15 thoughts - draft

[kerouac9]

Those charts are horse crap. "Expectation"? what kind of metric is that, other than some douche's opinion? Outcome percentile? What's even being measured??

Okay, but what metric do you have to offer that suggests that Keim is anything other than execrable in the War Room?

 

[BritCard]

Round 5 – Jack Anderson, offensive guard, Texas Tech

I like to draft at least one offensive lineman each year, and why not select the guy that Kingsbury himself recruited specially to fit his offense and who became a key player on that offensive line-unit?

Round 6 – Chris Evans, runningback, Michigan

This would probably be my favorite pick of the draft.

Round 7 – Jonathon Cooper, edge rusher, Ohio State

I understand that we are all traumatized by the last adventure with a player named Jonathan Cooper, but I do think this version is a good fit for Joseph’s defense, that he has some upside, and thus that he is a good developmental prospect.

Round 7 – Avery Williams, cornerback, Boise State.

He probably can’t play defense in the NFL, but…

Special team stats through four seasons:

Nine touchdowns, including five punt returns, three kick returns and a blocked punt. Five blocked kicks (three punt, one field goal, one extra point). One forced a fumble while on kickoff coverage.


Happy draft, everybody!

Jack Anderson is a good call. Four year starter with good technique. I'm not sure I want a development guy though, just because we have shown we such at developing guys. When was the last time we took a raw lower round pick and turned them into a good starter?

If were going to plug that last hole in the O line I think I'd want to do it with a quality pick.

I like Chris Evans too but surely he's going to go undrafted. He has nice vision but he's just about to turn 24 and lost reps last year to other RB's.

 

[Stout]

Parsons made plays when the defensive coordinator made calls that positioned him to make plays.

Good joke! The opposition coached to maximize what you consider a poor player's abilities? How unique an approach!

Parsons is a beast.

 

[Broseph]

I'm not trading back if Micah Parsons is there at 16. A run-stuffing, good in coverage, monstrously huge quick linebackers are hard to find.

 

[Bkbobo]

Here is an additional thought. I believe either Kirk or Isabella, if not both, will be draft day trades.

 

[Shane]

Here is an additional thought. I believe either Kirk or Isabella, if not both, will be draft day trades.

nobody is trading for Andy Isabella

 

[juza76]

nobody is trading for Andy Isabella

About Kirk there is not need to trade him, he is in the last year of his contract, he is a 700/800 yards guy and we couldn't get more then a fourth for him, so I would prefer to keep him

For Isabella, at best u can get a 7th round pick

 

[BritCard]

I'm not trading back if Micah Parsons is there at 16. A run-stuffing, good in coverage, monstrously huge quick linebackers are hard to find.

He dropped into coverage a total of 4 times in his college career. I'm not saying he can't do it, he's a good athlete, but he doesn't have a lot of experience doing it which will be a concern for many in todays NFL.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

He dropped into coverage a total of 4 times in his college career. I'm not saying he can't do it, he's a good athlete, but he doesn't have a lot of experience doing it which will be a concern for many in todays NFL.

If true that’s an alarming lack of data regarding something upon which I’d base drafting him.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

He dropped into coverage a total of 4 times in his college career. I'm not saying he can't do it, he's a good athlete, but he doesn't have a lot of experience doing it which will be a concern for many in todays NFL.

He had five pass breakups, so I’m heavily doubting the “4” claim. Are you meaning man-to-man coverage verses dropping back into zone coverage?

 

[Krangodnzr]

He dropped into coverage a total of 4 times in his college career. I'm not saying he can't do it, he's a good athlete, but he doesn't have a lot of experience doing it which will be a concern for many in todays NFL.

I'd play Micah Parsons as an edge in our system. His size/speed ratio could turn him into a top sack guy. That's why I WOULD heavily consider him.

 

[BritCard]

He had five pass breakups, so I’m heavily doubting the “4” claim. Are you meaning man-to-man coverage verses dropping back into zone coverage?

Yes, man coverage responsibilities.

As a LB in the NFL you have to be able to cover a TE or RB at least.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Yes, man coverage responsibilities.

As a LB in the NFL you have to be able to cover a TE or RB at least.

Unless your team deploys heavy inside zone scheme.

 

[AZCrazy]

I wasn't defending Keim. Just saying that those charts measure nothing.

Keim's charts have been terrible. We tend to have a proximity bias where we only are aware of what Keim does. Every GM's drafts suck, if you're looking for a player to come out of every pick. I'd say Keim's drafts have been fairly average except in the first round where he hasn't come through with a whole lot of guaranteed players.

Jonathan Cooper. Supposed to be one of the best ever. Seemed like a solid pick, but there's no metric for how a guy responds when the chips are down.

Deone Bucannon. Solid pick at the time. They seemed to be reinventing NFL defensed for the first few years, based on the plaudits of the national media. Turns out they just kept playing him in the wrong place. 6'0", 210 isn't a middle linebacker. He would have been a savage strong safety, which he was in college. This one may be more on the coaching. Guys tend to fall in love with their own plans.

DJ Humphries. Starting long term left tackle. Not a Hall of Famer probably, but he's been the first successful first round pick the Cards have made on the offensive line sine the early 80's.

Robert Nkdemiche. First round dropper who fell into our laps. The critique on him at that time was that he had limited production for unlimited potential. Turns out they were right. Seemed to be happy not to have a second contract.

