If YOU were the 32 GMs Your Decisions?

[Mitch]

Joe Flacco and Eli Manning are the last two QB's to win before Russell Wildon right? Those two aren't really athletic.

Right. No question.

Interestingly, in both Eli's and Flacco's cases, it was plays they made with their legs to keep plays alive that led to the wins.

 

[Mulli]

Right. No question.

Interestingly, in both Eli's and Flacco's cases, it was plays they made with their legs to keep plays alive that led to the wins.

Agreed. I thought of that when typing. So I see your point re Palmer as I am not sure he has that type of playmaking capability at this point.

 

[cardpa]

You may be right, PA.

However---

1. Peter King conformed today that the Texans have Khalil Mack rated higher than Clowney.

I think Clowney is his own worse enemy. I can see him falling out of the top 5 picks.

2. Bill O'Brien doesn't make the call, the GM does.
If you think O'Brian has no input whatsoever then you are fooling yourself.

3. We are talking the state of Texas and Johnny Football. The energy and electricity that picking him would bring to the organization would be off the charts.
If I'm a Texan fan I hope the fornt office and HC are looking at building the team long term and not just looking to sell tickets.

4. When the Colts, the Texans' division rival, found themselves at #1, they took Andrew Luck. Sure, Luck seemed like a no-brainer. But, how are the Texans going to compete with Luck? They need their own answer. Is that answer Blake Bortles? I don't think so---and I believe neither do the Texans.
Bortles is a more complete QB than JF.

5. How many Super Bowls have Peyton Manning and Tom Brady won in the last five years? None.
I don't see how this has anything to do with the subject matter.

6. Last ten years? One.
See #5 above.

7. The game is ever-evolving and right now mobile QBs who can evade pressure and extend plays are in vogue---and rightly so---because of the added pressure that is put on the defense to have to contain and deal with a running threat at QB. Ask any DC---heck, i remember years ago, John Fox, the with Carolina, saying that he was hoping the Cardinals couldn't start Josh McCown versus them because having to defend a running threat at QB changes the entire game plan defensively.

8. Hey, if BA can adapt and change his thinking---so can Bill O'Brien.
The two years O'Brian was at PSU he started McGloin because he was his one and only option. He had another kid Paul Jones (6'4", 265 lbs.)who was a mobile QB but not much of a passer who was a 5 star recruit and O'Brian pretty much tossed him aside so the kid left PSU because he did not fit his offense. Once O-Brian had the chance to sign a tall, strong arm pocket QB he did in Hackenberg and even the backup was similar. Remember O'Brian was the OC in New England. He ran a similar offense at PSU. I don't see him changing that just so the team would have a QB with mobility. Johnny Football is not a O'Brian type QB and I would be very surprised to see the Texans take JF.

9. Look at last year's Super Bowl---the HOF stationary QB got pounded---and the young, mobile QB was superb.

Again don't see what this has to do with this subject matter. I think the defensive game plan Seattle came up with had more to do with the game than anything else.

 

[BW52]

Sometimes, it's just a certain sense a GM and HC have about the player---like the Seahawks had with Russell Wilson. Then it requires faith and commitment.

Like you, I find the interest in McCarron curious. Sometimes I think the whole deep ball aspect is way over-blown, especially seeing as teams generally throw deep 3-4 times a game at a less than 40% rate.

The game has become a quick passing frenzy designed to exploit mismatches. If you have a QB who get made quick reads and get the ball out on time, you've got a good chance to move the sticks. See Kurt Warner---while he wasn't mobile, he was a quick decision maker and did all he could to buy every last second of time when needed.

In the Pats' case, they believe the shortest distance between two points in a straight line, which is why they focus so much of their passing game in exploiting the middle of the field in three waves: slot WR, TE, then RB.

What I think BASK may question is Carson Palmer's ability to make quick reads and to pass decisively. He did improve the second half of the season, but that also came with BA toning down the deep passes and now including the RBs much more in the passing schemes. Interestingly, Carson seems to struggle with shorter passes---which is why the offense didn't convert third downs as often as they could have.

