Zach Allen Signs with Denver

[RON_IN_OC]

KEIM

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[pemory09]

For all of those saying we "let him walk," it's probably worth considering that maybe he just didn't want to be here for a long rebuild and to learn a new system.

Sure, I suppose we could have franchised him, but otherwise... not our decision to make.

Good point, but…he’s all in on the current mess that is Denver???

 

[pemory09]

KEIM

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No, it’s not. The explanation can be summed up in two words: Steve Keim.

 

[Chopper0080]

Not too worried about losing Allen. He was injured a lot. Plus he is obviously happy to be reunited with VJ so that’s good for him

He missed like 6 games over two years. Kyler missed more and we paid him 45 mil per year.

 

[BritCard]

Oh my. Really? That's where you're hanging your hat?

He went for less than what you're predicting, and suddenly you lowered what you think we should have paid for him. Quelle surprise!

So you're not going to explain the difference then?

Who went for less than I was predicting? Allen? I said he was worth $12-13m but that I could see somebody overpaying $15-16m because I know free agency is nuts.

I don't think Allen is worth $15m+.

I see Allen in the Ogunjobi / Ioainidis range. Statistically he is worse than both at the same stage. This is way above what either of them have ever been paid and into full on Javon Hargrave, Letcher Coz, Grady Jarrett territory and he isn't a fraction of those guys. It's a huge gamble by Denver that he makes a leap.

It's a gamble I could have talked myself into had he stayed, but it's also one I can absolutely understand passing on.

 

[Chopper0080]

I'd argue it's probably best if you re-sign them before they have the potential to hit the open market, like in their third year. But, you have to be able to actually identify that.

Given that Keim had pretty much drafted nothing but trash in the last decade, was replacing our entire roster every year with "Keim time" deals, overpayment, or traded draft picks, what do you expect? It was literally every year for like the past five that we were in the top five of having to replace rostered players/starters.

Zach Allen is a good, improving player, who got paid like he's gonna be a star. I don't see it.

15mil is being paid like the 25th best defensive/edge lineman. If he produces more, he will be underpaid. Milk doesn't cost a nickel anymore.

 

[BritCard]

15mil is being paid like the 25th best defensive/edge lineman. If he produces more, he will be underpaid. Milk doesn't cost a nickel anymore.

IF carrying a lot of weight there

The free agency graveyard is littered with the bones of FA signings paid in the hope that they produce more.

 

[bankybruce]

He missed like 6 games over two years. Kyler missed more and we paid him 45 mil per year.

And 22 over 4 years. I would have liked to have seen him back, but as I said before and you thumbs down, I'm ok not paying him $15 million a year to average 5.5 games missed a year over his career.

 

[Chopper0080]

People need to stop uttering Steve Keim as an excuse why Monti can't improve the roster. Yes, the roster has holes heading into this offseason. Monti is the one who is now creating more holes.

 

[jbjarko]

As AR would say...."calm down", we're on day 2 of FA.

 

[Chopper0080]

And 22 over 4 years. I would have liked to have seen him back, but as I said before and you thumbs down, I'm ok not paying him $15 million a year to average 5.5 games missed a year over his career.

How are you going to judge a player for his production when he wasn't a starter? Allen has been a starter for two season and has put up good numbers over those two seasons. We took a guy in the third round, developed him into one of our four best defensive players, and then let him go at age 26 when he is heading into his prime. His contract is a top 25 defensive front player which is what he is.

 

[Chopper0080]

As AR would say...."calm down", we're on day 2 of FA.

I find these comments funny because I feel they lack context.

There are 2 interior defensive line players left in free agency who are 27 or under and who played over 50% of defensive snaps last year. Greg Gaines and Taven Bryan. There are two edge players who are available who meet the same criteria, Anthony Nelson and Charles Omenihu.

So, while it may be day 2, our options to add a productive defensive front player who is 27 or younger are Greg Gaines, Taven Bryan, Anthony Nelson and Charles Omenihu.

 

[bankybruce]

How are you going to judge a player for his production when he wasn't a starter? Allen has been a starter for two season and has put up good numbers over those two seasons. We took a guy in the third round, developed him into one of our four best defensive players, and then let him go at age 26 when he is heading into his prime. His contract is a top 25 defensive front player which is what he is.

