2025 Cardinals Preseason Thread

[Chopper0080]

Agree with
1-Paris Johnson Jr
2-Jonah Williams
3-Kelvin Beachum
4-Christian Jones

5-Hjalte Froholdt
6-Isaiah Adams
7-Evan Brown

So , probably 8 or 9. You still need a backup C, but that could be Brown who has played C before so I don't believe Gaines is a lock. Team prefer players with versatility at these spots so I would probably start there. I think the roster crunch limits OL to 9 max unless some players really flash.

Add Will Hernandez to make it 8 locked in.

So, 1 or 2 more possibilities. Preseason might REALLY matter for these spots.

 

[Chopper0080]

And OL are known for not being ready until year 3-4.

I believe this is a little outdated / false. I think it generally takes 3-4 years for OL to peak. Paris Johnson is a good example of that.

7 of 9 offensive linemen drafted in round 1 of 2024 started 7 or more games. 6 of 9 started 10+.

All 6 offensive linemen drafted in round 2 of 2024 started a game and 3 started 10+.

Of the 10 offensive linemen drafted in round 3 of 2024, 4 started 10+ games and 6 started 5 +.

 

[BACH]

I believe this is a little outdated / false. I think it generally takes 3-4 years for OL to peak. Paris Johnson is a good example of that.

7 of 9 offensive linemen drafted in round 1 of 2024 started 7 or more games. 6 of 9 started 10+.

All 6 offensive linemen drafted in round 2 of 2024 started a game and 3 started 10+.

Of the 10 offensive linemen drafted in round 3 of 2024, 4 started 10+ games and 6 started 5 +.

I actually think it's as relevant as ever, but should probably have specified that it of course doesn't apply to all.

But if you listen to Check the Mic podcast they keep track of mid drafted OL and how they do not reach peak until year 3+. If you take the 15 best OTs in the league per pff - 13 of them didn't reach a high grade until year 3 or later. Williams was e.g. pretty average until his 6th year and then he became the best in the league.

 

[oaken1]

I actually think it's as relevant as ever, but should probably have specified that it of course doesn't apply to all.

But if you listen to Check the Mic podcast they keep track of mid drafted OL and how they do not reach peak until year 3+. If you take the 15 best OTs in the league per pff - 13 of them didn't reach a high grade until year 3 or later. Williams was e.g. pretty average until his 6th year and then he became the best in the league.

It's the same for all the strength based positions. Ol or dl..it takes a few seasons

 

[Chopper0080]

I actually think it's as relevant as ever, but should probably have specified that it of course doesn't apply to all.

But if you listen to Check the Mic podcast they keep track of mid drafted OL and how they do not reach peak until year 3+. If you take the 15 best OTs in the league per pff - 13 of them didn't reach a high grade until year 3 or later. Williams was e.g. pretty average until his 6th year and then he became the best in the league.

I disagree that "reaching their peak" and "not being ready" are the same thing. I would argue most players take a couple years to reach their peak. I can't think of many(any) examples where a player's first two years in the NFL are their best. Maybe RGIII?

 

[Chopper0080]

It's the same for all the strength based positions. Ol or dl..it takes a few seasons

On the other hand, in the 25 OL players taken in the top 100 of the 2024 draft class, 15 started more than 5 games their rookie season. 60% of those 25 players seem to show these guys can come in and contribute right away.

 

[BooksOrangePlanet]

sounds like wilson is good

Cardinals' Michael Wilson: Ditches non-contact jersey

Cardinals' Michael Wilson: Ditches non-contact jersey

www.cbssports.com

 

[BACH]

I disagree that "reaching their peak" and "not being ready" are the same thing. I would argue most players take a couple years to reach their peak. I can't think of many(any) examples where a player's first two years in the NFL are their best. Maybe RGIII?

Fully agree on that. Wrong formulation on my part in my post.

 

[BACH]

It's the same for all the strength based positions. Ol or dl..it takes a few seasons

Same for the strength part IMO, but OL is harder to much harder to learn. The individual complexity is x10

 

[oaken1]

On the other hand, in the 25 OL players taken in the top 100 of the 2024 draft class, 15 started more than 5 games their rookie season. 60% of those 25 players seem to show these guys can come in and contribute right away.

That's part of the evaluation process in why guys get drafted sooner...stronger guys with more advanced skills get picked early..dudes who are less physically mature or that haven't had high end coaching go a little later

 

[BACH]

What is the Domino Effect of Hernandez coming back? Will it:
A. Determine the final number of OL, 8-9-10?
B. Assuming Adams starts amd Willi sits, who becomes the odd man out, on Cut Day?
C. Top three OT's are set, but does the addition of WH, make it less or more likely that a 4th OT will be kept?

Thanks for any insight.

I think the answer to all 3 comes down to the overall talent level.

With Will signed there is 7 locks on the OL as capable starters. Christian Jones is IMO a step ahead of the rest, which makes him #8. Big gap after him from what we have seen so far IMO.

A. That makes it 9 because the choice between e.g. LJ Collier and Hayden Connor on the final roster is easy. I do not think 8 is realistic with Hernandez possibly not game ready for the first 2-6 weeks.

B. If only 9 kept. #9 will most likely be a guard and there will be 2-3 OL on the PS. #9 is the back-up OR under new rules you can elevate a player from the PS for up to 3 games without putting them on the active roster. Use #9 or PS players for back-up G until Hernandez is ready.

C. Nothing, because at the end of the day, Christian Jones is the best after the 7 clear locks, making him a lock by default himself.