One of the reasons why I think Derek Carr is high on the Cardinals' board is that he has the big arm and yet the quick passing talent to go with it. I think the quick decision making is also what they like in McCarron. And I imagine they like the same ability in Jimmy Garoppolo, David Fales and Tahj Boyd.

Watching Zach Mettenberger the other day, his short to intermediate passing game was much improved under Cam Cameron. But for him this is still a work in progress.

Bridgewater has the quick release quick read skills and is a very efficient game manager with very few turnovers so what`s the difference?Carr has a big arm but played very poorly in some big games..is that good decision making or circumstances? Bridgewater has played very good in his teams biggest games yet he has a average pro day (throwing gloveless) and now he`s sliding to the 2nd rd if you listen to sopme pundits.Bridgewater is a better version of McCarron IMHO .

 

[kerouac9]

Anyone who thinks that GMs (or, good GMs, if we want to exclude particular organizations) make any decisions based on what's going to excite the fan base or whatever are off their rockers.

GMs who intend to be in their jobs for more than this year should and do understand that winning games is what gets butts in the seats, sells jerseys, etc.

It's hilarious to me that Mitch is in one thread pounding on Kiko Alonzo and Javedon Clowney for being bad character guys while here promoting Johnny Manziel of all people as the potential #1 pick.

Same with Krang. Pounding on Lewan for being a character concern in a four-year-old sexual assault case and ignoring the being-too-drunk-to-coach-kids incident ten months ago? Hmm...

 

[Denny Green Fan]

Sometimes, it's just a certain sense a GM and HC have about the player---like the Seahawks had with Russell Wilson. Then it requires faith and commitment.

Like you, I find the interest in McCarron curious. Sometimes I think the whole deep ball aspect is way over-blown, especially seeing as teams generally throw deep 3-4 times a game at a less than 40% rate.

The game has become a quick passing frenzy designed to exploit mismatches. If you have a QB who get made quick reads and get the ball out on time, you've got a good chance to move the sticks. See Kurt Warner---while he wasn't mobile, he was a quick decision maker and did all he could to buy every last second of time when needed.

In the Pats' case, they believe the shortest distance between two points in a straight line, which is why they focus so much of their passing game in exploiting the middle of the field in three waves: slot WR, TE, then RB.

What I think BASK may question is Carson Palmer's ability to make quick reads and to pass decisively. He did improve the second half of the season, but that also came with BA toning down the deep passes and now including the RBs much more in the passing schemes. Interestingly, Carson seems to struggle with shorter passes---which is why the offense didn't convert third downs as often as they could have.

One of the reasons why I think Derek Carr is high on the Cardinals' board is that he has the big arm and yet the quick passing talent to go with it. I think the quick decision making is also what they like in McCarron. And I imagine they like the same ability in Jimmy Garoppolo, David Fales and Tahj Boyd.

Watching Zach Mettenberger the other day, his short to intermediate passing game was much improved under Cam Cameron. But for him this is still a work in progress.

I think Carr is going to be a very good pro. Like you said he has the big

arm and the ability to see things quickly. He is also a very mature young

man. He has a kid and a hot wife. He also has inside knowledge of

what to expect from his brother. The knock on Carr is he panicks with

pressure and his feet are not always set right but he is mobile and reminds

some people of Mathew Stafford. I think Arians would be great for him but

I still would rather go defense and get a player to help us now.

 

[WildBB]

I would take Manziel, WildBB. BA could start Palmer but have packages for Manziel. That's the thing---BA believes 1st round QBs should play---and he means it.

Peter King wrote two things of interest in his MMQB blog:

1. He reports that the Cardinals are very high on Derek Carr and A.J. McCarron.

2. He believes the Cardinals will take a QB in Round 1 or 2.


The thing is---I don't see McCarron sliding to #52. If the Texans don't take a QB at #1, I could see them taking McCarron (a Tom Brady cerebral type) at #33. I could see Jason Licht taking McCarron at #38 or Jacksonville (if they don't take at QB at #3) at #39.

3. I wonder if the Cardinals are throwing out a smoke screen on Carr and McCarron---because I think what they really want is someone to trade up to #20, so they can add extra picks.

