Devin Booker is the greatest player EVER in Suns history

[GatorAZ]

I love Nash, but he isn't the greatest player in Suns history.

He is to me. The most impactful at least.

 

[Adrian]

Shane Young
@YoungNBA
·
2h
Devin Booker completes his 11th NBA season with 64 games played, averaging 26.1 points, 6.0 assists, and 3.9 rebounds.

51.2%-33.0%-87.3% modern shooting splits.

Career high in free throw attempts, averaging 8.7 per 36 minutes.

 

[Adrian]

Shane Young
@YoungNBA
·
2h
Devin Booker’s final stats as a driver and playmaker this year:

• 1,006 total drives, 5th most in the NBA
• 38% pass rate on those drives

• 785 potential assists and 12.3 per game, 13th among all qualified players.
• 1,053 total points generated by assists
• 77 secondary assists, tied with Collin Gillespie for 5th in the league

• 30% assist rate for the 5th time in his career

 

[Adrian]

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

 

[Adrian]

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

 

[BooksOrangePlanet]

the shots that i took
wet like i′m book
wet like i'm lizzie
i be spinning valley circle blocks 'til i′m dizzy
like where is he?
no one seen him
i'm tryna clean'em

 

[Cheesebeef]

I love Nash, but he isn't the greatest player in Suns history.

we've probably had this convo before, but if not Nash, who do you think is? The only one I'd put over him is Barkley, and that's really only because Chuck got us within4 seconds and 1 game of a title. otherwise, Nash easily stands above the rest for me, being the unquestioned leader of the best 6 year run in Suns history the last 25 years, pushing the team to 3 WCF, multiple division titles, and 2 MVPs to boot.

mine go Chuck, Nash, KJ. Then probably a tie between Book/Amare. no one else is really even in the convo.

 

[Proximo]

He is to me. The most impactful at least.

Eh. That is a close call between him and Barkley. Neither did it for long though.

For their whole career it is Book, even though he kind of sucks now.

 

[Proximo]

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

This is a guy that clearly hasn't watched many Suns games.

I really don't care that Book can generate some foul calls by flailing. Without that he would be lucky to avg 15 pts a game. He is scared to even take more than 2 or 3 of his trademark free throw line jumpers any more even when they are open. He instead wants to draw a foul because I guess he doesn't even trust himself to make them like he used to.

Book may be averaging 26ppg game this year, but he certainly wouldn't be if the offense wasn't run through him to a ridiculous level.

The whole thing is depressing, because he really was awesome for a couple years there.

 

[Chaplin]

we've probably had this convo before, but if not Nash, who do you think is? The only one I'd put over him is Barkley, and that's really only because Chuck got us within4 seconds and 1 game of a title. otherwise, Nash easily stands above the rest for me, being the unquestioned leader of the best 6 year run in Suns history the last 25 years, pushing the team to 3 WCF, multiple division titles, and 2 MVPs to boot.

mine go Chuck, Nash, KJ. Then probably a tie between Book/Amare. no one else is really even in the convo.

This convo is rife with recency bias. For all of us. Hard to think that a greatest player combo doesn’t include guys like Alvin Adam’s and Connie Hawkins.

But Charles, Nash and KJ are great choices. I would add Book in either 1st or 2nd.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Eh. That is a close call between him and Barkley. Neither did it for long though.

For their whole career it is Book, even though he kind of sucks now.

Yeah, for me too although it's a tough call. Barkley and Nash both shined brighter, though not for as long so I go with Devin.

 

[Phrazbit]

The convo, for me, has not changed much.

Nash is the best player in franchise history, I don't see how he isn't. Two MVPs and the entire league was forced to evolve because of him and Mike D'Antoni.

Booker will probably play another decade, so there is a lot of opportunity for him, but I don't see him, or the team, getting the accolades he would need to jump Nash for a while.

 

[AzStevenCal]

The convo, for me, has not changed much.

Nash is the best player in franchise history, I don't see how he isn't. Two MVPs and the entire league was forced to evolve because of him and Mike D'Antoni.

Booker will probably play another decade, so there is a lot of opportunity for him, but I don't see him, or the team, getting the accolades he would need to jump Nash for a while.

Devin is never going to match Nash when it comes to accolades so if winning two MVP's is the criteria, it's an easy win for Steve. But for some reason we seem to be ignoring that he was a very weak defender and after he was turned over in clutch moments by physical play from Billups, the rest of the league tended to play him the same way in crunch time. All too often Nash would penetrate, his defender would knock his arms off the ball, and we'd lose. It's not his fault that back then the refs would just let that kind of play go but because of it I had just about as much confidence in Nash during close games as I do Devin. As in, not much.

Anyway, my point really is that there isn't a slam dunk answer to this question since all our favorite Suns players have serious blemishes. We should have won two titles with Chuck, SHOULD have. And we were the best team multiple times with Nash and couldn't bring it home. Those facts seemed to be ignored yet we focus on similar weaknesses in Booker's resume. We know Devin's shortcomings and he was part of two of the worst collapses in franchise history but until someone wins a championship for Phoenix, I think the identity of our "greatest player" will remain contested.

