Free Agency 2018

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Some value, but enough to be the jewel of a trade for a good, if not great, player? No. He's a good throw-in, not a centerpiece. And that's a problem, because outside of him, we don't have any "centerpieces" we'd want to trade.

The problem here is your interpretation of my opinion as him not being as valuable as you think to him not being valuable at all, and that's simply not true. He has some value, just not as much as you and a lot of others think.

And we ALL know that fans tend to overvalue their players, so is it really a surprise?

I’m not one to overvalue. In fact I cringe at some people’s valuation of our players regularly.

And you said “very little value.” That kinda connotes that you don’t think you’d get squat for him.

 

[Chaplin]

I’m not one to overvalue. In fact I cringe at some people’s valuation of our players regularly.

And you said “very little value.” That kinda connotes that you don’t think you’d get squat for him.

I don't think we can get squat for him. We'd have to sweeten the pot, and I'm afraid we'd have to substantially sweeten it. Nobody is going to give us something that is more valuable than what he already is to us.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I don't think we can get squat for him. We'd have to sweeten the pot, and I'm afraid we'd have to substantially sweeten it. Nobody is going to give us something that is more valuable than what he already is to us.

You think we would have PAY to get someone to take him???

 

[Hoop Head]

I don't think people are overrating or overvaluing Warren here though. He is probably worth a mid 1st round pick or a decent rotation player of some variety. I'm not sure who, it depends on what team we're talking about, but since his contract is reasonable I don't think we need to attach any sort of sweeteners to move him if we sought to dump his salary. In fact if the Suns made it known they just wanted to clear cap space, I'd think there would be a number of teams interested in taking him on and we'd probably get offered a future 1st by the highest bidder. Will we get a top 10 pick? I don't think so. But in the draft next year we might be able to deal him for the 8th, 9th, or 10th pick if the draft is similar in it's depth to the 2017 draft. This last year was really deep so no one was moving a lottery pick for him. We might have been able to get 13 or 14 for him, but I don't think that's a certainty.

It's tough to set a value in the NBA because teams are always looking for something different, salary relief, tradable assets in the form of draft picks, expiring contracts, or just a deal between 2 players who need a change of scenery and fill different hole and play different roles. Trading Warren to a team like Boston for Smart in a sign & trade should be enough, I wouldn't make that trade though because I don't think Smart is an upgrade for us. He's not a starting PG but he can give you minutes at PG as a backup. Perhaps trading him somewhere else like the Nets for Dinwiddie would be a good trade. I think he's worth a rotation PG, which we're in need of, but he won't bring back and All-Star like Kemba. The most value I think we could get is with a team like Miami who may be interested in moving Dragic so they get something for him without letting him walk and some immediate salary relief towards the cap annually. In terms of his age, Warren fits better there than Dragic also, giving them a young wing while they look for another trade to make. He could be flipped with other young players they have. I could also see him being a fair asset to trade for Patrick Beverly on the Clippers, maybe even Dallas would do a deal for Harrison Barnes to save money. I'd rather pay Warren $11 million than Barnes the $24 million he makes. Warren has value, just not enough to be the centerpiece for a high quality player.

 

[Chaplin]

You think we would have PAY to get someone to take him???

Yeah because that is exactly what I said. Come on.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Yeah because that is exactly what I said. Come on.

kinda reads that way Chap. Looks like you're saying we'd have to add picks or something to "sweeten the pot" to get someone to take him off our hands.

 

[sunsfan88]

kinda reads that way Chap. Looks like you're saying we'd have to add picks or something to "sweeten the pot" to get someone to take him off our hands.

No I think he's saying that to trade for a star (or something more valuable than Warren), we would have to sweeten the spot.

And he's not off, Warren isn't netting a star player. He's a one trick pony and neither of his tricks are the two most important things in today's NBA, 3pt shooting/defense.

 

[Phrazbit]

I think Warren's value is in the eye of the beholder. He's basically a poor man's Carmelo Anthony, minus the attitude problems. If you're among the teams who are deliberately removing mid range scoring from their offense then I doubt they'd have interest in Warren at any price.

 

[Mainstreet]

Warren is a solid bench player. I will take 20 points and 5 rebounds any day of the week.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

No I think he's saying that to trade for a star (or something more valuable than Warren), we would have to sweeten the spot.

And he's not off, Warren isn't netting a star player. He's a one trick pony and neither of his tricks are the two most important things in today's NBA, 3pt shooting/defense.

Who said we could trade Warren for a star?!? We’ve all said he could be a part of a trade for a good player. Or that he could get us a mid first.

How do these conversations get turned so upside down? Chap said Warren had “very little value” a bunch of us said no, he likely ha reasonable value and now people are inferring someone said we could get a star for Warren straight up. I mean, wtf people.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Yeah because that is exactly what I said. Come on.

Uh read what you posted.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

No I think he's saying that to trade for a star (or something more valuable than Warren), we would have to sweeten the spot.