Also, could it be that by showing interest in Carr and McCarron they may be taking atttention away from the guy they really want at #52: Zach Mettenberger?

I think the Cardinals will take a QB in this draft---my guess is---if they are able to add another 1 or two picks, it will be Mettenberger in the 2nd round (if he makes it to #52)---or they may pounce on one in the 3rd or 4th round.

I think it's likely that the Cards take a QB in this draft and do it earlier than I and many expected.

Most here thought of QB as an after thought, and it still could be depending on how it all comes down.

I think that if Carr makes it to pick 20, he may indeed be deemed BPA for the franchise long term. It wouldn't help them much this year, so the FO will have to have that pick work out right. Keim's stamp of approval will be all over that pick. So it's a risky pick for them. But the obvious importance of the position it adderesses has huge ramifications down the line in an increasingly stellar division.

The other scenario- if Carr does'nt make it to 20, then definately if they are adament in wanting to upgrade the position for the future welfare of the franchise, then a trade down in the 1st makes some good sense in a very deep draft.

Get the QB in place beyond this season and then work on filling up your holes at SS, CB, DL, OLB, RT, TE, and maybe even a WR because of the depth of the position overall this year.

I do think there is going to be a lot of dissapointment in the draft this year of because who they pass over in order to procure their QBOF.

If Palmer can't lead them to some early big W's , we may indeed see the future sooner than we realise this next season. Palmer needs to produce results early on this year, being in the system for a year now, and having been given extra weapons and protection.

 

[BW52]

I think it's likely that the Cards take a QB in this draft and do it earlier than I and many expected.

Most here thought of QB as an after thought, and it still could be depending on how it all comes down.

I think that if Carr makes it to pick 20, he may indeed be deemed BPA for the franchise long term. It wouldn't help them much this year, so the FO will have to have that pick work out right. Keim's stamp of approval will be all over that pick. So it's a risky pick for them. But the obvious importance of the position it adderesses has huge ramifications down the line in an increasingly stellar division.

The other scenario- if Carr does'nt make it to 20, then definately if they are adament in wanting to upgrade the position for the future welfare of the franchise, then a trade down in the 1st makes some good sense in a very deep draft.

Get the QB in place beyond this season and then work on filling up your holes at SS, CB, DL, OLB, RT, TE, and maybe even a WR because of the depth of the position overall this year.

I do think there is going to be a lot of dissapointment in the draft this year of because who they pass over in order to procure their QBOF.

If Palmer can't lead them to some early big W's , we may indeed see the future sooner than we realise this next season. Palmer needs to produce results early on this year, being in the system for a year now, and having been given extra weapons and protection.

Good line of thinking WildBB.If Cards go QB in RD 1 or 2 you still have more holes to fill than you have draft picks.Although some are holes are not urgent needs (DLine depth and grooming DD replacement,CB groom for next season,TE )Whichever way Cards go in this draft they really need to come out of the draft with;
1.Pass rusher -I would not mind seeing a early pick Pass rusher and a mid rounder if available
2.Safety upgrade


There are several 3/4 DE type available mid draft or later
TE-if Cards can get Niklas or Feiderowicz that would work
FS-SS many solid players available
CB-decent CB`s available thru several rounds.
Many options at many positions.I doubt O_LINE or RB get addressed in the draft.

 

[Chopper0080]

Here is mine so others can hammer it...

