Miller once again does it again!

[overseascardfan]

I'm curious if in the end Ferguson just didn't want to bother waiting and left, or if he really knew he wasn't qualifying? He went to the same HS Duval did, twice, they were reportedly doing the same online classes because of the problems at Prime Prep and the school after that.

One ACC coach per Norlander said the fact that Bagley qualified was "incredible, but not at all surprising", clearly there are some people out there wondering how a school that is allegedly difficult to get into keeps getting kids like Duval and Bagley accepted through admissions.

I'm sure Coach K knew they would get in otherwise he wouldn't have went through the trouble of recruiting them. Again, just can't stand Coach K. He's a great coach but a hypocrite, constantly bashing the one and done rule but has no problem with them going to Duke. If he feels so strongly, send a message by not recruiting those type of kids.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Very few elite academic universities actually live up to those standards for their student athletes at the football and basketball levels. And even if their athletes are better than the average athlete at other schools they are, on average, subpar to the rest of their respective schools' academic profiles. Just the way of the world.

 

[GatorAZ]

I can't say too much considering Ayton is good to go with a lot less "sweating" than most expected. He didn't reclassify so it was less complicated but many thought he'd never play a game in college and bluebloods like Kentucky and Duke didn't really recruit him because of it. A lot of time in recruiting you get lucky. Ayton had an eligibility stigma plus his mom wanted him close so Arizona was in prime position to sign him.

The best thing Coach K did was bring in Jeff Capel who's a monster on the recruiting trail. Duke is now a OAD factory like Kentucky. Even in the years after the rule their teams were 3-4 year guys like Kyle Singler, Jon Sheyer, Nolan Smith, Ryan Kelly, Seth Curry and the Plumlee's. Capel came in and Kyrie was the first guy followed by Austin Rivers then Jabari Parker, Okafor, Winslow, Ingram, Tatum, Giles etc...

Give K credit for adapting. Team USA coach didn't hurt either.

 

[Russ Smith]

Very few elite academic universities actually live up to those standards for their student athletes at the football and basketball levels. And even if their athletes are better than the average athlete at other schools they are, on average, subpar to the rest of their respective schools' academic profiles. Just the way of the world.

Oh that's true everywhere, UCLA, even Stanford.

What I'm talking about is the double standard in the media. To be fair Norlander did do a 2nd story where he pointed out many people are skeptical of how Bagley qualified,but in that article he called those people Duke haters implying it's jealousy. Again his own employers 18 months ago were speculating Bagley(and Ayton) would never qualify for D1 and they mean 18 for Bagley not 17.

Either their information then was wrong, or it's incredibly easy for athletes to get credits these days and I frankly think it's the latter.

That's the system I don't blame Bagley or Duval for abusing it but I do blame the media for not being honest and I blame the NCAA. in jan 2016 they passed a new rule specifically aimed at stopping this sort of abuse of online education to rack up credits and core classes late in the game. They estimated 8% of the incoming freshman basketball players that year were going to be impacted by that rule. And 18 months later Bagley does it and nobody bats an eye?

He literally completed his senior year of HS, online, in 2 months, all the while competing in the EYBL which meant he was on the road Fri-Mon virtually every week. I assume it's possible, child actors do it,but I kind of doubt Bagley had a team of teachers and tutors following him around like actors do.

It is the system in place I get that I just don't want to hear all year again from ESPN et al what a great academic institution Duke is, they have gone to essentially the same path Calipari has and yet there's still this perception in the national media that calipari is bad for the game and Coach K is good.

 

[Russ Smith]

I can't say too much considering Ayton is good to go with a lot less "sweating" than most expected. He didn't reclassify so it was less complicated but many thought he'd never play a game in college and bluebloods like Kentucky and Duke didn't really recruit him because of it. A lot of time in recruiting you get lucky. Ayton had an eligibility stigma plus his mom wanted him close so Arizona was in prime position to sign him.

