2023-24 Around the NBA Thread

Mainstreet

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It's about time to flip the calendar over to NBA news for the upcoming 2023-24 season.
 
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Mainstreet

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Adam Silver thought NBA basketball had become too physical in the late 90s.

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Adam Silver thought NBA basketball had become too physical in the late 90s.

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That explains a lot. Personally I thought the game was nearing it's peak then. Certain playoff series did get really physical but there should be some physicality. Now it seems there is too much guesswork and stars are allowed to be physical while others aren't. I miss the days when things were equal for the most part and stars just go away with traveling more often.
 

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That explains a lot. Personally I thought the game was nearing it's peak then. Certain playoff series did get really physical but there should be some physicality. Now it seems there is too much guesswork and stars are allowed to be physical while others aren't. I miss the days when things were equal for the most part and stars just go away with traveling more often.
I guess it's a matter of perspective. I disliked basketball from that era for the most part, especially postseason play.

My biggest complaint about the first half of the Stern era NBA was the ridiculous advantage refs gave to the stars. It's bad now but it was worse from the Jordan run through much of the Shaq era IMO. Unfortunately it's trending back that way with the absurd protection they've given to players such as Lebron, Giannis and a few others.

When I was still a young NBA fan (early Suns days) I remember hearing an old referee talk about what they looked for. Specifically, it wasn't so much about contact but whether a player gained an unfair advantage from that contact (offensively or defensively). It stopped being called that way under Stern but now I think it's even worse than the David years in that regard. That more than anything is the philosophy they need to bring back to the game IMO. Stop focusing on all the technicalities, and look at who initiated the contact and whether the contact itself resulted in a player advantage (either way).

And don't get me started on traveling. I long for the good old days when we could scream about Artis Gilmore or Moses Malone shuffling their feet and the refs would even call it (sometimes). Now, they let players carry the ball for half the court sometimes. It's absurd and it's wildly inconsistent in the way it's called.
 

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I guess it's a matter of perspective. I disliked basketball from that era for the most part, especially postseason play.

My biggest complaint about the first half of the Stern era NBA was the ridiculous advantage refs gave to the stars. It's bad now but it was worse from the Jordan run through much of the Shaq era IMO. Unfortunately it's trending back that way with the absurd protection they've given to players such as Lebron, Giannis and a few others.

When I was still a young NBA fan (early Suns days) I remember hearing an old referee talk about what they looked for. Specifically, it wasn't so much about contact but whether a player gained an unfair advantage from that contact (offensively or defensively). It stopped being called that way under Stern but now I think it's even worse than the David years in that regard. That more than anything is the philosophy they need to bring back to the game IMO. Stop focusing on all the technicalities, and look at who initiated the contact and whether the contact itself resulted in a player advantage (either way).

And don't get me started on traveling. I long for the good old days when we could scream about Artis Gilmore or Moses Malone shuffling their feet and the refs would even call it (sometimes). Now, they let players carry the ball for half the court sometimes. It's absurd and it's wildly inconsistent in the way it's called.
Agree with all of this. As much as I loved the players of that era the mud-wrestling that was passed off as basketball was ugly.
 
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Mainstreet

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The NBA opens an investigation regarding a referee.

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Russ Smith

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Sounds like despite 3 surgeries in the last 14 months, Lonzo's knee is so bad they did a cartilage transplant, he was apparently the first major sports athlete(basketball, football, baseball) to have it and the Bulls seem to think he won't make it back.

Sucks, I know everyone hates the dad but Lonzo wasn't to blame for that and he just couldn't keep healthy because of this knee issue.
 

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I guess it's a matter of perspective. I disliked basketball from that era for the most part, especially postseason play.

My biggest complaint about the first half of the Stern era NBA was the ridiculous advantage refs gave to the stars. It's bad now but it was worse from the Jordan run through much of the Shaq era IMO. Unfortunately it's trending back that way with the absurd protection they've given to players such as Lebron, Giannis and a few others.

