Reasonable extension for Dumpster Dan?

[GatorAZ]

For a solid NT coming off his rookie contract? He will be 28 years old next season...

Right now according to Overthecap.com the Cards are projected to be about 6m over the salary cap (but that doesn't include cap carryover from this season and DOES include Palmer's 10m, so subtract that).

Dumpster Dan is a big part of our run D but having the money for a QB is simply more important. Alameda Ta'amu could also be a cheap backup plan.

 

[BigRedRage]

I've wondered as well how that is going to go down

 

[Garthshort]

We need him. When he got into decent shape we became a top/near the top run stuffing team.

 

[Russ Smith]

I think we should make him the highest paid player in the NFL at his position, apparently that's how you get a guy to play better.

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

This is the most reasonable extension for Dan:

 

[Stout]

Extend him, for sure. Ask the Steelers how well they've done in the middle of the line in the 3-4 in the post-Hampton era. You do NOT let a top NT go when you're playing the 3-4.

 

[Finito]

He's maybe my favorite Cardinal just quietly does his job game in game out. He's a huge reason why our run defense is so good he just never gets pushed back.

We def need him so whatever it takes

 

[Darkside]

I'm not convinced he's that solid. Good lateral movement (great lateral movement actually) but I don't see him push Centers back and he's never double teamed. I'm not against extending him, don't get me wrong, I'm not sure we can improve on him, but I'm still not convinced he's anything other than average.

(That being said, his ability to shed dudes and move laterally is pretty excellent, he just doesn't have the push I'd like)

 

[unseenaz]

Extend him, for sure. Ask the Steelers how well they've done in the middle of the line in the 3-4 in the post-Hampton era. You do NOT let a top NT go when you're playing the 3-4.

Not to sound ignorant, inevitably that's how this will come off.. But is he REALLY a top NT in this league?

 

[Finito]

I'm not convinced he's that solid. Good lateral movement (great lateral movement actually) but I don't see him push Centers back and he's never double teamed. I'm not against extending him, don't get me wrong, I'm not sure we can improve on him, but I'm still not convinced he's anything other than average.

(That being said, his ability to shed dudes and move laterally is pretty excellent, he just doesn't have the push I'd like)

So just who is not average according to you

 

[Darkside]

So just who is not average according to you

That's a weird question, I'm not sure what you're asking me? I'm just saying he's not above average, to me he's average. I've seen him make some really good plays shedding blocks and going sideline to sideline (moreso last year). But I've never seen him get push. Never seen him shed his man and disrupt the backfield. When's the last time he wow'd you?

(Apologies, I am slow. To your question: I guess Wilfork, Ratliff, Kyle Williams. There are more, a lot more that are better than Dan Williams)

What makes Dan Williams special? What makes him above average? I think he's average at best. There were games he got few snaps. I even think Taamau, however you spell that, got more push than him.

 

[Jetstream Green]

He is one of the main reasons this defense is great when healthy, and is surviving now. He is very very important and the route of the cheap backup plan is a flawed one. What makes him so special is that the offense cannot get a push against us and why we can play the run so well in a 3-4... it is simple, he is the foundation of the front DL and does not get the credit he deserves as a NT in the 3-4

 

[vince56]

I'm not convinced he's that solid.

We are averaging only 72 yards rushing against our D per game. Let that sink in for a minute. This guy is worth his weight in gold.

 

[Snakester]

Yea he's not great but he is pretty solid. We don't have to break the bank to keep him but I think a five year 25 million dollar contract would keep him here. If he wants ten mil a year then let him walk. Ta'amu when healthy is solid as well. I would like to keep him also.

 

[cardpa]

I am going to call him high average. I get where Darkside is coming from. Dumpster can hold his ground and has great lateral movement however he lacks any type of good penetration. This makes him a high average player. The best NTs can do all three.

 

[Stout]

He is one of the main reasons this defense is great when healthy, and is surviving now. He is very very important and the route of the cheap backup plan is a flawed one. What makes him so special is that the offense cannot get a push against us and why we can play the run so well in a 3-4... it is simple, he is the foundation of the front DL and does not get the credit he deserves as a NT in the 3-4

Winner winner, chicken dinner. We'd be idiots to let him walk.