The best thing Coach K did was bring in Jeff Capel who's a monster on the recruiting trail. Duke is now a OAD factory like Kentucky. Even in the years after the rule their teams were 3-4 year guys like Kyle Singler, Jon Sheyer, Nolan Smith, Ryan Kelly, Seth Curry and the Plumlee's. Capel came in and Kyrie was the first guy followed by Austin Rivers then Jabari Parker, Okafor, Winslow, Ingram, Tatum, Giles etc...

Give K credit for adapting. Team USA coach didn't hurt either.

Capel clearly a big part but yeah what jumpstarted their recruiting was Team USA and Duke making a fundamental decision that winning games was so important they were going to commpletely change their academic standards for basketball to compete.

 

[Russ Smith]

Naz Reid to LSU. no word on if he's still thinking about reclassifying. with Bagley pulling it off I don't see why not, he could probably graduate by Friday if he started today (-:

The rumor is his family is in a bad neighborhood in NJ and he really wants to get to the NBA a year earlier so he can move his family. My guess is it's too late for him now unless he's been doing the extra work for a month or two already.

I guess that explains why Moses Brown says Arizona visited him the other day at his school and is wanting back in his recruitment, they realized they weren't getting Reid and still want another big. Sounds like the kid wants to go to Louisville but is a little nervous about their current issues and rumors this is Pitino's last year.

 

[overseascardfan]

Naz Reid to LSU. no word on if he's still thinking about reclassifying. with Bagley pulling it off I don't see why not, he could probably graduate by Friday if he started today (-:

The rumor is his family is in a bad neighborhood in NJ and he really wants to get to the NBA a year earlier so he can move his family. My guess is it's too late for him now unless he's been doing the extra work for a month or two already.

I guess that explains why Moses Brown says Arizona visited him the other day at his school and is wanting back in his recruitment, they realized they weren't getting Reid and still want another big. Sounds like the kid wants to go to Louisville but is a little nervous about their current issues and rumors this is Pitino's last year.

I thought I read Maryland had a good shot at Moses Brown as well. I guess it's Bol or bust for UA, is there another big on UA's radar? Jordan Brown?

 

[GatorAZ]

I thought I read Maryland had a good shot at Moses Brown as well. I guess it's Bol or bust for UA, is there another big on UA's radar? Jordan Brown?

Bol is visiting UK but Gershwin says AZ still the heavy favorite. The Reid stuff was fun for about a week.

 

[Russ Smith]

I thought I read Maryland had a good shot at Moses Brown as well. I guess it's Bol or bust for UA, is there another big on UA's radar? Jordan Brown?

Maryland because he's an Under Armour kid and they are apparently one of the leaders. His dads comment about UA was interesting, he openly admitted they'd been hot and cold on Moses but then seemed to have been impressed they came to visit, like he didn't really mind being a fallback to Reid. That made me assume he's not really all that high on Maryland.

We're told on BRO that Bol is all but a lock to UA, if he's taking other visits it's probably just for show.

The other rumor that persists on BRO is that Brandon Williams is going to decommit but nobody has any source on that it's just he won't want to play with Quinerly and Barcello.

UA isn't on the final 7 for Jordan Brown but given the list it wouldn't surprise me if it changed if his recruitment heats up again. I think he'd like to add bigger name schools if he could.

 

[carey]

Do we know anything about the Arizona coach that will be charged with fraud and corruption today?

 

[TJ]

Do we know anything about the Arizona coach that will be charged with fraud and corruption today?

Book is in deep doo doo

 

[Dback Jon]

http://www.businessinsider.com/college-basketball-bribery-scandal-arrests-2017-9?r=UK&IR=T


So will this make any Arizona players ineligible now ?

 

[carey]

http://www.businessinsider.com/college-basketball-bribery-scandal-arrests-2017-9?r=UK&IR=T


So will this make any Arizona players ineligible now ?

I guess it's possible. The NCAA will likely have their own investigation with repercussions as well I imagine.

 

[TJ]

http://www.businessinsider.com/college-basketball-bribery-scandal-arrests-2017-9?r=UK&IR=T


So will this make any Arizona players ineligible now ?