 

[GatorAZ]

Devin is never going to match Nash when it comes to accolades so if winning two MVP's is the criteria, it's an easy win for Steve. But for some reason we seem to be ignoring that he was a very weak defender and after he was turned over in clutch moments by physical play from Billups, the rest of the league tended to play him the same way in crunch time. All too often Nash would penetrate, his defender would knock his arms off the ball, and we'd lose. It's not his fault that back then the refs would just let that kind of play go but because of it I had just about as much confidence in Nash during close games as I do Devin. As in, not much.

Anyway, my point really is that there isn't a slam dunk answer to this question since all our favorite Suns players have serious blemishes. We should have won two titles with Chuck, SHOULD have. And we were the best team multiple times with Nash and couldn't bring it home. Those facts seemed to be ignored yet we focus on similar weaknesses in Booker's resume. We know Devin's shortcomings and he was part of two of the worst collapses in franchise history but until someone wins a championship for Phoenix, I think the identity of our "greatest player" will remain contested.

The Suns have been cooked by multiple perimeter players over Book’s tenure in playoff series. He wasn’t limiting anyone defensively just like Nash. I’d give Book the slight edge defensively because he’s bigger but he’s got worse metrics than Nash defensively. Both were subpar while Nash was more impactful offensively.

 

[Mainstreet]

What gets overlooked in that Bucks Final series is Dario Saric went down to injury and the Suns had no one guard the middle and slow down Giannis beyond Ayton.

There was a reason the Suns went from being up 2-0 to losing the series 2-4. Plus, Giannis got healthy.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The convo, for me, has not changed much.

Nash is the best player in franchise history, I don't see how he isn't. Two MVPs and the entire league was forced to evolve because of him and Mike D'Antoni.

Booker will probably play another decade, so there is a lot of opportunity for him, but I don't see him, or the team, getting the accolades he would need to jump Nash for a while.

oh my lord... if we have to watch Devin Booker play another decade on the Suns I will freaking puke.

 

[Cheesebeef]

This convo is rife with recency bias. For all of us. Hard to think that a greatest player combo doesn’t include guys like Alvin Adam’s and Connie Hawkins.

Disagree. None of those had an impact on the Suns AND the entire league like Nash/Barkley did or had consistent excellence like KJ lifting that team to perennial contender status even before Barkley.

But Charles, Nash and KJ are great choices. I would add Book in either 1st or 2nd.

I guess my question is what separates Booker from say Amare? Is it longevity? I can see that argument, because otherwise to me they're both pretty similar figures for the Suns. Great scorers, but lacking in the leadership/ability to completely control a game the way those are three could.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Devin is never going to match Nash when it comes to accolades so if winning two MVP's is the criteria, it's an easy win for Steve. But for some reason we seem to be ignoring that he was a very weak defender and after he was turned over in clutch moments by physical play from Billups, the rest of the league tended to play him the same way in crunch time. All too often Nash would penetrate, his defender would knock his arms off the ball, and we'd lose. It's not his fault that back then the refs would just let that kind of play go but because of it I had just about as much confidence in Nash during close games as I do Devin. As in, not much.

Anyway, my point really is that there isn't a slam dunk answer to this question since all our favorite Suns players have serious blemishes. We should have won two titles with Chuck, SHOULD have. And we were the best team multiple times with Nash and couldn't bring it home. Those facts seemed to be ignored yet we focus on similar weaknesses in Booker's resume. We know Devin's shortcomings and he was part of two of the worst collapses in franchise history but until someone wins a championship for Phoenix, I think the identity of our "greatest player" will remain contested.

I don't think those facts get ignored at all. They ALL underachieved in the biggest moment, but Nash/Barkley were the unquestioned leaders of great teams... multiple teams and had entire eras that were fun. Booker was only the number 2 of a single great YEAR of his entire era, which has for the most part sucked. And not just like underachieved in the playoffs - we're not even making the playoffs or coming anywhere close to making it in some years.

 

[AzStevenCal]

The convo, for me, has not changed much.

Nash is the best player in franchise history, I don't see how he isn't. Two MVPs and the entire league was forced to evolve because of him and Mike D'Antoni.

Booker will probably play another decade, so there is a lot of opportunity for him, but I don't see him, or the team, getting the accolades he would need to jump Nash for a while.

Wow. I'd stand in line to take a bet against this. I suspect that 5 years from now he'll be a 6th man or about to retire. Soft tissue injuries often become chronic as a player ages and he's been dealing with them for several years now. Except as a shooter, he barely has enough athleticism to play his game and even his shot is a problem if he can no longer out jump the defender.