I can see someone released by another team taking the 9th spot.

 

[Garthshort]

Other than getting beat for a sack, it seems to me that an OL man is a hard position to evaluate in TC. The exception might be a center that has a couple of poor snaps. Anyone agree?

 

[cardncubfan]

Cardinals Bring Back Offensive Lineman Will Hernandez

Veteran will start his camp on PUP after knee injury

www.azcardinals.com

 

[Chopper0080]

That's part of the evaluation process in why guys get drafted sooner...stronger guys with more advanced skills get picked early..dudes who are less physically mature or that haven't had high end coaching go a little later

But isn't this true for every position? I can't think of examples at any position where less physically mature players with less high end coaching get selected before guys with more advanced skills.

 

[Chopper0080]

Same for the strength part IMO, but OL is harder to much harder to learn. The individual complexity is x10

Having done some quick investigation, it seems EDGE players have some of the toughest time being able to make an immediate impact by starting games. Even picks who turned out to be good players didn't start year 1. Will McDonald, Nolan Smith, and Derick Hall are some examples from 2023. That trio didn't start one game in their rookie season. (maybe 1). And of the 14 EDGE players drafted in the 1st three rounds of that draft, only three started over 10 games in their rookie season. Will Anderson, Tuli Tuipolotu, and Byron Young. Also consider only 1 of the 6 DGE drafted in round 1 hit that mark.

The 2022 EDGE class mirrors this as well.

 

[kerouac9]

Having done some quick investigation, it seems EDGE players have some of the toughest time being able to make an immediate impact by starting games. Even picks who turned out to be good players didn't start year 1. Will McDonald, Nolan Smith, and Derick Hall are some examples from 2023. That trio didn't start one game in their rookie season. (maybe 1). And of the 14 EDGE players drafted in the 1st three rounds of that draft, only three started over 10 games in their rookie season. Will Anderson, Tuli Tuipolotu, and Byron Young. Also consider only 1 of the 6 DGE drafted in round 1 hit that mark.

The 2022 EDGE class mirrors this as well.

Starts are a poor metric for comparison across these position groups. IMO. Many teams send DL in waves; almost every team sticks with a starting OL as long as possible.

Getting 60% or more of the snaps should qualify a DL as a “starter” regardless of whether they were on the field for the first snap.

 

[Chopper0080]

Starts are a poor metric for comparison across these position groups. IMO. Many teams send DL in waves; almost every team sticks with a starting OL as long as possible.

Getting 60% or more of the snaps should qualify a DL as a “starter” regardless of whether they were on the field for the first snap.

I think this is a fair point but I was not willing to invest that much time when this curiosity popped into my head. Maybe I will get that itch in the future.

 

[Adrian]

Biggest Reason to Watch Arizona Cardinals' Preseason Game Revealed

There's a different feeling in the air surrounding the Arizona Cardinals as the preseason approaches rapidly. No longer are fans looking on with uncertainty, a

www.si.com

 

[Adrian]

Cardinals vs Chiefs game parking, security, bag policy: What to know

What bags can I bring into State Farm Stadium? What to know before the Arizona Cardinals vs Kansas City Chiefs NFL preseason game on Saturday, Aug. 9.

www.azcentral.com

 

[Adrian]

Yahoo Sports: News, Scores, Video, Fantasy Games, Schedules & More - Yahoo Sports

Sports News, Scores, Fantasy Games

sports.yahoo.com

 

[kerouac9]

Cards moneyline +125 for Saturday is kinda juicy right?

 

[Adrian]

Behind Enemy Lines: Get the inside scoop on Arizona before the Chiefs face the Cardinals

Get the inside scoop on Arizona before the Chiefs face the Cardinals in this Q&A with Jess Root of Cards Wire.

sports.yahoo.com

 

[Harry]

As far as I know the only team to bring in Hernandez for a visit this offseason so far is the Arizona Cardinals. That can obviously change but it is a good sign for the Cards

Once again he knew the Cards would sign him from the beginning of free agency.

 

[BooksOrangePlanet]

**** this heat
**** my job
**** the news
**** boredom
**** traffic
**** baseball
**** streaming the same movies and shows over and over again im ready for some got damn football - for real - **** the television put it in my veins

football with my morning coffe football with my morning dump - more football all day at work cuz hippie just don't gaf

idc if we're good or not - it'd be nice but i really just need my vice - sure - it's not so good for the heart but tina turner got it wrong - part of having a heart is indeed having it broken - for years - decades

these hopefully harmless minor cardiac events are what we live for - we don't have a winning history - our division is forever kicking our ass and k9 can't stop reminding us how crappy it all really is yet we insist because **** san francisco **** pete carroll **** the lambs whatever city they're in ****'em all - im ready for some ********** football

 

[BullheadCardFan]

**** this heat
**** my job
**** the news
**** boredom
**** traffic
**** baseball
**** streaming the same movies and shows over and over again im ready for some got damn football - for real - **** the television put it in my veins

football with my morning coffe football with my morning dump - more football all day at work cuz hippie just don't gaf

idc if we're good or not - it'd be nice but i really just need my vice - sure - it's not so good for the heart but tina turner got it wrong - part of having a heart is indeed having it broken - for years - decades

these hopefully harmless minor cardiac events are what we live for - we don't have a winning history - our division is forever kicking our ass and k9 can't stop reminding us how crappy it all really is yet we insist because **** san francisco **** pete carroll **** the lambs whatever city they're in ****'em all - im ready for some ********** football

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