DeAndre Ayton: “I’m not struggling on defense”

sunsfan88

ASFN Icon
BANNED BY MODERATORS
Joined
Feb 1, 2010
Posts
11,660
Reaction score
844
I'm in the middle of asking Phoenix Suns rookie center DeAndre Ayton about what some scouts consider the biggest weakness of the 20-year-old Bahamian's game – his defense – when he cuts me off.

"I'm tired of hearing that," Ayton tells me. "I went through that in college, and I'm going through it in the NBA. I don't know what you guys want from me. I'm 7'1" and I'm guarding point guards. I don't understand how much I have to show. I'm guarding the perimeter, running after guards across screens, pin downs, running through dribble-hand-offs and pick-and-roll ball screens – as a seven-foot player! In the NBA I have to protect the rim. I love defense. I'm not struggling on defense. I love to make my opponent look bad."

He pauses for emphasis: "I love defense."

"They don't have nothing bad to say about my game, so they pick and choose," Ayton said, talking about those who criticize him on defense.

"People can't find what my weakness is, so I think they just pick that. I am the (defensive) anchor on the team. I know everybody's spots, where everyone's going to be going. I talk all the time."

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/...-moves-forward/amp/?__twitter_impression=true
The “they don’t have anything bad to say about my game so they pick and choose” thing sounds almost like someone full of themselves.

He is right though in that he stays with perimeter players pretty well on switches and such. However, I’m not sure he isn’t struggling on that end overall (especially rim protection wise) though I do expect him to get better on that end as he gains experience.

Good read overall on his rookie season.
 
Last edited:

95pro

ASFN Icon
Joined
May 10, 2007
Posts
11,931
Reaction score
3,568
Booker usually looses his guy or doesn't switch quick enough, then there goes our perimeter defense. By then Ayton is too late to come over on help defense. We've seen Ayton do a great job 1 on 1 when defending a guard, it's not a quickness or lateral issues with him. Sometimes its his drive but you can't help feel for him to be defeated when our perimeter defense breaks down far too often.
 

BC867

Long time Phoenician!
Joined
Sep 16, 2002
Posts
17,827
Reaction score
1,709
Location
NE Phoenix
...We've seen Ayton do a great job 1 on 1 when defending a guard...
And when he's defending the smallest player on the court, who is defending the tallest?

That is a management shortcoming.
 

CardsSunsDbacks

Not So Skeptical
Joined
Aug 26, 2012
Posts
9,898
Reaction score
6,107
And when he's defending the smallest player on the court, who is defending the tallest?

That is a management shortcoming.
That's the NBA. Teams will cause you to have to switch your big man onto a guard and thus get the little guy stuck guarding a big man. This is why it is so important that your big men can keep up with the small guys when it happens.
 

SirStefan32

Krycek, Alex Krycek
Joined
Oct 15, 2002
Posts
18,435
Reaction score
4,714
Location
Harrisburg, PA
Ayton is better than some people think, but he is delusional if he really thinks he is a good defender with a Kevin Garnett mentality. I am guessing he knows he is not a good defender, and has some serious insecurities about it.
 
OP
OP
sunsfan88

sunsfan88

ASFN Icon
BANNED BY MODERATORS
Joined
Feb 1, 2010
Posts
11,660
Reaction score
844
We fail to see this often.
This could be because the alternate options are even worse (Holmes, for examples is just too small even though he plays with great energy).
 

Hoop Head

ASFN Icon
Supporting Member
Joined
Feb 4, 2005
Posts
15,975
Reaction score
10,862
Location
Tempe, AZ
The “they don’t have anything bad to say about my game so they pick and choose” thing sounds almost like someone full of themselves.

It seems that's the mentality some posters take on when Ayton is criticized, maybe he learned that excuse from the ASFN board? That is what some say when people are critical of Ayton, even when praising him with 90% of their post.
 

Hoop Head

ASFN Icon
Supporting Member
Joined
Feb 4, 2005
Posts
15,975
Reaction score
10,862
Location
Tempe, AZ
And when he's defending the smallest player on the court, who is defending the tallest?

That is a management shortcoming.

