OT: Kyler Murray Debacle Thread

[Dback Jon]

Didn't realize that the Cardinals scored 28 points against the titans.

What did Murray lead us to in the 4th quarter of that game? That 10 yards or so of offense he was responsible for in 15 minutes surely should have put us over the top.

Hell, what did he lead us to the entire second half?

After the gimmee 3rd touchdown (ball fumbled to us on the 27) in the second quarter with 40 minutes of game time left...

6 plays for -3 yards punt
3 plays for -8 yards punt
3 plays for 2 yards punt
13 plays 51 yards Murray fumble
3 plays 1 yard punt
5 plays 92 yards Demarcado fumble on a 72 yard run
3 plays 1 yard punt
6 plays 15 yards punt

A whopping 79 yards of offense if you disregard the demarcado rush in 40 minutes of game time...

You wanna disregard the DeMarco rush, but you’re also disregarding the fact that if Demercado had held onto the ball for another half second the Cardinals would’ve scored 28 points in that game and they would’ve won the game

 

[Dback Jon]

The offense wouldn't be in position to win the game if Kyler was playing. JB moving the ball far better than he was.

and you know this because??

 

[Dback Jon]

But we would have seen one one of those cowardly intentional grounding plays where he looks like a child on a school playground.

Fortunately, we had one of those from JB in the fourth quarter yesterday as well

 

[Stout]

To be fair to Paris, there’s no OT that can block Parsons 1v1. Even Penei Sewell had his lunch money taken by Parsons this year.

Absolutely. I'm not taking anything away from Paris. He's good. Maybe even above average. He's just not in the elite tier, which is a narrative that has been pushed.

 

[Stout]

Fortunately, we had one of those from JB in the fourth quarter yesterday as well

*sigh* To repeat the blaringly obvious, one is a career backup, the other a #1 overall draft pick.

To answer your other question from the other post: Because Kyler.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

*sigh* To repeat the blaringly obvious, one is a career backup, the other a #1 overall draft pick.

To answer your other question from the other post: Because Kyler.

Even Love had a couple of bounce passes that weren't really close to a receiver when he was pressured by us.

 

[BritCard]

To be fair to Paris, there’s no OT that can block Parsons 1v1. Even Penei Sewell had his lunch money taken by Parsons this year.

Plus a lot of Parsons best work was against Williams. Paris has been good, but he's give up some pressures I'd like to see him do better on. Same versus the Colts.

 

[BritCard]

But SF and Seattle likely are. Similar results

It’s funny all the people that somehow think Jacoby Brissett is this magically better player when reading through the threads all of the same complaints about Kyler show up about JB

Wut? Brisset bugs out of the pocket too easy, doesn't keep his eyes downfield, doesn't go through his reads and won't take a hit for the team.

I must have been watching a different Brissett.

 

[BritCard]

and you know this because??

I know this because I watched 5 games of Kyler Murray this year.

 

[Chopper0080]

To be fair to Paris, there’s no OT that can block Parsons 1v1. Even Penei Sewell had his lunch money taken by Parsons this year.

Agree with this. Also to credit Paris, Green Bay decided to go away from him almost entirely after about the mid 2nd Q. Just like MHJ, you can get into the weeds of whether or not Paris is living up to his draft status but that takes away form the fact that he is not part of the problem. Lots of the Cardinals young players fall into this category for me.

 

[kerouac9]

Agree with this. Also to credit Paris, Green Bay decided to go away from him almost entirely after about the mid 2nd Q. Just like MHJ, you can get into the weeds of whether or not Paris is living up to his draft status but that takes away form the fact that he is not part of the problem. Lots of the Cardinals young players fall into this category for me.

Paris is not part of the problem and clearly one of the three best players on the offense and maybe the team.

 

[PDXChris]

The thing that JB did yesterday that Kyler isn't able to due to his size is that thst 5-7 step drop and stand tall to survey the field. Its obvious now that Kyler isnt able to see the entire field like JB. Kyler scrambles much earlier and I now think that is because once the pocket collapses, he loses visibility of the field due to his height.

I mentioned yesterday that if KM and JB had a baby, it would be Lamar Jackson!

 

[DVontel]

Agree with this. Also to credit Paris, Green Bay decided to go away from him almost entirely after about the mid 2nd Q. Just like MHJ, you can get into the weeds of whether or not Paris is living up to his draft status but that takes away form the fact that he is not part of the problem. Lots of the Cardinals young players fall into this category for me.

Can you? I think Paris is much better at his position than MHJ is.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

The OL has given up more pressures than I can remember in a 2-game stretch. Great job by Jacoby to still get the ball out sometimes, but the OL is a big worry with a new QB going forward.

3 years into the rebuild and our O-line needs 2 new guards and a new RT. Our best player on our D-line is 39, and all the guys the FO have drafted on the line either aren't playing or terrible.

