Judging the Cardinals offseason....
- Thread starter Adrian
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Snakester
Draft Man
We lost more talent than we gained this off season but it's a win because of the quarterback room. If Rosen already had a year under his belt we would have a very strong ********* at QB. The biggest thing is we finally have our QBOTF. Just getting all the guys back that were injured last year is huge especially with David Johnson. I believe we will be a run oriented team with a quick passing game. That will take a lot of pressure off of the quarterbacks. Hopefully Bradford will stay healthy not having to pass every down.
RugbyMuffin
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Not saying you are wrong, but sometimes I wonder about what would be considered "talent".
They lost:
Tyrann Matheiu
Jared Veldheer
Tramon Williams
Kareem Martin
Xiaver Williams
----------------------------
Drew Stanton
Josh Mauro
Justin Bethel
Jaron Brown
Troy Niklas
Blaine Gabbert
Matt Barkley
Earl Watford
John Brown
Kerwynn Williams
CJ Goodwin
I guess you can argue the 1st five players in that list are losses without any real replacement, that is if, as a fan you are down on the Andre Smith signing, Jamar Taylor signing, and the Benson Mayowa signing.
There is not replacement for Mathieu and Xiaver Williams, IMO. And Williams would be arguable.
I feel the Cardinals did a good job of keeping status quo, and one would hope they are looking to build from there.
Stout
A handful of fairy tales from the story bag...
This is a highly contradictory post, Rugby. You end by saying they kept the status quo, after admitting they didn't replace 2 of the top 5 losses and, to a lesser extent, arguably downgraded on the others. That sure sounds to me like you think they lowered the talent level.
Krangodnzr
Captain of Team Conner
They lost:
Tyrann Matheiu-----------> Budda Baker
Jared Veldheer------------> Andre Smith
Tramon Williams----------> Jamar Taylor
Kareem Martin------------> Benson Mayowa
Xiaver Williams-----------> Replacements on roster
----------------------------
Drew Stanton-------------> Glennon
Josh Mauro----------------> Meh
Justin Bethel--------------> Meh
Jaron Brown--------------> Brice Butler/Kirk
Troy Niklas---------------> Meh
Blaine Gabbert----------> JOSH ROSEN
Matt Barkley------------> Who cares
Earl Watford-------------> JUSTIN PUGH
John Brown---------------> Brice Butler/replacements on roster
Kerwynn Williams--------> Chase Edmonds
CJ Goodwin---------------> Who cares, he's supposedly trash
I think the media is overrating the loss of Mathieu, who is clearly not a star anymore, or wasn't last year. Baker should be able to adequately replace his role this season. The Veldheer/Smith swap is either a wash or maybe Veldheer is a bit better.....but Veldheer was trash at RT last year so maybe Smith IS an upgrade since he has actually been a solid RT in the past.
I don't like the loss of Martin/Xavier much, but I think it will just be a case of a smaller DL rotation that will pick up the slack.
As for the bottom players, I don't see much dropoff. The Browns should be adequately replaced at least, if not upgraded by Kirk/Butler/Williams.
I think the Cardinals needle moved in the right direction overall since I think getting Rosen was so huge to this team over the course of the next 10 seasons....
Tyrann Matheiu-----------> Budda Baker
Jared Veldheer------------> Andre Smith
Tramon Williams----------> Jamar Taylor
Kareem Martin------------> Benson Mayowa
Xiaver Williams-----------> Replacements on roster
----------------------------
Drew Stanton-------------> Glennon
Josh Mauro----------------> Meh
Justin Bethel--------------> Meh
Jaron Brown--------------> Brice Butler/Kirk
Troy Niklas---------------> Meh
Blaine Gabbert----------> JOSH ROSEN
Matt Barkley------------> Who cares
Earl Watford-------------> JUSTIN PUGH
John Brown---------------> Brice Butler/replacements on roster
Kerwynn Williams--------> Chase Edmonds
CJ Goodwin---------------> Who cares, he's supposedly trash
I think the media is overrating the loss of Mathieu, who is clearly not a star anymore, or wasn't last year. Baker should be able to adequately replace his role this season. The Veldheer/Smith swap is either a wash or maybe Veldheer is a bit better.....but Veldheer was trash at RT last year so maybe Smith IS an upgrade since he has actually been a solid RT in the past.
I don't like the loss of Martin/Xavier much, but I think it will just be a case of a smaller DL rotation that will pick up the slack.
As for the bottom players, I don't see much dropoff. The Browns should be adequately replaced at least, if not upgraded by Kirk/Butler/Williams.
I think the Cardinals needle moved in the right direction overall since I think getting Rosen was so huge to this team over the course of the next 10 seasons....
Snakester
Draft Man
Key additions: Coach Steve Wilks, QB Sam Bradford, QB Josh Rosen, G Justin Pugh, WR Christian Kirk, T Andre Smith, CB Jamar Taylor, G/C Mason Cole, DE Benson Mayowa, QB Mike Glennon, CB Bené Benwikere, RB Chase Edmonds, WR Brice Butler.
Key departures: Coach Bruce Arians, QB Carson Palmer, S Tyrann Mathieu, WR John Brown, T Jared Veldheer, S Tyvon Branch, LB Kareem Martin, CB Tramon Williams, DL Josh Mauro, RB Adrian Peterson, LB Karlos Dansby, WR Jaron Brown, DL Xavier Williams, RB Kerwynn Williams.
The o-line got better at guard but worse at tackle. Veldheer was a solid left tackle. I don't believe Andre Smith is a very good pass protector at tackle.
At WR I think it will be a wash.
At CB a wash as well.