And just how often is he defending the smallest guy on the court? Did you quit watching games? I think there might be a shot or two like that where Ayton is "guarding" or switched off onto the opposing team's PG but even then, he should be sending that ball into their face but he's not even picking up easy blocks like that.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

I'm better than Mulli!
Joined
Sep 16, 2002
Posts
59,876
Reaction score
51,167
Location
SoCal
We fail to see this often. There is more to D than blocking shots.
Right, there is letting your man (zubac) and everyone else on the clippers score over and over again at the rim. Zubac was a better defender at the rim for the clips last night than was Ayton. He just flat out sucks defensively. So many of you want to say it’s just a lack of blocks but otherwise he’s so good. He’s not. Teams score at will on us in the paint. Ayton makes little effort to deter them, and in the rare instances where he “tries” he’s horribly ineffective. He’s got the tools to become better. But if he thinks he doesn’t have to (and that’s what this article is full of, false bravado) he’s not going to put in the work.

He likes the shiny things like shooting. Imo, to this point in his young career, he hasn’t found the hunger to put in the work and get dirty. Again last night 3 FTs against a young less athletic zubac and a dude in Harrell who, while a strong guy, is FIVE INCHES SHORTER than Ayton. And Ayton is shooting fadeaways.

I’m hopeful for his future, but I’m realistic about his present. And at present he’s the BIG PUSS.
 

Dr. Jones

Has No Time For Love
Joined
Nov 2, 2004
Posts
24,795
Reaction score
13,532
The Suns are way better on defense with him on the court that is for sure
That's like saying..... "In a field full of tree stumps, Ayton is the tallest."

He is an abomination on defense. I think he is top 5 in the league in the opposing FG against category.. Make no mistake about it... He's really bad.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

I'm better than Mulli!
Joined
Sep 16, 2002
Posts
59,876
Reaction score
51,167
Location
SoCal
And just how often is he defending the smallest guy on the court? Did you quit watching games? I think there might be a shot or two like that where Ayton is "guarding" or switched off onto the opposing team's PG but even then, he should be sending that ball into their face but he's not even picking up easy blocks like that.
Exactly. One of our smalls (or even JJ or Bridges) takes it at any other teams big and they get swatted. Tiny pgs run layup drills on Ayton.
 

elindholm

edited for content
Joined
Sep 14, 2002
Posts
26,831
Reaction score
8,074
Location
L.A. area
His one-on-one defense is pretty good, but he doesn't anticipate well. The reason other teams score in the paint so easily is that Ayton is bad at recognizing when his defensive assignment is about to change. It's like one of those primitive video games in which the human operator gets to assign exactly one task to each virtual player before the play is run, and if you happen to guess wrong about how the play is going to unfold, the player is laughably out of position with no ability to contribute.
 

Raindog

I didn't come here to be liked!
Joined
Apr 22, 2008
Posts
4,721
Reaction score
5,310
You have to wonder how much of Ayton's shortcomings could be addressed by getting him some specialized coaching. Something of course the Suns will never do because, well, Sarver.
 

Mainstreet

Cruisin' Mainstreet
Supporting Member
Joined
Oct 19, 2003
Posts
112,537
Reaction score
51,770
You have to wonder how much of Ayton's shortcomings could be addressed by getting him some specialized coaching. Something of course the Suns will never do because, well, Sarver.

I think Ayton's defense will improve with experience and as he matures. However, a point guard would do wonders for his offense.
 

Chaplin

Better off silent
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
44,675
Reaction score
14,116
Location
Round Rock, TX
Ayton's not a good team defender, and unfortunately, EVERY single play requires him to play some form of team defense--so he breaks down and everyone labels him as this horrible defender. I think he's pretty good as a one-on-one defender, but every single team we play knows that as well, so they try to force him to play team defense because the one-to-one defense of his teammates is so poor.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

I'm better than Mulli!
Joined
Sep 16, 2002
Posts
59,876
Reaction score
51,167
Location
SoCal
Ayton's not a good team defender, and unfortunately, EVERY single play requires him to play some form of team defense--so he breaks down and everyone labels him as this horrible defender. I think he's pretty good as a one-on-one defender, but every single team we play knows that as well, so they try to force him to play team defense because the one-to-one defense of his teammates is so poor.
Yeah I don’t see it. Zubac had his way with Ayton last night one-on-one.
 

