here in the 4th from 3!

 

[Covert Rain]

Just an update on Ayton.

Center Ranks:
PPG - #10
FGM #3
Offensive Rebounding #4
Defensive Rebounding #14
Overall Rebounding #7
Assists #21
Blocks #13
Double Doubles #17
Triple Doubles #4
FG% #45
Free Throws Attempted #35

Plenty to like up above for sure. Inside is a mixed bag. He is getting rebounding which takes position fighting on the inside. However, clearly his free throw attempts and his FG% would be much better if he played strong WITH THE BALL. Still....much to like here.

 

[Chaplin]

Just an update on Ayton.

Center Ranks:
PPG - #10
FGM #3
Offensive Rebounding #4
Defensive Rebounding #14
Overall Rebounding #7
Assists #21
Blocks #13
Double Doubles #17
Triple Doubles #4
FG% #45
Free Throws Attempted #35

Plenty to like up above for sure. Inside is a mixed bag. He is getting rebounding which takes position fighting on the inside. However, clearly his free throw attempts and his FG% would be much better if he played strong WITH THE BALL. Still....much to like here.

He's the #45 ranked CENTER in Field Goal %? Is that right??

 

[TJ]

He's the #45 ranked CENTER in Field Goal %? Is that right??

His FG% went down from his rookie year, which is disappointing. When he realizes he can drive to the bucket instead of settling for 8-10' jumpers, his FG% and FTs will go up

 

[Dr. Jones]

Just an update on Ayton.

Center Ranks:
PPG - #10
FGM #3
Offensive Rebounding #4
Defensive Rebounding #14
Overall Rebounding #7
Assists #21
Blocks #13
Double Doubles #17
Triple Doubles #4
FG% #45
Free Throws Attempted #35

Plenty to like up above for sure. Inside is a mixed bag. He is getting rebounding which takes position fighting on the inside. However, clearly his free throw attempts and his FG% would be much better if he played strong WITH THE BALL. Still....much to like here.

He's the #45 ranked CENTER in Field Goal %? Is that right??

I am truly glad to see he is making an impact game to game right now.

My small critique remains this: He has no edge, has shown no tendency to find an edge, and doesn't seem to want to change that fact.

He will be no better than a 2nd or 3rd best player on any playoff level squad at this rate. His only saving grace is youth IMO. If he looks like this in 4 years after the (inevitable) max contract he will get, we will be doomed to mid level mediocrity unless we get a Barkley level trade to materialize.

 

[itlnsunsfan]

Just an update on Ayton.

Center Ranks:
PPG - #10
FGM #3
Offensive Rebounding #4
Defensive Rebounding #14
Overall Rebounding #7
Assists #21
Blocks #13
Double Doubles #17
Triple Doubles #4
FG% #45
Free Throws Attempted #35

Plenty to like up above for sure. Inside is a mixed bag. He is getting rebounding which takes position fighting on the inside. However, clearly his free throw attempts and his FG% would be much better if he played strong WITH THE BALL. Still....much to like here.

#4 in triple doubles? Has he had a triple double?

 

[itlnsunsfan]

Just an update on Ayton.

Center Ranks:
PPG - #10
FGM #3
Offensive Rebounding #4
Defensive Rebounding #14
Overall Rebounding #7
Assists #21
Blocks #13
Double Doubles #17
Triple Doubles #4
FG% #45
Free Throws Attempted #35

Plenty to like up above for sure. Inside is a mixed bag. He is getting rebounding which takes position fighting on the inside. However, clearly his free throw attempts and his FG% would be much better if he played strong WITH THE BALL. Still....much to like here.

Where are your pulling your stats from? Ayton's not qualifying on the sites I'm looking at since he hasn't played in 70% of our games.

 

[Hoop Head]

Have you ever visited the Bahamas? I have twice. As well as
other locations in the Caribbean.

What does that have to do with anything? You hate when people get personal with you yet you always reveal personal info in your posts. Were you there watching any local sporting events? If not then what makes you think you can say all Bahamian athletes share a certain trait?

It is not an insult. It is a reality. Life in the Caribbean is more
laid back than in the U.S. There is nothing racist about it.

Is being passive a positive trait? I don't recall anyone praising his passive play. In your own post here you call it a problem. I've seen you, and many others, claim his passivity will keep him from being a difference maker. So it sounds like it's viewed as a negative trait for basketball players, especially 7 foot Centers. That's all fine except for how you try to claim he's passive because he's from the Bahamas. Saying all people from a certain way carry this negative trait is stereotyping. It has nothing to do with the pace of the city.

Just as the pace in Phoenix is different than New York or Chicago.

To not recognize it is to bury one's head in the sand.

The pace of the city doesn't determine what sort of athletes it produces. Not all basketball players from Phoenix are the same and not all players from Chicago or New York aren't the same either. Pace of a city is generally effected by population.


Sure the pace of the city is different and in large part that has to do with the population disparity between the Bahamas, Phoenix, New York, Chicago, etc but that doesn't mean all it's residents are similar in how they view life and get around. There are passive and aggressive people from every city. Your birth place doesn't force you to be one or the other and thinking so is stereotyping.

It is difficult to solve a problem without first identifying it.

Can it be solved? You say he's passive because he's Bahamian and that isn't going to change so what makes you think he can go against his upbringing and the primary reason why he's passive?

 

[Raindog]

Tim Duncan was from the Caribbean and he was as hard-assed as could be.

 

[Hoop Head]

Patrick Ewing was from Jamaica and I wouldn't call him soft or passive.

 

[AZ Native]

Ayton is one of those guys who doesn't look like he is doing much but after the game you look at what he did and say "WOW". And he is only going to get better, much better.

 

[Absolute Zero]

Is David Robinson a closer comparison as far as the type of player?

 

[1Sun]

Is David Robinson a closer comparison as far as the type of player?

In terms of potential, yes. In terms of what we have seen, there have been too many signs of Joe Barry Carroll and Benoit Benjamin...and the drug and discipline issues are reminiscent of William Bedford and Jerrod Mustaf.

 

[Hoop Head]

Is David Robinson a closer comparison as far as the type of player?

Perhaps but I'm not looking for a player comparison so much as refuting BC's claim that he's too laid back and passive because he's from the Bahamas. That seems like a ridiculous claim, IMO. Being from the Caribbean should not pigeonhole him into playing a certain way.

 

[GatorAZ]

Is David Robinson a closer comparison as far as the type of player?

Robinson won a scoring title. He was so aggressive offensively.

Ayton best comparison is Towns with defensive upside.

 

[Absolute Zero]

Perhaps but I'm not looking for a player comparison so much as refuting BC's claim that he's too laid back and passive because he's from the Bahamas. That seems like a ridiculous claim, IMO. Being from the Caribbean should not pigeonhole him into playing a certain way.

Agreed.

 

[BC867]

Where are your pulling your stats from? Ayton's not qualifying on the sites I'm looking at since he hasn't played in 70% of our games.

ESPN mentioned during the game today that it's been a long time since he had a double-double.

It didn't sound right. I wonder what the fact is.

 

[BC867]

Tim Duncan was from the Caribbean and he was as hard-assed as could be.

OK then, let's see it from Ayton.

The pace of life in the Caribbean is a lot slower than in the States.

Duncan being an exception is no help to the Suns.