Suggs - Another poor workout. Looks good for number 6, to me.

[SECTION 11]

Originally posted by ajcardfan
Suggs isn't Johnson and he isn't Burke. At least not IMO.

I agree. He's definately an upgrade.




I love the draft. It's just fun as crap.

 

[SECTION 11]

I've ranted enough for one week....

Have a good weekend!

 

[ajcardfan]

Originally posted by SECTION 11
What question marks?

It's not like he's a strong armed QB who can't throw very far.
Wouldn't that be a kick if his main stregnth really didn't measure up on paper? That'd be something.

Yes, Leftwich is probably better than what can be measured by a yardstick. And Suggs is better than what can be measured by a stopwatch. Here's some of the questions on Leftwich, from CBS:

"Leftwich has impressed a lot of teams with the way he interviews. ...... But that doesn't mean the concerns about him are gone. Teams are still worried that his lack of mobility will hurt in the NFL, but the great quarterbacks all make their plays inside the pocket anyway. The fact he didn't play against high-level competition at Marshall is a concern. "Those corners he faced all ran 4.7, and the linebackers are 5-flat guys," said one team's personnel director. "Teams have to take that into account." Despite it all, Leftwich has too good an arm and accuracy to pass up."

 

[Cheesebeef]

Originally posted by ajcardfan
Yes, Leftwich is probably better than what can be measured by a yardstick. And Suggs is better than what can be measured by a stopwatch. Here's some of the questions on Leftwich, from CBS:

"Leftwich has impressed a lot of teams with the way he interviews. ...... But that doesn't mean the concerns about him are gone. Teams are still worried that his lack of mobility will hurt in the NFL, but the great quarterbacks all make their plays inside the pocket anyway. The fact he didn't play against high-level competition at Marshall is a concern. "Those corners he faced all ran 4.7, and the linebackers are 5-flat guys," said one team's personnel director. "Teams have to take that into account." Despite it all, Leftwich has too good an arm and accuracy to pass up."

Didn't Pennington face the same level of competition? Wasn't Moss running against those pathetic players also? Isn't Drew Bledsoe, Pennington, Brad Johnsonslow as molasses? Hell, Jim Kelly and Warren Moon used to grow roots in the pocket. And besides, Leftwhich could outrun at least one DE in the draft that I know of.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by cheesebeef
Didn't Pennington face the same level of competition? Wasn't Moss running against those pathetic players also? Isn't Drew Bledsoe, Pennington, Brad Johnsonslow as molasses? Hell, Jim Kelly and Warren Moon used to grow roots in the pocket. And besides, Leftwhich could outrun at least one DE in the draft that I know of.

I agree. I watched Moss from his first big season at Marshall and he was basically IMO a lock to be a star. Pennington was almost equally as impressive as Moss and look how he turned out.

Leftwich, imo, is better than either one.....

And for your last point? There IS NO WAY that Leftwich would beat Suggs on the field. If you believe that, then you have never watched football in your life, and only follow box scores and stat sheets.

Leftwich is slow as mollasses and I was actually surprised with his amazing (for him) 40 time (4.8-4.9).

 

[Cheesebeef]

good lord man - can't you see where someone is having fun and being sarcastic?

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by cheesebeef
good lord man - can't you see where someone is having fun and being sarcastic?

Dude, I know you are having fun!

Maybe I should have included an emoticon. I don't really get bent out of shape unless someone is outwardly insulting me or their is a post by Kerouac (though I'm starting to agree with his post the more I hear what he has to say).

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Leftwich is slow as mollasses and I was actually surprised with his amazing (for him) 40 time (4.8-4.9). [/B]

that's faster than Suggs who would be trying to chase him down.

 

[Weenus O'Baggins]

Sorry but

Even as a guy who used to say Suggs or Leftwich, I can't ignore just how bad his workouts are.

18 bench press reps? That is pathetic for a defensive end.

4.89 speed? There are offensive lineman with those kind of "quicks".


Suggs is really starting to look like a potential bust. Which of course probably means we will draft him at six and watch him absolutely stink.