1. HOU - Jadeveon Clowney - DE/OLB - South Carolina
2. STL - Greg Robinson - OT - Auburn
3. JAX - Khalil Mack - OLB - Buffalo
4. CLE - Sammy Watkins Jr. - WR - Clemson
5. OAK - Jake Matthews - OT - Texas A&M
6. ATL - Eric Ebron - TE - North Carolina
7. TB - Mike Evans - WR - Texas A&M
8. MN - Blake Bortles - QB - Central Florida
9. BUF - Justin Gilbert - CB - Oklahoma St.
10. DET - Kyle Fuller - CB - Virginia Tech
11. TN - Anthony Barr - OLB - UCLA
12. NYG - Aaron Donald - DT - Pittsburgh
13. STL - Derek Carr - QB - Fresno St.
14. CHI - Calvin Pryor - S - Louisville
15. PIT - Taylor Lewan - OT - Michigan
16. DAL - Timmy Jernigan - DT - Florida St.
17. BLT - Zach Martin - OT - Notre Dame
18. JET - Brandin Cooks - WR - Oregon St.
19. MIA - Odell Beckham Jr. - WR - LSU
20. AZ - Dee Ford - OLB - Auburn
21. GB - CJ Mosley - LB - Alabama
22. PHL - Ryan Shazier - LB - Ohio St.
23. KC - Hasean Clinton-Dix - S - Alabama
24. CIN - Jason Verrett - CB - TCU
25. SD - Xavier Su'a-Filo - OG - UCLA
26. CLEV - Johnny Manziel - QB - Texas A&M
27. NO - Louis Nix III - DT - Notre Dame
28. CAR - Allen Robinson - WR - Penn St.
29. NE - Jace Amaro - TE - Texas Tech
30. SF - Bradley Roby - CB - Ohio St.
31. DEN - Scott Crichton - DE - Oregon St.
32. SEA - Kony Ealy - DE - Missouri

There it is.

Some notables left off, Teddy Bridgewater, Marquise Lee, Cyrus Kouandjio, Weston Richburg, Darqueze Dennard, Jimmie Ward, Ra'Shede Hageman, Morgan Moses.

If you want explanations, let me know.

 

[BW52]

Here is mine so others can hammer it...

1. HOU - Jadeveon Clowney - DE/OLB - South Carolina
2. STL - Greg Robinson - OT - Auburn
3. JAX - Khalil Mack - OLB - Buffalo
4. CLE - Sammy Watkins Jr. - WR - Clemson
5. OAK - Jake Matthews - OT - Texas A&M
6. ATL - Eric Ebron - TE - North Carolina
7. TB - Mike Evans - WR - Texas A&M
8. MN - Blake Bortles - QB - Central Florida
9. BUF - Justin Gilbert - CB - Oklahoma St.
10. DET - Kyle Fuller - CB - Virginia Tech
11. TN - Anthony Barr - OLB - UCLA
12. NYG - Aaron Donald - DT - Pittsburgh
13. STL - Derek Carr - QB - Fresno St.
14. CHI - Calvin Pryor - S - Louisville
15. PIT - Taylor Lewan - OT - Michigan
16. DAL - Timmy Jernigan - DT - Florida St.
17. BLT - Zach Martin - OT - Notre Dame
18. JET - Brandin Cooks - WR - Oregon St.
19. MIA - Odell Beckham Jr. - WR - LSU
20. AZ - Dee Ford - OLB - Auburn
21. GB - CJ Mosley - LB - Alabama
22. PHL - Ryan Shazier - LB - Ohio St.
23. KC - Hasean Clinton-Dix - S - Alabama
24. CIN - Jason Verrett - CB - TCU
25. SD - Xavier Su'a-Filo - OG - UCLA
26. CLEV - Johnny Manziel - QB - Texas A&M
27. NO - Louis Nix III - DT - Notre Dame
28. CAR - Allen Robinson - WR - Penn St.
29. NE - Jace Amaro - TE - Texas Tech
30. SF - Bradley Roby - CB - Ohio St.
31. DEN - Scott Crichton - DE - Oregon St.
32. SEA - Kony Ealy - DE - Missouri

There it is.

Some notables left off, Teddy Bridgewater, Marquise Lee, Cyrus Kouandjio, Weston Richburg, Darqueze Dennard, Jimmie Ward, Ra'Shede Hageman, Morgan Moses.

If you want explanations, let me know.

Cleveland taking Watkins with #4?
Detroit 10 Kyle Fuller CB is he RD 1 quality?
AZ 20. Dee Ford LB-like his speed but can he hold the edge and he has yet to last a complete college season without missing games?

 

[WildBB]

10. DET - Kyle Fuller - CB - Virginia Tech

Very good mock. But top 10 for Fuller. He's good. Is he as good as Gilmore was last yr? As fast?