At RB we got worse unless Chase Edmonds really shows something. AP and Kerwynn Williams were solid backups for Johnson.
At safety we are worse or at the very least thinner. Its true Mathieu wasn't as good last year and Branch was good but got hurt. Still both were good and experienced.
At DL I think we are worse. Where Mauro was not as good as the year before Kareem Martin was pretty solid. Xavier Williams was finally filling in and doing a decent job. The only guy we brought in was Mayowa to replace them.
I think we got worse at linebacker and tightend as well. Not so much as they were great losses ( Dansby, Nicklas) but we really haven't added replacements that are just as good.
At QB a wash for starters but a huge plus getting Rosen.
don7031
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Cardinals leading tacklers: 1st Dansby, 2nd Mathieu.
Snap counts: 1st Mathieu (99.43 %)
Because he wasn't as dynamic a player as he had been previously, people are underestimating Mathieu's value to the team and are neglecting his potential to return to that dynamic player now that he is a year removed from returning from injury.
Snap counts: 1st Mathieu (99.43 %)
Because he wasn't as dynamic a player as he had been previously, people are underestimating Mathieu's value to the team and are neglecting his potential to return to that dynamic player now that he is a year removed from returning from injury.
kerouac9
Klowned by Keim
Again, you can’t say that Baker is a replacement for Mathieu because one of them was playing slot corner while the other was playing strong safety.
We have Brandon Williams as our #3 corner right now or no one at strong safety. Mathieu wasn’t replaced.
We have Brandon Williams as our #3 corner right now or no one at strong safety. Mathieu wasn’t replaced.
OP
OP
Sports Illustrated: Cardinals receive ‘C’ grade for offseason moves
http://arizonasports.com/story/1574462/sports-illustrated-grading-the-cardinals-offseason/
http://arizonasports.com/story/1574462/sports-illustrated-grading-the-cardinals-offseason/
Stout
A handful of fairy tales from the story bag...
That's fair.
notdeadyet
Newbie
Hard to judge the "D" so early; switching from a 3-4 front to a 4-3 is a very big change.
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as far as moves made for this season, I'd give them a C, but an A for the future simply because i believe in getting a QBOTF with Rosen.
the NFL is won in the Postseason, not in the Offseason or Preseason ... and not in the "talk"
Our team got better by the pure fact that the O and the D aren't as predictable as they were before and the ST starts to show up. And don't get me wrong, I liked the first years of BA but at the end he was stuck in his believes and in his Friends sorry showings.
Our team got better by the pure fact that the O and the D aren't as predictable as they were before and the ST starts to show up. And don't get me wrong, I liked the first years of BA but at the end he was stuck in his believes and in his Friends sorry showings.
kerouac9
Klowned by Keim
How do you know they won’t be predictable? Nothing’s more predictable than what you’re gonna do when a fullback is on the field.
Buckybird
Hoist the Lombardi Trophy
We’ve improved from last year that we’re good enough to win 11 games this year, peeps here have said it lol
I can't see how anyone would only give us a C. We went from zero QB's to probably one of the top ten QB rooms in the NFL IMO.
Buckybird
Hoist the Lombardi Trophy
Totally unproven & constantly injury prone that’s why.
kerouac9
Klowned by Keim
LOL. Let’s trot this bad take out again. Nice troll.
AZCrazy
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He's not wrong. Going from ZERO quarterbacks on the roster to having Bradford, Glennon, and Rosen is a total coup.
We'll be helped most of all by getting our own injured guys back. David Johnson was arguably the top skill position player coming into last season and didn't make it to
the second half of the first game. Markus Golden was a huge loss as well. I'm surprised Chandler Jones was as effective as he was last year with his counterpart out.
With them both back, it'll be trouble for opposing linemen. Moving to a 4-3 as well helps limit and better define the roles for our young linebacker group. Bucannon and Reddick
can use their athleticism more, with more down linemen holding the trenches. Budda Baker and Patrick Peterson will make a nice core for the secondary. I'd have loved to keep Mathieu, but both knees are blown and a small guy is gonna need his speed to impact the game.
We'll be helped most of all by getting our own injured guys back. David Johnson was arguably the top skill position player coming into last season and didn't make it to
the second half of the first game. Markus Golden was a huge loss as well. I'm surprised Chandler Jones was as effective as he was last year with his counterpart out.
With them both back, it'll be trouble for opposing linemen. Moving to a 4-3 as well helps limit and better define the roles for our young linebacker group. Bucannon and Reddick
can use their athleticism more, with more down linemen holding the trenches. Budda Baker and Patrick Peterson will make a nice core for the secondary. I'd have loved to keep Mathieu, but both knees are blown and a small guy is gonna need his speed to impact the game.
We had three QBs at the beginning of the offseason and we find ourselves with three now. I would argue the QB position being improved but not based on a zero base...
BigRedRage
Reckless
FB can block while DJ runs a WR route from the backfield
kerouac9
Klowned by Keim
Yes, this is technically true. But teams with 2+ backs in the formation ran 63% of the time. DJ could also run a WR route from a jumbo package; neither are likely to happen with meaningful frequency.
Stout
A handful of fairy tales from the story bag...
We got our QBOF, but have a hot garbage backup and an always broken never-has-been starting. Bottom 10 QB room at best! IMO
Jetstream Green
Kool Aid with a touch of vodka
Well, having a fullback has nothing to do with predictability but simple smash mouth football. You know it's coming and if you use the fullback, you surmise you have the physical advantage. Any 'trickery' or rather options would then be about your TEs employed in the formation or how adapt one's slot Wrs are... meaning we will have to see if the Cards have the horses once the actual games start