Games missed due to injury are Ggames missed whether he was a starter or not. My only concern with him has been durability and he still hasn't shown he can go an entire season without missing games. Again, I would have like to keep him, but I'm ok losing him at $15 million knowing he has durability issues.

 

[Stout]

Our divisional foes are in a much different situation than us, and yes, this is part of a plan.

Then it's a bad plan.

 

[BritCard]

People need to stop uttering Steve Keim as an excuse why Monti can't improve the roster. Yes, the roster has holes heading into this offseason. Monti is the one who is now creating more holes.

Perfectly legitimate and not at all unreasonable to consider a DE in a 3-4 with no more than 5.5 in a season not to be worth $15.25m a year to this roster in the situation it's in.

This was not a must do deal at that price.

 

[Chopper0080]

For the offensive line, 27 and under playing over 80% of snaps is two players. Orlando Brown and Dennis Daley.

 

[Stout]

As AR would say...."calm down", we're on day 2 of FA.

We just made a mistake that can't be fixed with FA. We literally didn't want to have to worry about filling said hole in FA. This is the problem.

 

[Chopper0080]

Games missed due to injury are Ggames missed whether he was a starter or not. My only concern with him has been durability and he still hasn't shown he can go an entire season without missing games. Again, I would have like to keep him, but I'm ok losing him at $15 million knowing he has durability issues.

Zach Allen games played at ages 24 and 25. 27.

Myles Garrett games played at ages 24 and 25. 24.

Nick Bosa 33.

Joey Bosa 26.

Chris Jones 23.

Javon Hargrave 26.

Leonard Williams 28.

Maybe it is that playing on the defensive line is really taxing on a young body, and it takes some time to mature and handle that beating.

 

[RON_IN_OC]

He missed like 6 games over two years. Kyler missed more and we paid him 45 mil per year.

He played in 4 games in 2019, 13 in 2020, 15 in 2021 and 13 in 2022. 45 out of 66 possible games for his career.

 

[BritCard]

I find these comments funny because I feel they lack context.

There are 2 interior defensive line players left in free agency who are 27 or under and who played over 50% of defensive snaps last year. Greg Gaines and Taven Bryan. There are two edge players who are available who meet the same criteria, Anthony Nelson and Charles Omenihu.

So, while it may be day 2, our options to add a productive defensive front player who is 27 or younger are Greg Gaines, Taven Bryan, Anthony Nelson and Charles Omenihu.

What does being 26 have to do with anything?

I don't get this fascination with age. Give me a great 28 year old over an average 26 year old who might be good one day.

Would you rather have Byron Murphy or Jalen Ramsey?

Would you rather have Zaven Collins or Matt Milano?

 

[RON_IN_OC]

People need to stop uttering Steve Keim as an excuse why Monti can't improve the roster. Yes, the roster has holes heading into this offseason. Monti is the one who is now creating more holes.

Keeping Allen isn't improving the roster, it's being ok with status quo.

If Monti is tearing it down, we should be happy, because it means he's fully in control and not 'We're not as bad off as you think' Mike B.

 

[SoonerLou]

He missed like 6 games over two years. Kyler missed more and we paid him 45 mil per year.

At the time we paid Kyler he missed 3 games in 3 years.

 

[Chopper0080]

He played in 4 games in 2019, 13 in 2020, 15 in 2021 and 13 in 2022. 45 out of 66 possible games for his career.

So you are taking the argument that it takes years for drafted players to develop and using it against a third round pick? Allen was a mid round draft pick, developed into a quality starter, and now we use that to justify not keeping him?

 

[PJ1]

What does being 26 have to do with anything?

I don't get this fascination with age. Give me a great 28 year old over an average 26 year old who might be good one day.

Would you rather have Byron Murphy or Jalen Ramsey?

Would you rather have Zaven Collins or Matt Milano?

Ok so we are getting a great 28 year old?The Cardinals failed to sign Allen or Murphy a year ago. Also failed to identify they would get better.

 

[Stout]

Keeping Allen isn't improving the roster, it's being ok with status quo.

If Monti is tearing it down, we should be happy, because it means he's fully in control and not 'We're not as bad off as you think' Mike B.

That is a bold opinion right there, and one I very much disagree with. Well, the wording isn't good. Keeping Allen wouldn't be improving the roster, but insuring it doesn't get a worse. It's laughable labeling it being "ok with status quo" as he was a bright spot on a lousy roster. Good attempt at reframing a roster loss that directly goes against trying to build for the future, though.