And he's not off, Warren isn't netting a star player. He's a one trick pony and neither of his tricks are the two most important things in today's NBA, 3pt shooting/defense.

Btw, shot creation is still more important than 3 pt shooting alone.

 

[Chaplin]

Uh read what you posted.

I posted we’d have to sweeten the deal to make a trade worthwhile for us. I not once said we’d have to pay some other team to take Warren off our hands. Intent matters.

 

[Hoop Head]

I posted we’d have to sweeten the deal to make a trade worthwhile for us. I not once said we’d have to pay some other team to take Warren off our hands. Intent matters.

How would us sweetening the deal be worthwhile for us? That seems quite contradictory.

I don't see what your intent was. What could Warren bring back in a trade, in your opinion?

 

[Chaplin]

How would us sweetening the deal be worthwhile for us? That seems quite contradictory.

I don't see what your intent was. What could Warren bring back in a trade, in your opinion?

Depends on the return. Is it really that difficult to understand?

We’re all on the same side, so I will end off here.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I don't think we can get squat for him. We'd have to sweeten the pot, and I'm afraid we'd have to substantially sweeten it. Nobody is going to give us something that is more valuable than what he already is to us.

Dude, when you say “I don’t think we can get squat for him”. And then follow it up with “we’d have to sweeten the pot, and I’m afraid we’d have to substantially sweeten it.” And never do you mention a package deal or reference someone else talking about a package deal, I think my assumption (and surprise) was warranted.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Depends on the return. Is it really that difficult to understand?

We’re all on the same side, so I will end off here.

Back to the substance . . . you bring up a good point, it depends. So instead of talking concepts, which we can all, and frequently do, misinterpret with one and other, let’s throw out potential scenarios. I think that’s the most direct way to best determine how we each value a player.

Let’s say that we wanted to deal Warren for say a Jeff Teague. 30 year old, one-time all-star (3 years ago), averaged 14 and 7 last year, with 2 years of contract left at $19M per year. What do you think we would have to throw in to make the deal happen? I mean, what do you think is a fair exchange of assets built around those two players.

Minnesota’s lack of desire to trade their point guard aside (let’s assume they were ready to go with Tyus Jones like we’ve got two first round SFs), what would we have to give up alongside Warren to make it fair? I think it would be a first round pick that is top 20 protected, them top 15 protected, them top 10 protected, then unprotected.

 

[Chaplin]

Wouldn’t you want to at least talk about situations that might actually happen? Jeff Teague isn’t even on our radar. (At least I hope he isn’t)

Someone like Dinwiddie or Frazier maybe. Warren would have to be involved, but I don’t think either one of those guys could be had by an offer of just Warren.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

Wouldn’t you want to at least talk about situations that might actually happen? Jeff Teague isn’t even on our radar. (At least I hope he isn’t)

Someone like Dinwiddie or Frazier maybe. Warren would have to be involved, but I don’t think either one of those guys could be had by an offer of just Warren.

Frazier? Tim Frazier? Walt Frazier?

Terry Rozier?

I think you could probably get Dinwiddie for Warren. To get Rozier, my guess is you'd probably have to add the Bucks pick and a little bit more, and only then if the Celtics decide to match Smart first.

 

[GatorAZ]

I think Warren could be in a S&T for a FA PG. Btw Gambo has been adamant about Knight “seeing the light”. It’s certainly on purpose that he’s been riding that bandwagon for a few months. Either trade or preparing fans that he’s the PG. I’ll go with trade fluff.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

I think Warren could be in a S&T for a FA PG. Btw Gambo has been adamant about Knight “seeing the light”. It’s certainly on purpose that he’s been riding that bandwagon for a few months. Either trade or preparing fans that he’s the PG. I’ll go with trade fluff.

If the Suns are able to trade Knight without giving up a significant asset, then McDonough deserves an extension.

Imagine having Ulis or Harrison on the roster for $1.5 million instead of Knight for $15 million.

 

[Mainstreet]

I can't get excited by any of these players. I'd rather keep Warren and have a solid bench.

Tim Frazier is a free agent but he hasn't done much at all.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

I can't get excited by any of these players. I'd rather keep Warren and have a solid bench.

Tim Frazier is a free agent but he hasn't done much at all.

I'm pretty sure he meant Rozier. Even the biggest Warren detractor wouldn't consider him not enough to trade for Tim Frazier.

 

[Mainstreet]

I'm pretty sure he meant Rozier. Even the biggest Warren detractor wouldn't consider him not enough to trade for Tim Frazier.

Especially when the Suns wouldn't have to trade for him. LOL

 

[Folster]

Would you guys rather have Aaron Gordon for $20-25 million a year or Marquese Chriss for $3.2 million a year?

Take a look at a comparison of the two post all-star game adjusted per 36 minutes.

https://stats.nba.com/vs/#!/?Player...son&SeasonSegment=Post All-Star&PerMode=Per36