The Ayton Plan

[Finito]

I don't either but $10 million or so over a 4 year contract is not worth losing Ayton over when other players like Jalen Brunson are earning over a $100 million for 4 years.

Right.

When you look at who’s making 25-30 million a year in the NBA a lot of those guys aren’t star players.

I’ve come to terms they are moving on from Ayton. It’s by far the biggest fumble in the history of this franchise.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Right.

When you look at who’s making 25-30 million a year in the NBA a lot of those guys aren’t star players.

I’ve come to terms they are moving on from Ayton. It’s by far the biggest fumble in the history of this franchise.

And there's the thing. It seems to be such an obvious screw-up that I can't help thinking we're missing something. As in, maybe they have no intention of letting him go or maybe they have decent value coming back for him or maybe CP and Booker said trade us or trade Ayton or maybe Sarver said I don't want to pay him and I don't want high priced players coming back either or maybe some other reason that escapes us (or me at least). But something, something that says that stupidity wasn't our only reason.

 

[Cheesebeef]

It’s not surprising because it’s a very similar modus operandi to what most Lebron teams have done. Typically loading up on older vets to win now. And as should not be a shock to anyone, James jones was a part of those Lebron teams. It’s not a terrible plan when you’re actually a contender. The only difference for jones and Lebron is:

When the run is done, Lebron moves on to another team that can load up.

When the run is done, James jones will be left with a team with no young talent.

Also, James Jones isn’t building his team around the 2nd Greatest Player Of All Time in his prime.

The reality is we’ve seen this movie before… it’s exactly how Pringles’ Suns run ran. Screw draft picks, potentially lose a young player with high potential and find ways to scrimp on salary where we can.

 

[GatorAZ]

Right.

When you look at who’s making 25-30 million a year in the NBA a lot of those guys aren’t star players.

I’ve come to terms they are moving on from Ayton. It’s by far the biggest fumble in the history of this franchise.

He wouldn’t be the worst restricted free agent to leave Phoenix let alone the worst move ever. The Suns were frustrated by him on a rookie deal so they were never going to willingly triple his salary.

 

[Finito]

He wouldn’t be the worst restricted free agent to leave Phoenix let alone the worst move ever. The Suns were frustrated by him on a rookie deal so they were never going to willingly triple his salary.

I’m not saying he’s the best player to ever leave the franchise. I’m talking about the situation as a whole. From draft night till now.

The way this entire thing has been handled is really head scratching.

 

[GatorAZ]

I’m not saying he’s the best player to ever leave the franchise. I’m talking about the situation as a whole. From draft night till now.

The way this entire thing has been handled is really head scratching.

It’s pretty simple really. They don’t think he’s the type of player that warrants a big contract and to this point the market agrees. Whether or not it backfires remains to be seen.

 

[Lefty]

Ayton is young and the Suns should keep him. Both sides can make up. Chris Paul has been a great influence on the team and Ayton. I am sure he could help resolve the issues Ayton and management have. If the situation does not get better, you can then trade him later on. The Suns would get a better deal for Ayton down the road than they would now. Teams get desperate before the trading deadline.

 

[Finito]

It’s pretty simple really. They don’t think he’s the type of player that warrants a big contract and to this point the market agrees. Whether or not it backfires remains to be seen.

Yes I get that.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

They don’t think he’s the type of player that warrants a big contract and to this point the market agrees.

You could make this claim if he were an unrestricted FA. As a restricted FA, he's obviously limited.

 

[AzStevenCal]

It’s pretty simple really. They don’t think he’s the type of player that warrants a big contract and to this point the market agrees. Whether or not it backfires remains to be seen.

I don't think it's all that simple. To be that simple JJ would have had to be lying when he said they intended to offer him a 3 or 4 year max contract or something in the situation changed dramatically from start of season to offseason.

Also, restricted free agency is intended to limit movement and help the original team keep him or get value for him if they choose to trade so it really doesn't tell us much about the market.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Also, James Jones isn’t building his team around the 2nd Greatest Player Of All Time in his prime.

The reality is we’ve seen this movie before… it’s exactly how Pringles’ Suns run ran. Screw draft picks, potentially lose a young player with high potential and find ways to scrimp on salary where we can.

Yup. SSOL redux.

 

[GatorAZ]

I don't think it's all that simple. To be that simple JJ would have had to be lying when he said they intended to offer him a 3 or 4 year max contract or something in the situation changed dramatically from start of season to offseason.

Also, restricted free agency is intended to limit movement and help the original team keep him or get value for him if they choose to trade so it really doesn't tell us much about the market.

Have you heard the term “GM speak”?

 

[AzStevenCal]

Have you heard the term “GM speak”?

Sure but that wasn't GM speak. He was specific and left himself no room to manuever later on if it was just "GM speak". And he's even more incompetent than some of the posters here believe if he didn't know better.

