Suns @ Pelicans Monday game thread 4-1-2024

1982baskets

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Vogel is a moron, push the ball the 1st qtr and they nearly score 50. Start walking the ball up and killing clock = bad shots and the scoring stalls.... what an idiot
Vogel teams play a mix of pace. What he needs is that Lebron/Rondo. If you ever watched how his teams won in LA LA land, the point guard was important down the stretch of games.

It's ok that we don't start a point guard, but to not trade or sign a NBA level quality point guard for the rotation is pure madness.

I don't put this on Vogel. He's done his job, fairly. Team believes they can win against anyone (even though they can't). Beal/Book/KD share the ball well enough. Defense, is better than what was expected. What we need is a leader and a point guard. Our best player in that aspect is IT. And IT hasn't performed in the league in 4 years.
 

Chaplin

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Vogel teams play a mix of pace. What he needs is that Lebron/Rondo. If you ever watched how his teams won in LA LA land, the point guard was important down the stretch of games.

It's ok that we don't start a point guard, but to not trade or sign a NBA level quality point guard for the rotation is pure madness.

I don't put this on Vogel. He's done his job, fairly. Team believes they can win against anyone (even though they can't). Beal/Book/KD share the ball well enough. Defense, is better than what was expected. What we need is a leader and a point guard. Our best player in that aspect is IT. And IT hasn't performed in the league in 4 years.
Come on, Vogel has not "done his job, fairly." Sure, we have some personnel issues as well, but Vogel takes a huge amount of blame. "Team believes they can win against anyone"? Really? You can hate on the players all you want, but to give Vogel a free pass is mind boggling.

He deserves to be fired immediately after the season is over, but I won't be surprised if they decide to keep him for another year, especially if we keep James Jones on staff.
 

Proximo

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Come on, Vogel has not "done his job, fairly." Sure, we have some personnel issues as well, but Vogel takes a huge amount of blame. "Team believes they can win against anyone"? Really? You can hate on the players all you want, but to give Vogel a free pass is mind boggling.

He deserves to be fired immediately after the season is over, but I won't be surprised if they decide to keep him for another year, especially if we keep James Jones on staff.
On any given night the team can beat anyone. The key is do they believe they can win a series against anyone, and deep down there is no way they can believe that the way this season has gone.

Ishbia would be insane to bring back Vogel - because the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over again and expecting a different result - and the roster isn't going to change much.
 

AzStevenCal

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Lets face it the first quarter is the only reason we won that game. If there had been 4 more minutes on the clock that was a loss.
Negative much? Come on, this team gives up spurts, but they go on spurts too. Could they have lost if the game was 4 minutes longer? Sure, but you act like it's a given which is surprising since New Orleans only outscored us in one quarter (the 3rd) and that was only by 7 points.
 

BirdGangThing

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Negative much? Come on, this team gives up spurts, but they go on spurts too. Could they have lost if the game was 4 minutes longer? Sure, but you act like it's a given which is surprising since New Orleans only outscored us in one quarter (the 3rd) and that was only by 7 points.
plus the pelicans kinda fizzled out after that big run to make it a game again not to mention book and beal weren't having it
 

Chaplin

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Lets face it the first quarter is the only reason we won that game. If there had been 4 more minutes on the clock that was a loss.
So we won the game only because we played the game? That's some loopy logic there. Games aren't 52 minutes, they are 48.

And if our game against the Spurs lasted another 4 minutes we would have won.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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Lets face it the first quarter is the only reason we won that game. If there had been 4 more minutes on the clock that was a loss.
Probably true. Good thing the first quarter counts as much as the fourth.
 

wagon mound 464

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SUNS lead was 27 pts at one point, and let the pelicans chip it down to single digit. I read some of you call that a Pelican run,
but I seen it as a Pelican wallop with big Z driving his lard butt
down into the paint to score and many times got the foul call.
Other teams in the west are watching how the Suns implode, and
don't fear the Suns. Their whole game changes in the second half.
Blame the coach or blame the players? You make the call.

I foresee Matt I. as being disappointed with team/coach, and may have thoughts of a coaching change, but J. Jones will talk him out of firing Frankie.
 