Haason Reddick. This one was a reach that seemed to turn out in the end. He was the other kid who was played out of position for years until they cut that crap out and he finally flourished. He wasn't a genius, but they still made him learn a different position every year. He popped well and he's gone so that we could hang on to Golden. Probably even up trade

Josh Rosen. Well, there were four big quarterbacks that year and we needed one, so we traded up to get the last of them. I remember being happy at the time. Rosen hasn't worked out anywhere he's been yet, but this poor guy can't seem to find a team that isn't tanking. He was forced to work in the Wilks/McCoy year, with a fully injured Offensive Line. I'm amazed he won 3 games. Anyway, Keim showed a bit of mettle the next year.

Kyler Murray. First time ever holding the top pick. Other than his height, Murray was the complete package and has played largely like it in his two years. Took the team from three wins to five to eight, and would have had more if we had a reliable kicking game. Pretty good outcome so far for a 21 year old rook. Surround him with a good line and some decent skill position players besides Hopkins, and he'll shine.

So about 50% hits on first rounders. Not great, not terrible. A lot of them seemed like excellent picks at the time. Look at most other teams and their first round picks are usually hitting at the same rate. A few have a better run, and they turn into playoff teams.

I think with the addition of Malcolm Butler, our primary need right now is WR. Not a popular opinion but really we've got Hop and some role players. For a high flying Offense, more is necessary.

 

[kerouac9]

You seem to misunderstand what a metric is.

 

[Arz101]

Any takers for this....


I will donate my share for a billboard on I-10 and Warner exit to show this image. Bidwill needs to see this team is the worst in NFL when it comes to drafting under Keim.

Sent from my Pixel 4a (5G) using Tapatalk

 

[oaken1]

A run on quarterbacks will make the numbers work out for the Cardinals. Someone the Cardinals can't pass up will be there at 16.

I know the focus has been on cornerback since the Cardinals ended with a whimper versus the Rams. But slotting Alijah Vera-Tucker in at right guard is the much better option. It doesn't matter who is playing cornerback or wide receiver if Kyler Murray limps through the back half of the season again.

The guy I don't want at 16 is workout warrior Micah Parsons. He is a Keim pick all the way. Off the chart measurables with no football instincts.

I would take AVT in a heartbeat

 

[Gandhi]

I think Williams is more of a big play threat than Johnson. Much bigger also, a true outside WR. He ran a 4.5 40 at his pro day so he is faster than Johnson as well.

I must say that it excites me that you say that. I thought long about including me in my mock draft (in the fifth round, by the way), but decided against it because I thought “he” was already on the roster and thus that the pick could be used wiser. As I said, I also like Williams in a more general perspective, so if you think there is a place for him (it is not like Keesean Johnson has set the stage on fire, but still…) I would use a pick on him – especially if they don’t get a wide receiver in the two first rounds.

 

[Gandhi]

I'm not sure I want a development guy though, just because we have shown we such at developing guys. When was the last time we took a raw lower round pick and turned them into a good starter?

You are definitely correct, but I trust in Sean Kugler. And if Anderson fits what Kingsbury wants to do, then it seems to me that it would make good sense. I do think that the two guard spots will be fine, and thus they can bring Anderson along slowly.

I like Chris Evans too but surely he's going to go undrafted.

This I disagree with. I like Evans a lot, and it has also been reported that several teams are high on him. I expect him to be drafted.

 

[cardncubfan]

Any takers for this....


I will donate my share for a billboard on I-10 and Warner exit to show this image. Bidwill needs to see this team is the worst in NFL when it comes to drafting under Keim.

Sent from my Pixel 4a (5G) using Tapatalk

I'm pretty sure Bidwill already knows & doesn't care.

 

[QuebecCard]

Any takers for this....


I will donate my share for a billboard on I-10 and Warner exit to show this image. Bidwill needs to see this team is the worst in NFL when it comes to drafting under Keim.

Sent from my Pixel 4a (5G) using Tapatalk

As it seems that you have money to waste, you can pick up my share too.

 

[kerouac9]

Keim's charts have been terrible. We tend to have a proximity bias where we only are aware of what Keim does. Every GM's drafts suck, if you're looking for a player to come out of every pick. I'd say Keim's drafts have been fairly average except in the first round where he hasn't come through with a whole lot of guaranteed players.

But that isn't the assumption being discussed here or anywhere else. The general measure is whether one team's draft picks are generating more value (by whatever metric you like) than another team's (or the league average) over time.

Here's an analysis from last season that also puts Keim in the bottom five of the NFL in pretty much every metric.

Even if you're right, and Keim is just an average GM "except in the first round", I don't know why you'd settle for that. The Cards will always be below average in that case.

 

[tnmike]

Any takers for this....


I will donate my share for a billboard on I-10 and Warner exit to show this image. Bidwill needs to see this team is the worst in NFL when it comes to drafting under Keim.

Sent from my Pixel 4a (5G) using Tapatalk

Any extra money I spend will be on something constructive, like giving to a good charity.

 

[Gandhi]

Here is an additional thought. I believe either Kirk or Isabella, if not both, will be draft day trades.

BK, if anyone pays anything for Andy Isabella, I think every criticism of Keim’s abilities on draft weekend needs to stop. It would be a masterpiece.