 

[GatorAZ]

Sure but that wasn't GM speak. He was specific and left himself no room to manuever later on if it was just "GM speak". And he's even more incompetent than some of the posters here believe if he didn't know better.

After reading the article that was textbook GM speak. The connotation of that conversation is that they didn’t pay him because Sarver was cheap. You’re obviously going to say you wanted him and bring up wanting him for less years or because the rookie max designation limits getting another player (which Duffy denies ever hearing). You can’t take what either side says publicly at their word.

 

[1tinsoldier]

There’s really no point in trying to make sense of the Stix saga. From draft night to trade day it’s made zero sense.

add Holiday to the makes-no-sense list. He was included in a trade because they thought he could help. It looked to me like he was more useful than anticipated. Now he's gone after a few months.

and, of course, the Ayton saga makes no sense. The "internal matter" and the game 7 meltdown remain unsolved mysteries.

perhaps it's time the local media starts questioning the management style of Jones and Monty. We already know Sarver's style, with a big reveal on that coming any day now

Jones and Monty have some explaining to do next time they've got a microphone in their grill

 

[95pro]

Its simply that Ayton doesn’t want to be here that is causing all this trouble. If not it’s easy to open up and talk shop with Aytons camp and work towards an extension.

 

[Finito]

Its simply that Ayton doesn’t want to be here that is causing all this trouble. If not it’s easy to open up and talk shop with Aytons camp and work towards an extension.

In my opinion they don’t want Ayton here for the money he wants. They’ve gone out of there way to devalue him the last two years

 

[Finito]

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[Finito]

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[ASUCHRIS]

Ayton/Bridges/4 1sts/3 swaps with Utah?

I bet the Suns think that's too much. (I do too)

Unless we're getting another decent wing back, (Clarkson or something like that) I'm not sure I'd do it.

 

[Finito]

Ayton/Bridges/4 1sts/3 swaps with Utah?

I bet the Suns think that's too much. (I do too)

Unless we're getting another decent wing back, (Clarkson or something like that) I'm not sure I'd do it.

Yeah I don’t like how we’re the only ones giving up crazy picks

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Yeah I don’t like how we’re the only ones giving up crazy picks

Bridges is widely considered a top 50 player, and Ayton is in that range as well. I bet the deal would be done right now if the Suns were willing to completely capitulate, but if so, I'm glad. That's just giving up too much for a 34 year old with recent injury issues.

 

[Germz249]

Ayton/Bridges/4 1sts/3 swaps with Utah?

I bet the Suns think that's too much. (I do too)

Unless we're getting another decent wing back, (Clarkson or something like that) I'm not sure I'd do it.

Thats a big no from me.. I think thats way too much..

Basically we would be trading Ayton to Ind for Turner and a 1st rd pick.. then packaging that with 4 picks and Bridges for Durant? Which then the Nets send the picks to Utah for Mitchell while dumping Simmons..

If we got another piece back from the Jazz like Clarkson yea maybe.. I understand we get Durant but we should all feel like we broke even but instead I feel we are getting the short end of the deal..

 

[1tinsoldier]

my final offer for the 34 year old with injury and chemistry issues is our 24 year old with maturity issues

if Jersey doesn't like it, let them live with their disgruntled superstar

oh, alright. i'll throw in 1 first round pick
ok... 2. but that's it!

 

[AzStevenCal]

After reading the article that was textbook GM speak. The connotation of that conversation is that they didn’t pay him because Sarver was cheap. You’re obviously going to say you wanted him and bring up wanting him for less years or because the rookie max designation limits getting another player (which Duffy denies ever hearing). You can’t take what either side says publicly at their word.

I don't know really know (or care) which article you're talking about, I was talking about what was said back then by JJ and by Duffy.

JJ initially said that they had a meeting and the agent told him there was nothing to discuss unless there was a max 5 year offer on the table. James also said (or implied) that they'd offered DA a 3 or 4 year max but then immediately retracted it when Duffy entered the picture and said that was the first they'd heard of a shorter max offer. JJ rephrased and acknowledged the offer hadn't been made, said it was actually just a phone call and that they weren't given the chance to make their intended offer. That "no actual meeting" and "no actual offer from JJ" was supported by Duffy.

JJ said the only reason they didn't offer the max right off was they wanted to avoid having 2 players on the designated rookie scale because it could handcuff them in adding players down the road. Over the next few weeks, on more than one occasion, JJ re-affirmed what he said about willing to give them a shorter term max deal and also mentioned they were surprised that the agent came in unwilling to discuss anything but the 5 year max because the upcoming TV deal meant hitting FA earlier could benefit a player. None of that is GM speak, it's too direct, it's too specific.

I'm not saying you can't dismiss some of the things JJ said as GM speak. When a GM speaks in flowers and rainbows, that's GM speak. When he talks for 5 minutes and says nothing that's GM speak. But what JJ said is either the truth or he's flat out lying. Lying happens but rarely in a situation where it's unnecessary, that's the kind of thing that can haunt a leader for years to come.