When I was still a young NBA fan (early Suns days) I remember hearing an old referee talk about what they looked for. Specifically, it wasn't so much about contact but whether a player gained an unfair advantage from that contact (offensively or defensively). It stopped being called that way under Stern but now I think it's even worse than the David years in that regard. That more than anything is the philosophy they need to bring back to the game IMO. Stop focusing on all the technicalities, and look at who initiated the contact and whether the contact itself resulted in a player advantage (either way).

And don't get me started on traveling. I long for the good old days when we could scream about Artis Gilmore or Moses Malone shuffling their feet and the refs would even call it (sometimes). Now, they let players carry the ball for half the court sometimes. It's absurd and it's wildly inconsistent in the way it's called.

I think age plays a role in what we perceive as the NBA at it's peak. You said early Suns so I'd guess you were a teenager then, which is what I was in the late 90's and early 2000's. So I really just started appreciating the game more which is part of why I consider it the peak years. Nostalgia frames things differently.

I liked how the game was played inside out then and 3pt shots weren't taken more than FT's. Players who played like Booker, CP3, and Durant were the norm as far as attacking the midrange but now they're considered elite for doing so at an efficient clip. Not many shot as well as they do now but games were won and loss in the midrange.

It was also considered "Living by the 3" when those attempts were even 20% of a teams total FG attempts. For instance the Suns averaged 14.8 3pt attempts in 97-98 with just 5.3 makes. If a team only makes 5 3's now, they lost. Don't even need to hear anything else. That team went 56-26 though and they 6th in makes, 7th in attempts, and despite shooting 35.6% they were 9th in overall percentage. The Suns shot 32.6 a game now which is 17th while making 12.2, which is 13th. That's 37.4% which makes them 7th overall. We're now making about as many as were attempted back then. That's all the game is becoming, a 3pt contest. It's frustrating seeing guys pass up a wide open lane to jack 3's yet that's the norm now in most fast break situations.

The game was different.
 

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Sounds like despite 3 surgeries in the last 14 months, Lonzo's knee is so bad they did a cartilage transplant, he was apparently the first major sports athlete(basketball, football, baseball) to have it and the Bulls seem to think he won't make it back.

Sucks, I know everyone hates the dad but Lonzo wasn't to blame for that and he just couldn't keep healthy because of this knee issue.

Fair to question how much those trash "BBB" shoes his dad forced him to wear factored into the destruction of his body.

His shooting was steadily improving, the guy had developed into a really good player after a terrible start to his career in LA.
 

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Fair to question how much those trash "BBB" shoes his dad forced him to wear factored into the destruction of his body.

His shooting was steadily improving, the guy had developed into a really good player after a terrible start to his career in LA.

I don't think the shoes are to blame. He wore them for like 2 years before ditching them. Some people just aren't meant to be professional athletes. It sounds like he was avoiding microfracture, which has a low success rate, and you can't fault him for that but bad shoes aren't likely to have necessitated the knee issues he's dealt with.
 

Russ Smith

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Fair to question how much those trash "BBB" shoes his dad forced him to wear factored into the destruction of his body.

His shooting was steadily improving, the guy had developed into a really good player after a terrible start to his career in LA.

Probably didn't help but I read that he stopped wearing them fairly early in his rookie year because he had to keep changing them during games as they were not holding up.

I also wonder his dad was his personal trainer growing up, he's had a litany of knee problems and now Melo seems to be getting hurt on the regular.

Or he could just have been born with an issue. My knee surgeons(2 different ones) both told me the slope and angle of my kneecap basically guaranteed I'd end up having knee problems.

Sad though as you said he'd become a good player.
 

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I guess it's a matter of perspective. I disliked basketball from that era for the most part, especially postseason play.

My biggest complaint about the first half of the Stern era NBA was the ridiculous advantage refs gave to the stars. It's bad now but it was worse from the Jordan run through much of the Shaq era IMO. Unfortunately it's trending back that way with the absurd protection they've given to players such as Lebron, Giannis and a few others.