Disagree on Dennard falling completely out as well. He'll be better than Gilbert, imo. Who ever takes Gilbert high is taking a big risk. Even though he's real fast, the Big 12 isn't the SEC. He's got a long way to go to succeed and justify a high pick. Dennard is tough a good tackling CB and the best press CB of the group.

 

[Chopper0080]

Cleveland taking Watkins with #4?
Detroit 10 Kyle Fuller CB is he RD 1 quality?
AZ 20. Dee Ford LB-like his speed but can he hold the edge and he has yet to last a complete college season without missing games?

Why wouldn't Cleveland take the best offensive weapon in the draft to compliment their other start WR in Josh Gordon who is 1 hot drug test from a year suspension. Best player...need pick...fits scheme.

Kyle Fuller is pretty damn good. The difference between him and Gilbert is speed and that is it. Both have good size and both can play man and zone.

Re: Dee Ford...are we drafting a pass rusher or are we drafting an OLB? I am drafting a pass rusher and I could give a crap if he struggles vs an offensive tackle who is trying to block him. Quick players run around bigger guys, I'm sure Ford will do that.

 

[Chopper0080]

Very good mock. But top 10 for Fuller. He's good. Is he as good as Gilmore was last yr? As fast?

Disagree on Dennard falling completely out as well. He'll be better than Gilbert, imo. Who ever takes Gilbert high is taking a big risk. Even though he's real fast, the Big 12 isn't the SEC. He's got a long way to go to succeed and justify a high pick. Dennard is tough a good tackling CB and the best press CB of the group.

Dennard played CB is college with his hands and it will make the transition to the pros much more difficult because the PI rules are tougher in the pros. He will struggle and will have to figure out a way to adjust without having great speed. It's like being a great basketball defender when you can hand check and then having that taken away from you. Very tough to adjust.

Look at Dennard this way...average speed...average size...and the NFL will take away his best trait which is contact down the field. Not saying he can't transition, but it will take time and bbe difficult.

 

[Krangodnzr]

WTF? Wilson has a better arm than Manziel. Wilson is thicker and better built than Manziel. Wilson runs and avoids hits while Manziel runs and takes hits, not sure how that makes Manziel a better runner.

More to the point, Wilson is a better decision maker than Manziel and more mature.

So, you think the player who is less mature, takes more risks, and takes more hits is going to be better than the player who is more mature, takes less risks and takes less hits? How does that even make sense? In a league that is focused on limiting turnovers, staying healthy and keeping away from negative press, you want the guy who does none of those things?

This is similar non-sense to those who were preaching that RGIII had a higher ceiling than Luck, and those that bought into Tebow the "winner". Manziel is going to have his moments but they will not last. He is small and he takes hits. He struggles in structured offenses and takes huge gambles in the passing game. He is a less athletic Michael Vick. I seriously wonder if he will ever have less than 15 turnovers in a season unless it is because he can never stay healthy for a full one.

I disagree that Wilson has a better arm; Wilson hangs long passes like wounded ducks. He doesn't get picked off often because he makes those throws when they are good decisions. Wilson does not have a great arm, and I think Manziel's is at least as good, probably better.

Wilson is risk adverse, almost TOO risk adverse. Their loss at home against us was on Wilson's chest. We dared Wilson to throw the ball over the deep middle and time and again he didn't take the chance. Without his defense and special teams, Wilson is a very good game manager, who can make plays with his feet.

Manziel is a much better passer than Vick was in college. I watched both play, and it's not even close. Vick was more akin to an option passer than the 3,000+ yards that Manziel threw for. Plus being a less athletic Michael Vick isn't an insult since Michael Vick is the most athletic QB ever.

I'm not going to disagree that Manziel will possibly be a turnover machine or injury prone, but taking Manziel is a gamble on greatness. If he doesn't work out, and least you swung for the fences.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Same with Krang. Pounding on Lewan for being a character concern in a four-year-old sexual assault case and ignoring the being-too-drunk-to-coach-kids incident ten months ago? Hmm...

You do know that Lewan is facing a criminal assault charge that happened this past season, right? He followed a group of Ohio State fans and supposedly attacked them. Lewan is known to be a punk. Manziel is a cocky, immature kid, but he hasn't done anything criminal.

