Cardinals Seahawks: The everything wrong with Kyler thread

Stout

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the meta explanation:

play bend but dont break defense: give up the 5-7 yard completion or 3-5 yard run, but nothing more. As the field compresses in the red zone and especially goal to go -- you can cover those 5-yard completions/runs without worrying about the deeper stuff.

Count on the law of averages catching up before a TD is scored: the Cards offense will have two unproductive snaps in a row -- batted pass, off target throw, etc.

this is both a Card problem and an NFL problem -- but the Cards are really struggling with it.

its interesting that on successful TDs in red zone / goal to go: they typically have featured a strong run to get them inside the 3
The only thing the bend but don't break defense does is ensure you will break, just like the prevent defense only prevents you from winning. The defensive philosophy disgusts me because it's sometimes good enough against bad offenses (though not always even then) and hot garbage against good offenses.
 

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The only thing the bend but don't break defense does is ensure you will break, just like the prevent defense only prevents you from winning. The defensive philosophy disgusts me because it's sometimes good enough against bad offenses (though not always even then) and hot garbage against good offenses.
It drives me nuts with players out of position, CBs giving big cushions and WRs wide open all the time

Not a good defense to be counted on for consistency
 

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The only thing the bend but don't break defense does is ensure you will break, just like the prevent defense only prevents you from winning. The defensive philosophy disgusts me because it's sometimes good enough against bad offenses (though not always even then) and hot garbage against good offenses.

Clichés from fans. (IMO)

If they didn't have a purpose, DC's wouldn't use either.
 

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What did we learn from this thread (thanks for the effort Brit!):

The "Fire Kliff" and "defenses have caught up to him" rhetoric was premature.

K1 has regressed. He is not making the big time throws we have seen in the past and he is missing some really easy ones.

Good news - he is super talented and CAN do it.
Concerning news - He should be better at this point but he isn't getting it done. The question is why...
 

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The only thing the bend but don't break defense does is ensure you will break, just like the prevent defense only prevents you from winning. The defensive philosophy disgusts me because it's sometimes good enough against bad offenses (though not always even then) and hot garbage against good offenses.
i dont know. it feels like 28/32 defensive coordinators in the NFL have adopted this philosophy to varying degrees
 

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i dont know. it feels like 28/32 defensive coordinators in the NFL have adopted this philosophy to varying degrees
It’s not like we have a choice either. We don’t have the 49ers, Bills, or Eagles’ personnel where we can get home with 4 while playing press. We try to do that & the defense will look like playing the Chiefs every Sunday.
 

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What did we learn from this thread (thanks for the effort Brit!):

The "Fire Kliff" and "defenses have caught up to him" rhetoric was premature.

K1 has regressed. He is not making the big time throws we have seen in the past and he is missing some really easy ones.

Good news - he is super talented and CAN do it.
Concerning news - He should be better at this point but he isn't getting it done. The question is why...
You ask why. I don't know why, but I do have an opinion. There are no factual basis for my opinion, other than from watching the games and from reading about him on here.

He seems to make the same mistakes over and over and over again. He is not learning from past simple mistakes. Here, I am talking about simple things that most pre-high school qb's make (not throwing the ball away, running out of bounds or staying in bounds, sliding early, etc.). Those are the fairly simple mistakes he makes.

The more difficult mistakes that he is not learning from are things such as reading the defense, knowing who to throw the ball to, etc. I'm not so sure he is smart enough to read defenses, or go thru his progressions and things that elite qb's do. He has to rely on his natural athletic ability to have success and has not been using his "smarts". He needs to get smart and use both.

If he is smart enough, then he should probably do a whole lot more film study. Or maybe, he's just too lazy to learn and progress. He needs to do what it takes to get smarter and quit making stupid mistakes.

I don't like writing these kind of things, but, I guess I'm just really frustrated at his and the offenses level of play this year.

Com'on SK and KK. Get this team going in high gear the rest of the way.