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Mainstreet

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SUNS lead was 27 pts at one point, and let the pelicans chip it down to single digit. I read some of you call that a Pelican run,
but I seen it as a Pelican wallop with big Z driving his lard butt
down into the paint to score and many times got the foul call.
Other teams in the west are watching how the Suns implode, and
don't fear the Suns. Their whole game changes in the second half.
Blame the coach or blame the players? You make the call.

I foresee Matt I. as being disappointed with team/coach, and may have thoughts of a coaching change, but J. Jones will talk him out of firing Frankie.

I think James Jones will have his hands full keeping his own job.
 

Chaplin

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SUNS lead was 27 pts at one point, and let the pelicans chip it down to single digit. I read some of you call that a Pelican run,
but I seen it as a Pelican wallop with big Z driving his lard butt
down into the paint to score and many times got the foul call.
Other teams in the west are watching how the Suns implode, and
don't fear the Suns. Their whole game changes in the second half.
Blame the coach or blame the players? You make the call.

I foresee Matt I. as being disappointed with team/coach, and may have thoughts of a coaching change, but J. Jones will talk him out of firing Frankie.
This is the NBA, a 25 point lead in the first half is NEVER safe no matter who you are playing.
 

95pro

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our starters were assed and gassed by the 4th - they won't survive a series playing that much

If we can make it a short series, 4-5 games, would hopefully shouldn't have to worry about this too much.

But what i would like to see is a much more balanced roster and a slight shift in minutes. This can be accomplished a few ways.

One we could start Oneal or Gordon over Allen. Why would we have the best 3pt shooter coming off the bench? That's a tough one, but it could help Gordon get going, if he's not, he checks out of games almost completely. Sometimes older doods just can't get it going once they cooled off from warm ups.

Oneal would be a defensive upgrade, we would also be bigger, teams wouldn't start hunting Allen right away. This is nothing negative about Allen, but we just need to spread the scoring and make guys more effective throughout the playable roster. Allen can get his #'s starting or not IMO.

Second is adjust rotations and minutes of course. I think we are set in this, but I would like to stop seeing entire quarters played by anyone. I'd even be happy with 5/6 in, 1/2 minutes rest, 5/6 minutes back in the quarter. This is weird a take but sometimes I feel two of the big three is adequate out there, being a decoy does provide some rest on offense but leads to stagnation.
 

Suns_fan69

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If we can make it a short series, 4-5 games, would hopefully shouldn't have to worry about this too much.

But what i would like to see is a much more balanced roster and a slight shift in minutes. This can be accomplished a few ways.

One we could start Oneal or Gordon over Allen. Why would we have the best 3pt shooter coming off the bench? That's a tough one, but it could help Gordon get going, if he's not, he checks out of games almost completely. Sometimes older doods just can't get it going once they cooled off from warm ups.

Oneal would be a defensive upgrade, we would also be bigger, teams wouldn't start hunting Allen right away. This is nothing negative about Allen, but we just need to spread the scoring and make guys more effective throughout the playable roster. Allen can get his #'s starting or not IMO.

Second is adjust rotations and minutes of course. I think we are set in this, but I would like to stop seeing entire quarters played by anyone. I'd even be happy with 5/6 in, 1/2 minutes rest, 5/6 minutes back in the quarter. This is weird a take but sometimes I feel two of the big three is adequate out there, being a decoy does provide some rest on offense but leads to stagnation.
I agree with most of this. I suggested O'Neale starting in place of Beal a while back, but in place of Allen may be better so that Book can play more off-ball. I'm less bullish on Gordon. While he's in theory stronger and more stout defensively than Allen, he loses his man on cuts and just dies on screens whereas Allen is at least schematically more sound if individually is more prone to getting picked on.
 

AzStevenCal

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I thought it was the 2nd. But regardless my point still stands even in the 3rd.
IIRC we went up 27 when Devin hit one of two free throws with about 8 minutes left in the 3rd. But, ebbs and flows. We had runs, they had runs; we had more of them. The Pels pulled to within 18 early in the 3rd quarter before we went on our run which of course, they followed with a big run of their own. But despite that 27 point 3rd quarter lead, it was just a 13 point difference going into the 4th quarter.
 

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