When I was still a young NBA fan (early Suns days) I remember hearing an old referee talk about what they looked for. Specifically, it wasn't so much about contact but whether a player gained an unfair advantage from that contact (offensively or defensively). It stopped being called that way under Stern but now I think it's even worse than the David years in that regard. That more than anything is the philosophy they need to bring back to the game IMO. Stop focusing on all the technicalities, and look at who initiated the contact and whether the contact itself resulted in a player advantage (either way).

And don't get me started on traveling. I long for the good old days when we could scream about Artis Gilmore or Moses Malone shuffling their feet and the refs would even call it (sometimes). Now, they let players carry the ball for half the court sometimes. It's absurd and it's wildly inconsistent in the way it's called.
Lebron ruined the league let’s be honest…
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AzStevenCal

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Lebron ruined the league let’s be honest…
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I put more blame on Silver. Can you really blame Lebron for taking advantage of what they'll ignore because it's him? He makes money off of this. Just like I don't blame Marcus Smart for all the crap he pulls, the refs let him do it because that's the NBA Silver wants. I despise what they get away with but I don't blame them.

It's a little less about competition every year and a little more about the spectacle. The NBA today looks like the All Star games used to look in the early 90's. One day soon, it will look a lot like the All Star game of 2023 which is kind of funny when you realize that Silver recently mentioned that the fans and players want the all star game to be less of a joke.
 
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Mainstreet

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I put more blame on Silver. Can you really blame Lebron for taking advantage of what they'll ignore because it's him? He makes money off of this. Just like I don't blame Marcus Smart for all the crap he pulls, the refs let him do it because that's the NBA Silver wants. I despise what they get away with but I don't blame them.

It's a little less about competition every year and a little more about the spectacle. The NBA today looks like the All Star games used to look in the early 90's. One day soon, it will look a lot like the All Star game of 2023 which is kind of funny when you realize that Silver recently mentioned that the fans and players want the all star game to be less of a joke.

As Adam Silver says in the video in post #2, data comes into play. Then he mentions television.

Unfortunately, NBA basketball is being defined by the casual fan.
 

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That explains a lot. Personally I thought the game was nearing it's peak then. Certain playoff series did get really physical but there should be some physicality. Now it seems there is too much guesswork and stars are allowed to be physical while others aren't. I miss the days when things were equal for the most part and stars just go away with traveling more often.
I'd say the eighties were more even. Lakers and Boston beat on each other pretty equally, and calls evened out throughout the series. The problem I had with the nineties, was Detroit was allowed to mug someone, but if your players on your team played at the same level, they got in foul trouble. My impression was it was unfair some teams got to play hard, while others didn't.
 

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I think NBA is losing luster by the poor officiating currently. Just when they seemed to be gaining on the NFL, their product is being tainted by poor officiating and games being decided by calls. They really need to have all crews call games in more of a homogenous manner. One night a crew won't let teams hand check, the next night a different crew lets people grab and hold for 90 feet!
 

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That would be asinine. Not sure that I see Boston giving him that contract as he isn't even the best player on the team.
I wouldn't pay him half that much. I hope Boston does though so they can live in cap hell for several years. Thanks to the new CBA I think we've seen the end of the supermax being handed out for anyone that meets the qualifications And hopefully it's also the end of max dollars going to those next tier players that don't qualify for the supermax. Ayton got under the wire, no way will anyone make a max or supermax mistake with Brown IMO.
 
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Mainstreet

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Bob Myers is stepping down as president and GM from the Warriors.

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Listening to Bill Simmons today he’s saying no way you give him that money. Someone is but it can’t be Boston. He’s really not that good and has just shrunk way to many times in big moments.

He was saying how the crowd in Boston had turned on him. It’s just time to break it up and he’s clearly the odd man out
 
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