I guess you don't see the difference between a maturity issue and a potential sex offender and hothead. Hmm....

 

[Krangodnzr]

Look at Dennard this way...average speed...average size...and the NFL will take away his best trait which is contact down the field. Not saying he can't transition, but it will take time and bbe difficult.

Have you watched the Seattle Seahawks play? They get away with this all the time. It's kind of like the theory of the New York Knicks back in the 90's: You won't call a foul on every play.

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702303754404579310500005285822

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...-have-perfected-the-art-of-pass-interference/

 

[BW52]

You do know that Lewan is facing a criminal assault charge that happened this past season, right? He followed a group of Ohio State fans and supposedly attacked them. Lewan is known to be a punk. Manziel is a cocky, immature kid, but he hasn't done anything criminal.

I guess you don't see the difference between a maturity issue and a potential sex offender and hothead. Hmm....

The alleged incident was 5 years ago and I question the timimg of this being made public.The article said it was alleged Lewan threatened to rape the girl if she told police about the assault by another player.Stupid stupid beyond dumb if this happened.Can`t excuse his judgement IF he is found guilty.At 1st glance seems like a money grab because of the amount of time between the alleged incident and public knowledge.

 

[Chopper0080]

Have you watched the Seattle Seahawks play? They get away with this all the time. It's kind of like the theory of the New York Knicks back in the 90's: You won't call a foul on every play.

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702303754404579310500005285822

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...-have-perfected-the-art-of-pass-interference/

That is because they have worked at it for years and they have a head coach who is a secondary guy and is bought in. Carroll essentially believes that refs will only call so many PI calls a game so keep beating guys up. The problem is Dennard doesn't have great size, doesn't have the Seahawk CB rep, and will probably not have a coach who believes in this philosophy.

 

[kerouac9]

You do know that Lewan is facing a criminal assault charge that happened this past season, right? He followed a group of Ohio State fans and supposedly attacked them. Lewan is known to be a punk. Manziel is a cocky, immature kid, but he hasn't done anything criminal.

I guess you don't see the difference between a maturity issue and a potential sex offender and hothead. Hmm....

BW52 covered the sexual assault angle. The assault charge is nonsense. An Ohio State fan trying to get a Michigan star into trouble over some fracas he and his friends started.

If Manziel had gotten the NCAA suspension he deserved for taking money, would that not reflect poorly on his character? It's not the actions that matter, it's the consequences? Is that your argument here?

 

[CardLogic]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mitch
You may be right, PA.

However---

2. Bill O'Brien doesn't make the call, the GM does.
If you think O'Brian has no input whatsoever then you are fooling yourself.

8. Hey, if BA can adapt and change his thinking---so can Bill O'Brien.
The two years O'Brian was at PSU he started McGloin because he was his one and only option. He had another kid Paul Jones (6'4", 265 lbs.)who was a mobile QB but not much of a passer who was a 5 star recruit and O'Brian pretty much tossed him aside so the kid left PSU because he did not fit his offense. Once O-Brian had the chance to sign a tall, strong arm pocket QB he did in Hackenberg and even the backup was similar. Remember O'Brian was the OC in New England. He ran a similar offense at PSU. I don't see him changing that just so the team would have a QB with mobility. Johnny Football is not a O'Brian type QB and I would be very surprised to see the Texans take JF.

Being a hardcore Penn State fan and having watch O'Brien very closely the past two years; I agree with cardpa, Manziel simply doesn't fit the profile O'Brien wants in a QB.

 

[Krangodnzr]

BW52 covered the sexual assault angle. The assault charge is nonsense. An Ohio State fan trying to get a Michigan star into trouble over some fracas he and his friends started.

I wouldn't say it's nonsense, I would say he truly has a pattern of violent behavior. Coupled with his cheapshots on the field, and Lewan is a guy you have to worry about.

If Manziel had gotten the NCAA suspension he deserved for taking money, would that not reflect poorly on his character? It's not the actions that matter, it's the consequences? Is that your argument here?