 

[Cardiac]

Just another reason to trade down.

 

[X-29Fan]

For the record

I hope the Cards do not draft Suggs.

Suggs was an extremely productive college player, but that does not necessarily mean he will be so in the pros. While I understand that workouts are not "everything", they must have some importance, or they wouldn't have them.

The Cards need speed, and inevitably, players that run fast 40 times have speed.

I am not saying that Suggs will be a bad player. But, for a top 6 pick (who will require a hefty signing bonus), I would like to see the Cards get a player without such a question mark.

IF someone is buying, I hope they trade out of the spot.

 

[JeffGollin]

Suggs is a consensus top ten pick to ALL NFL teams. WE DID NOT MAKE THAT RANKING. I watched Suggs' play this year, and I would want him even if he played at University of Minnesota. He completely dominated EVERYONE he faced and was a force in all aspects of the game.
Point well taken. From my vantage point in NJ - I came into this college season all excited about a 330 lb defensive tackle named Kennedy and ready to rip all you homers in AZ about Suggs.

Then I watched them on TV. Kennedy disappointed me. Suggs really impressed me.

There are two biases that the scouts always warn us about - (a) workout warriors and (b) "good college players" who aren't good enough to play in the NFL. But looking back over 50 years of following this stuff, I strongly feel that you're far better off erring in the direction of guys who had a track record of getting the job done than you are with guys like Leeland McElroy who had great forty, shuttle and cone times.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by JeffGollin
Suggs is a consensus top ten pick to ALL NFL teams. WE DID NOT MAKE THAT RANKING. I watched Suggs' play this year, and I would want him even if he played at University of Minnesota. He completely dominated EVERYONE he faced and was a force in all aspects of the game.
Point well taken. From my vantage point in NJ - I came into this college season all excited about a 330 lb defensive tackle named Kennedy and ready to rip all you homers in AZ about Suggs.

Then I watched them on TV. Kennedy disappointed me. Suggs really impressed me.

There are two biases that the scouts always warn us about - (a) workout warriors and (b) "good college players" who aren't good enough to play in the NFL. But looking back over 50 years of following this stuff, I strongly feel that you're far better off erring in the direction of guys who had a track record of getting the job done than you are with guys like Leeland McElroy who had great forty, shuttle and cone times.

I read a good article the other day on the cornerstone picks that built what is now a Super Bowl Champion, The Tampa Bay Buccaneers: Warren Sapp and Derrick Brooks.

Those two were a departure from the way Tampa used to draft. They used to draft the guys that had great workouts and had a lot of POTENTIAL, and it didn't turn out well, considering Tampa was awful. Sapp and Brooks weren't "workout" warriors and many questioned how good they could be.

Rich McKay, Tampa's GM said that he values production over anything else, and I'm beginning to agree...Three years from now, all these Suggs doubters aren't going to admit that they doubted him...

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by Cbus cardsfan
that's faster than Suggs who would be trying to chase him down.

You have never watched either of them play if you would say this.

 

[AZCB34]

Originally posted by Krangthebrain
...Three years from now, all these Suggs doubters aren't going to admit that they doubted him...

I will admit it...but I am still certain this board will be filled with thread after thread of excuses as to why Suggs hasn't performed to expectations.

 

[ajcardfan]

Originally posted by AZCB34
I will admit it...but I am still certain this board will be filled with thread after thread of excuses as to why Suggs hasn't performed to expectations.

I really don't think so. Suggs will never have even 1/4 of the popularity that Plummer had here.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by AZCB34
I will admit it...but I am still certain this board will be filled with thread after thread of excuses as to why Suggs hasn't performed to expectations.

I will admit it if he is a bust.

I think everyone will. Plummer just had a way of making some fans hallucinate....or at least that's the only thing I can think to explain the differences in perception!

 

[imaCafan]

I weigh 180lbs., have had surgery on one shoulder about 12 years ago, need surgery on the other shoulder, and I could do 10 reps at 225!!! This dude needs to hit the weights BIG TIME!!!!!