 

[BIGRED1959]

Winner winner, chicken dinner. We'd be idiots to let him walk.

yes, This.

he needs to be here for the looong haul

 

[kerouac9]

Winner winner, chicken dinner. We'd be idiots to let him walk.

Who's saying that we're going to "let him walk"? I don't hear anyone advocating that. The question in the OP is what would be a "reasonable extension" for him?

If Larry Fitzgerald and Carson Palmer both stay on the roster in 2015, it's going to be virtually impossible to keep Dan Williams. Palmer could command in excess of $12M in 2015 money alone, and accounting tricks just push that cost into the future, when he likely wouldn't be on the roster. Even with a steep pay cut, Fitz would do significant damage to our cap.

I think that $5M per season would be fair for a guy who plays at a high level, but also a guy who's had some problems staying healthy, fit, and is only on the field for 30-40% of the defensive plays.

 

[GuernseyCard]

That's a weird question, I'm not sure what you're asking me? I'm just saying he's not above average, to me he's average. I've seen him make some really good plays shedding blocks and going sideline to sideline (moreso last year). But I've never seen him get push. Never seen him shed his man and disrupt the backfield. When's the last time he wow'd you?

(Apologies, I am slow. To your question: I guess Wilfork, Ratliff, Kyle Williams. There are more, a lot more that are better than Dan Williams)

What makes Dan Williams special? What makes him above average? I think he's average at best. There were games he got few snaps. I even think Taamau, however you spell that, got more push than him.

The Ratliff of Dallas, some 4 seasons ago was superior, but certainly not the 33 year old in Chicago. IMO

 

[nationsrj]

I believe Dan is Average Starter

From ProFootballFocus
Dan is an average starter at his position.

 

[Chopper0080]

With regards to usage, age, and position, I am offering him between 3 and 3.5 mil for 2 or 3 years tops. It is a salary cap league, and he just doesn't play enough snaps or is enough of a pass rush threat to justify more than that IMO. Similar situation to Shaughnessy IMO. If Williams wants to take a different deal somewhere else, the Cards can role with Ta'amu and Gaston, or bring in another body.

 

[crisper57]

With all the pieces we lost up front, the Cards are still Top 3 in Run Defense. To me, that doesn't happen if Dumpster Dan isn't on the field.

 

[TJ]

With regards to usage, age, and position, I am offering him between 3 and 3.5 mil for 2 or 3 years tops. It is a salary cap league, and he just doesn't play enough snaps or is enough of a pass rush threat to justify more than that IMO. Similar situation to Shaughnessy IMO. If Williams wants to take a different deal somewhere else, the Cards can role with Ta'amu and Gaston, or bring in another body.

I vacillate on the Dan Williams issue. I figured Ta'amu could replace him, but he's shown little this year.

Williams is good, but certainly replaceable. I'd offer about the same, but think someone's gonna give him 5 years 25 mil on the open market.

 

[Chopper0080]

Dan Williams usage to date 31.7% of defensive snaps. The Ghost has played 30.8%. (violated my own rule but it is regards to Dan Williams so I will allow it)

 

[Russ Smith]

Who's saying that we're going to "let him walk"? I don't hear anyone advocating that. The question in the OP is what would be a "reasonable extension" for him?

If Larry Fitzgerald and Carson Palmer both stay on the roster in 2015, it's going to be virtually impossible to keep Dan Williams. Palmer could command in excess of $12M in 2015 money alone, and accounting tricks just push that cost into the future, when he likely wouldn't be on the roster. Even with a steep pay cut, Fitz would do significant damage to our cap.

I think that $5M per season would be fair for a guy who plays at a high level, but also a guy who's had some problems staying healthy, fit, and is only on the field for 30-40% of the defensive plays.

That sounds about right, I keep forgetting the issue we have with Fitz and his salary. Tough situation you'd like him to retire a Card but you almost wish the NFL had a amnesty clause like the NBA to get out from under such a contract too.

I agree with others it's not coincidence the run defense is still good, Dan has a lot to do with that, but you have to be careful you don't want to overpay for a guy who plays less than half the snaps.