Manziel's issues aren't criminal. That's the point I'm making. His actions are inline with a rich boy, priviledged football player, but he isn't a violent thug or potential rapist. It's not like he beat up his girlfriend, was drunkdriving, or beat up some Texas fans. Manziel is immature, but his talent on the football field more than makes up for his issues.

 

[Krangodnzr]

That is because they have worked at it for years and they have a head coach who is a secondary guy and is bought in. Carroll essentially believes that refs will only call so many PI calls a game so keep beating guys up. The problem is Dennard doesn't have great size, doesn't have the Seahawk CB rep, and will probably not have a coach who believes in this philosophy.

Fair enough. I just think there is a precedence for a way of using Dennard and making it work.

 

[kerouac9]

I wouldn't say it's nonsense, I would say he truly has a pattern of violent behavior. Coupled with his cheapshots on the field, and Lewan is a guy you have to worry about.



Manziel's issues aren't criminal. That's the point I'm making. His actions are inline with a rich boy, priviledged football player, but he isn't a violent thug or potential rapist. It's not like he beat up his girlfriend, was drunkdriving, or beat up some Texas fans. Manziel is immature, but his talent on the football field more than makes up for his issues.

As far as I can tell, Lewan's infraction (and I'm not sure that two completely unrelated events separated by years is really a "pattern of violent behavior").

So you'd rather draft the next Matt Leinart in Manziel than a hard-nosed, physical, road-grading blocker like Lewan. Is that what you're saying here?

I get accused of blowing things out of proportion because of a personal dislike of a player, but what you're doing here is completely, remarkably inane.

 

[WildBB]

That is because they have worked at it for years and they have a head coach who is a secondary guy and is bought in. Carroll essentially believes that refs will only call so many PI calls a game so keep beating guys up. The problem is Dennard doesn't have great size, doesn't have the Seahawk CB rep, and will probably not have a coach who believes in this philosophy.

I think Bowles coaches -- and his D's play a pretty intense pressure/pressing type of scheme generally. I think Dennard would fit in well here.

Some pundits have him going to the likes of NYJ, Pittsburgh and Clevland. They play the same type of D.

Kirwin: Pittsburgh Steelers | #15
The Steelers have many needs but if Dennard falls this far, one of the biggest needs is resolved. Rookies don't usually start in Pittsburgh but this guy will and he'll be there for a long time. For those who think the Steelers take a wide receiver in this spot, wait a round or two.

COMPARES TO: Keenan Lewis, New Orleans Saints - The expectations of rookie cornerbacks are often unrealistic. Dennard isn't the second coming of Deion Sanders, boasting the elite agility and speed to singlehandedly shut down half of the field. He's a steady, competitive defender who will provide gritty, physical play on the perimeter, projecting as a quality starter for years to come.


--Rob Rang

 

[Krangodnzr]

As far as I can tell, Lewan's infraction (and I'm not sure that two completely unrelated events separated by years is really a "pattern of violent behavior").

Two infractions? What about his play ON THE FIELD? He's known for being a cheap shot artist, which is indicative of his impulsive, violent nature.

https://www.google.com/#q=Lewan+cheapshot+artist&safe=off

So you'd rather draft the next Matt Leinart in Manziel than a hard-nosed, physical, road-grading blocker like Lewan. Is that what you're saying here?

I would draft Manziel over Lewan any day of the week. Lewan is a dime a dozen prospect, you have 3-4 Lewans every year. An OT that some doubt can hack it at LT in the pros. VS. Johnny Football, a remarkably successful QB prospects that has some warts, but could become a great NFL QB.

I get accused of blowing things out of proportion because of a personal dislike of a player, but what you're doing here is completely, remarkably inane.

LOL. Get over yourself. I had the guy slipping a bit IN THE FIRST ROUND. His character concerns have been mentioned by literally dozens of draft analysts.

You may not accept that Lewan has serious character concerns, but for a guy who tested out about as well as any LT prospect has tested at the combine, he doesn't have that much of a buzz going on.

His character concerns coupled with his inconsistent play on the field, going in the mid to late first round is about where he should go.

Taylor Lewan is a nice player, and I would be OK taking him at #20, but I would know that he has some major warts in his game and has more than a few questionable moments in his college career.