 

[Phrazbit]

I don't think those facts get ignored at all. They ALL underachieved in the biggest moment, but Nash/Barkley were the unquestioned leaders of great teams... multiple teams and had entire eras that were fun. Booker was only the number 2 of a single great YEAR of his entire era, which has for the most part sucked. And not just like underachieved in the playoffs - we're not even making the playoffs or coming anywhere close to making it in some years.

Robert Sarver.

 

[Chaplin]

Disagree. None of those had an impact on the Suns AND the entire league like Nash/Barkley did or had consistent excellence like KJ lifting that team to perennial contender status even before Barkley.

I guess my question is what separates Booker from say Amare? Is it longevity? I can see that argument, because otherwise to me they're both pretty similar figures for the Suns. Great scorers, but lacking in the leadership/ability to completely control a game the way those are three could.

Booker's accomplishments now at this point of his career are arguably better than Amare had his entire career. I love Amare, but he simply doesn't have the resume that Book has at the moment.

 

[Chaplin]

I don't think those facts get ignored at all. They ALL underachieved in the biggest moment, but Nash/Barkley were the unquestioned leaders of great teams... multiple teams and had entire eras that were fun. Booker was only the number 2 of a single great YEAR of his entire era, which has for the most part sucked. And not just like underachieved in the playoffs - we're not even making the playoffs or coming anywhere close to making it in some years.

Most of Book's career he's been surrounded by simply bad players. You put all this blame on him, but he can't carry the team all by himself. Sarver was a pox on this organization, and unfortunately, once we got a good owner, he immediately went after team cancer Kevin Durant and walking injury Bradley Beal.

We stuck with Chris Paul, but he couldn't come close to replicate his 2021 accomplishments after that. We saw it plain as day. Once he got to 5 games left in the regular season, he became a shell of himself, either because of age or Covid. As good as most of us think Booker is, NONE of us who think he is among the best this franchise has ever had think he can carry the entire team all by himself. Book is a great player and among the greats of this franchise, but he's not at the level of a Giannis or Lebron James. Using players like that as the gauge for greatness is doing Book and the history of this franchise a disservice.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Most of Book's career he's been surrounded by simply bad players. You put all this blame on him, but he can't carry the team all by himself. Sarver was a pox on this organization, and unfortunately, once we got a good owner, he immediately went after team cancer Kevin Durant and walking injury Bradley Beal.

I don't put all the blame on Booker. But I see Booker as a guy who is not an elevator of bad talent around him.

We stuck with Chris Paul, but he couldn't come close to replicate his 2021 accomplishments after that. We saw it plain as day. Once he got to 5 games left in the regular season, he became a shell of himself, either because of age or Covid. As good as most of us think Booker is, NONE of us who think he is among the best this franchise has ever had think he can carry the entire team all by himself. Book is a great player and among the greats of this franchise, but he's not at the level of a Giannis or Lebron James. Using players like that as the gauge for greatness is doing Book and the history of this franchise a disservice.

Who's using those guys as gauge for greatness? I'm using guys on the Suns like Nash, who somehow dragged a team made up of Boris Diaw, Raja Bell, KT (for half a season) and Shawn Marion to 2 games of the Finals. Or KJ, who totally turned the Suns around from the day he was handed the rock as a 22 year old and made them a contender, immediately.

 

[Phrazbit]

I don't put all the blame on Booker. But I see Booker as a guy who is not an elevator of bad talent around him.

Who's using those guys as gauge for greatness? I'm using guys on the Suns like Nash, who somehow dragged a team made up of Boris Diaw, Raja Bell, KT (for half a season) and Shawn Marion to 2 games of the Finals. Or KJ, who totally turned the Suns around from the day he was handed the rock as a 22 year old and made them a contender, immediately.

I agree, I think Nash is the best. It is hard to understate the impact Nash had, not only on the team, but the entire league. He and D'Antoni changed the style of the NBA to such a degree that they are now both in the hall of fame. And they did it despite Robert Sarver. That 2006 team, with Nash and Marion, dragging a bunch of dudes who hardly started anywhere else in their careers, to the brink of the finals is the greatest achievement of any Suns player ever.

I've maintained throughout this thread, that Nash was one, there are a few people in contention for 2 and Booker is absolutely one of them. I still feel the same.

Nash's title hopes were drained by Sarver's penny pinching and short sighted thinking.

The only reason the franchise managed to stumble out of the hole Sarver dug is because they lucked into Booker. They kept making the wrong pick, even after stumbling across him but within a few years every other star in the league viewed him as a peer.

Sarver was a horror show of an owner. If not for Nash propping the franchise up for 8 years, followed by Booker getting better each year and staying blindly loyal... I don'y know if the franchise would even be here.

I wouldn't call Booker the most talented, I'd put Nash, Barkley, Marion and KJ above him, but I think he's the 2nd most impactful player in franchise history.

 

[Phrazbit]

Marion is the most underrated in franchise history, and among the most underrated in league history.

I cannot imagine how appreciated he'd be and how much he'd thrive in the modern NBA.

I honestly can't think of a comparison... Aaron Gordon... only more athletic, much better on the glass and an even better defender?