For a team that was allegedly going to be built in the trenches, this is a total failure. Why would anyone trust these people to make more picks?

 

[Crimson Warrior]

K1 watching BBQ run the hell out of the passing game was probably one of the best things that could have happened to him at this point of the proceedings.

 

[Chopper0080]

Can you? I think Paris is much better at his position than MHJ is.

I think PJJ ranks better amongst his peer LTs but I am also in the minority in thinking that MHJ issues are overstated. His receiving yards per game of 56.6 lands him at 30th in the NFL. Notable guys around him. Rome 59.8. Tet 59. Waddle 57.9. Aj Brown 56.4. McConkey 54.3. BTJ 52.1.

Good but not great stats. Tough to complain about on this team until you factor in "was drafted 4th overall".

Like I don't believe it's a problem to have

1 of the top 16 LTs in the NFL.

1 of the top 32 WRs in the NFL.

I don't believe either of those things are part of the problem with the Cardinals.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

I think PJJ ranks better amongst his peer LTs but I am also in the minority in thinking that MHJ issues are overstated. His receiving yards per game of 56.6 lands him at 30th in the NFL. Notable guys around him. Rome 59.8. Tet 59. Waddle 57.9. Aj Brown 56.4. McConkey 54.3. BTJ 52.1.

Good but not great stats. Tough to complain about on this team until you factor in "was drafted 4th overall".

Good point, and Paris' position does not rely of Kyler throwing him the ball.

 

[Cheesebeef]

But SF and Seattle likely are. Similar results

No they weren’t. Against SF and Seattle and we averaged 16.5 ppg. Against the Packers and Colts, we’ve averaged 25 ppg.

 

[DVontel]

was drafted 4th overall".

Well…..yea, lol. Matters a lot.

Also, I don’t think MHJ will ever be better than McBride. ILBs & DBs struggle to cover McBride while CBs can at least stay with MHJ. Offense goes as McBride does.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

Well…..yea, lol. Matters a lot.

Also, I don’t think MHJ will ever be better than McBride. ILBs & DBs struggle to cover McBride while CBs can at least stay with MHJ. Offense goes as McBride does.

I was hoping on our last drive we would throw one to McBride to try and get the winning TD. Doing a short Hail Mary style pass to a bunch of guys didn't seem like the best idea to win the game to me. Throw it to your best pass catcher.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Doesn't the fact that there is a debate on who the Cards should be starting, Murray or Brissett, tell us all we need to know about Kyler?

 

[Cheesebeef]

I think PJJ ranks better amongst his peer LTs but I am also in the minority in thinking that MHJ issues are overstated. His receiving yards per game of 56.6 lands him at 30th in the NFL. Notable guys around him. Rome 59.8. Tet 59. Waddle 57.9. Aj Brown 56.4. McConkey 54.3. BTJ 52.1.

Good but not great stats. Tough to complain about on this team until you factor in "was drafted 4th overall".

Like I don't believe it's a problem to have

1 of the top 16 LTs in the NFL.

1 of the top 32 WRs in the NFL.

I don't believe either of those things are part of the problem with the Cardinals.

You don’t draft guys in the top 6 picks of the draft to have them be only in the top 50% of LTs and the worst #1 WR in football.

You take guys that high to be superstars or at least stars. And when they’re consistently not stars and not even close to superstars, that IS a problem.

 

[Chopper0080]

Well…..yea, lol. Matters a lot.

Also, I don’t think MHJ will ever be better than McBride. ILBs & DBs struggle to cover McBride while CBs can at least stay with MHJ. Offense goes as McBride does.

What's the line? Is 15th best in the NFL make you worthy of the 4th overall pick? 10th? 20th? I think it is very arbitrary and none of it is on the player. If you want to complain, complain about the GM who decided to select MHJ #4 (which I feel you do but still worth stating).

And yes, the passing game is based around the TE, and the TE has turned out to be very good. I don't see why that becomes an indictment on MHJ.

 

[Mr X]

This is not going to be good going forward. What if Murray plays horrible vs Cowboys? Will they really bench him mid game? Let him play it out with this O-line and possibly get injured?

 

[Cheesebeef]

What's the line? Is 15th best in the NFL make you worthy of the 4th overall pick? 10th? 20th? I think it is very arbitrary and none of it is on the player. If you want to complain, complain about the GM who decided to select MHJ #4 (which I feel you do but still worth stating).

And yes, the passing game is based around the TE, and the TE has turned out to be very good. I don't see why that becomes an indictment on MHJ.

How about the line is you crack 1000 yards as a BARE MINIMUM, especially in a 17 game season. In year 2, Marv again isn’t even on track to do that with drops in every game, running wrong routes, looking lazy, not blocking, etc.