Chaplin

Better off silent
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
44,675
Reaction score
14,116
Location
Round Rock, TX
Yeah I don’t see it. Zubac had his way with Ayton last night one-on-one.
To support your claim, don't you think you should post how consistently bad his one-on-one defense has been? Krang is right--how many of Zubac's 4 makes were from a one-on-one with Ayton? He got fouled a lot, making 8 of those free throws. But again, how many were one-on-one and how many were from problems with Ayton coming from a bad position because of having to help on the perimiter or from his teammates doing the fouling to cover? We see this all the time. A guard can't handle the perimeter defense, Ayton comes to help, that guard dumps it into a now wide-open center for a dunk or a foul by another teammate trying to help?
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

I'm better than Mulli!
Joined
Sep 16, 2002
Posts
59,876
Reaction score
51,167
Location
SoCal
16 points is having his way? How many of those points were matched up one-on-one?
When zubac essentially equals ayton’s offensive output? Yeah. When zubac almost doubles his season average? Yeah. When zubac shoots 8 FTs to ayton’s 3? Yeah.

And I suffered through the whole game. Zubac either drew fouls on Ayton (something Ayton is seemingly incapable of), or scored on him off little hooks - one-on-one. I bring it up because (a) the clippers commentators were rightly making comments to the effect of “and that’s against the #1 pick!” and (b) because it was so blatantly obvious to me.

Look Ayton is a very skillful, if not powerful, aggressive, or assertive, offensive player. But he’s just a terrible defender in the post regardless of everyone wanting it to be otherwise.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

I'm better than Mulli!
Joined
Sep 16, 2002
Posts
59,876
Reaction score
51,167
Location
SoCal
To support your claim, don't you think you should post how consistently bad his one-on-one defense has been? Krang is right--how many of Zubac's 4 makes were from a one-on-one with Ayton? He got fouled a lot, making 8 of those free throws. But again, how many were one-on-one and how many were from problems with Ayton coming from a bad position because of having to help on the perimiter or from his teammates doing the fouling to cover? We see this all the time. A guard can't handle the perimeter defense, Ayton comes to help, that guard dumps it into a now wide-open center for a dunk or a foul by another teammate trying to help?
Did you watch the game? Because I did. You would have to be blind not to see zubac using Ayton. It wasn’t a matter of being compromised or out of position due to other players. He’s horrible. But go ahead and defend, defend, defend at least someone is trying to . . . and it isn’t Ayton.

This is a case where BOTH the stats and eye test and history all AGREE. They all point in the same direction. You don’t often find that confluence of factors. And when you do you have to take off your rose colored glasses and wake up. He sucks at defense.
 

Chaplin

Better off silent
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
44,675
Reaction score
14,116
Location
Round Rock, TX
Did you watch the game? Because I did. You would have to be blind not to see zubac using Ayton. It wasn’t a matter of being compromised or out of position due to other players. He’s horrible. But go ahead and defend, defend, defend at least someone is trying to . . . and it isn’t Ayton.

This is a case where BOTH the stats and eye test and history all AGREE. They all point in the same direction. You don’t often find that confluence of factors. And when you do you have to take off your rose colored glasses and wake up. He sucks at defense.
He made 4 shots. 4. You do have an advantage, having seen this particular game, but again, I'm not arguing against the fact that he had a bad defensive game, although you are accusing me as such. I'm just saying that one game does not prove much of anything. I would simply like to see more evidence of your claim, which may be correct, but from the games I HAVE seen (you're not the only one!), I don't see it as cut-and-dry as you do.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

I'm better than Mulli!
Joined
Sep 16, 2002
Posts
59,876
Reaction score
51,167
Location
SoCal
He made 4 shots. 4. You do have an advantage, having seen this particular game, but again, I'm not arguing against the fact that he had a bad defensive game, although you are accusing me as such. I'm just saying that one game does not prove much of anything. I would simply like to see more evidence of your claim, which may be correct, but from the games I HAVE seen (you're not the only one!), I don't see it as cut-and-dry as you do.
You are entitled to your opinion. And it’s not just the 4 makes. Fouling a shooter doesn’t constitute good defense either. Eight free throw for a dude averaging 8pts/game. And I’m pretty sure I’ve been banging this drum all season long. My eyes, the stats, and our defensive performances all season long don’t lie to me.
 

Latest posts

Members online

Forum statistics

Threads
534,761
Posts
5,246,043
Members
6,273
Latest member
sarahmoose
Top