End of rant.
 

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Surprised this hasn't been posted yet this year.

Kyler's QB grid this year.

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Kyler's QB grid last year

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That grid is not surprising considering what we've seen this season but I think some people really need to see it. He's played like Drew Lock to start the season.
 

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Horrible past 20 yards obviously. Not sure why that regressed but you can clearly see it.

Can we at least stop the fake news that Kyler can't throw over the middle?
An inconsistent line that a QB doesn't have a ton of confidence in can also affect how he is seeing the deep routes. He hasn't had the same continuity on the line that he did last year. Plug and play players make things a little sketchy. IMO.
 
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An inconsistent line that a QB doesn't have a ton of confidence in can also affect how he is seeing the deep routes. He hasn't had the same continuity on the line that he did last year. Plug and play players make things a little sketchy. IMO.

Kyler has less pressure through the first 7 games of this season than he did through the first 7 last season.

He has 3 more hurries so far this year than the same period last year (35 vs 32) but 18 (!) of them were vs the Chiefs. Through the other 6 games he's way down.

And he has 1 less sack so far this year.

The O line this year is better than the one he had last year when he was making all the down field throws.
 

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That grid is not surprising considering what we've seen this season but I think some people really need to see it. He's played like Drew Lock to start the season.
Just go back to last year and remember it's not how you start ............... . There's a lot of FB left.
 

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Surprised this hasn't been posted yet this year.

Kyler's QB grid this year.

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Kyler's QB grid last year

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the downfield stuff is just perplexing

Did he get lucky a lot last year? I don't think that's the case because he was good the two seasons prior
 

Chopper0080

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the downfield stuff is just perplexing

Did he get lucky a lot last year? I don't think that's the case because he was good the two seasons prior
League wide defenses are playing more shell coverage which is hurting Kyler because he likes those passes. So, less are open and Kyler is still trying to attack that area. Kyler should be crushing in the mid range but that is tough because he likes to see separation before delivering the ball.

Watching Kenny Pickett last night there was a throw he made when the receiving was covered but the defender has his head turned. Kyler doesn't attempt those types of passes because he still deems that player as covered.
 

Arz101

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League wide defenses are playing more shell coverage which is hurting Kyler because he likes those passes. So, less are open and Kyler is still trying to attack that area. Kyler should be crushing in the mid range but that is tough because he likes to see separation before delivering the ball.

Watching Kenny Pickett last night there was a throw he made when the receiving was covered but the defender has his head turned. Kyler doesn't attempt those types of passes because he still deems that player as covered.
Necessassitty Is the mother of all inventions. So, maybe, Kyler will now be forced to learn because opposing defenses are taken away his long ball. What Kliff could not teach, the league is teaching Kyler.
 

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Kurt Warner was on 98.7 moments ago (it will show up in their podcasts for on demand listening by tomorrow)

things i learned:

1. Hopkins does make a diff (duh) -- but one reason is you can isolate him by himself on one side of the field and quickly see if you have him 1 v 1 and if so, he wins that battle. makes things easier

2. Many colleges now have a "progression" read system where QBs regardless of defense look at #1 option, then #2, etc.

This is different than a "read the coverage" process where its "based on this coverage -- i go to this guy". NFL speed makes it hard to get through progressions consistently.

Also, he thinks its hard for players always in a progression system to go to a read the coverage system.
 
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League wide defenses are playing more shell coverage which is hurting Kyler because he likes those passes. So, less are open and Kyler is still trying to attack that area. Kyler should be crushing in the mid range but that is tough because he likes to see separation before delivering the ball.

Watching Kenny Pickett last night there was a throw he made when the receiving was covered but the defender has his head turned. Kyler doesn't attempt those types of passes because he still deems that player as covered.

I'm just not seeing it. Teams aren't playing more 2 high against us than they ever have. And it's not like he's having passes knocked down. His passes are way off target.
 

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