Couple of things I gathered from the brief:

1) Book went rogue on this
2) If there was a payment to a player, he’s not on this roster. Think it might be Quinerly
3) Louisville is likely to be the school impacted the most from all of this

 

[overseascardfan]

Damn, KEN has been accused of this for years under Teflon John and they are not involved?

 

[Dback Jon]

You must be registered for see images

Dwayne Head‏@DHead_GGSN
Replying to @JasonScheer @StrykerAndrews
Player 5 is Jahvon Quinerly based on the docs. Says Book paid his mother 15K and he committed on or around 8/9/2017.

 

[GatorAZ]

Aaaand that's a wrap.

 

[Russ Smith]

Do we know anything about the Arizona coach that will be charged with fraud and corruption today?

This is fascinating to me because as everyone knows message boards constantly have rumors of other teams cheating but BRO has had a persistent rumor for 2 years now that Bland and Book were cheating and had been called out by other coaches to the NCAA and it is a big reason why we've been so puzzled that UA and USC were killing it in recruiting. If we were hearing the rumors on BRO, surely the kids being recruited were too?

The irony here is one of the kids is Bowen who UA boards were all calling "sketchy" because his recruitment was so odd, but it turns out he got paid to go to Louisville.

On Book, if people recall he took a "leave of absence" a couple of years back, at the time the rumors on BRO were rampant that he had a substance abuse issue, don't know if it was alcohol or drugs or what, but that UA essentially suspended him but they wanted to keep him because he's such a good recruiter.

We have an "insider" on BRO who many years ago was involved in an NCAA investigation with Sean Higgins when he claimed a booster offered him free housing at his house in the room Reggie Miller used to live in. The NCAA cleared the booster he had detailed documentation proving Miller was paying rent, above market actually(it was a pool side room with no AC) but UCLA got dinged because the guy had met with Higgins during his recruitment. That guy still posts on BRO, he was one of the guys telling us outright that it was well known that Book and Bland were involved in rule breaking.

The other rumor that's not addressed here and not really related was that Stanley Johnson was fully planning on staying at UA for his sophomore year until he got into a car accident. The car he was driving was "arranged" by a UA booster, and they decided the only way to get out of it without that coming out was to have Johnson turn pro. I've never known if that was true it doesn't totally make sense, turning pro after the accident wouldn't make the car not be a violation if it happened, but that has been a rumor on BRO ever since he went pro. Note USC was widely accused of offering him cash during his recruitment.

 

[Russ Smith]

http://www.businessinsider.com/college-basketball-bribery-scandal-arrests-2017-9?r=UK&IR=T


So will this make any Arizona players ineligible now ?

I haven't read the link yet but if there's clear evidence kids got paid then yes they will be ineligible. The NCAA usually allows them to repay the money and lifts the suspension after say 9 games but it depends on how much is involved.

It also depends on exactly what the NCAA decides to do here. Remember this is just the start, I fully expect more coaches and more programs to get caught up in this. as they start talking to people they're going to offer deals to get more info and more names will come out. When I read the CBS story they mentioned Adidas and I immediately assumed Shabazz Muhammad, it turned out to be Brian Bowen. I would venture to say there's not a top basketball school in the country that hasn't had some of this go on(including UCLA) and the ones that don't come up will just be lucky.

The cynic in me says the ones they caught were the most active but it may be as simple as they were just unlucky.

 

[Dback Jon]

I fully expect most top BB schools to be touched at some point, especially if the investigation gives reason to go after the other shoe companies.


AAU basketball, and recruiting has been dirty for decades. Time to blow the whole thing up. Start with declaring AAU teams pro, thus ineligible for the NCAA.

 

[Russ Smith]

Couple of things I gathered from the brief:

1) Book went rogue on this
2) If there was a payment to a player, he’s not on this roster. Think it might be Quinerly
3) Louisville is likely to be the school impacted the most from all of this

With all due respect TJ I call BS on number one. These kids get paid, we all know that. And every school recruiting these kids plays some games, including Arizona, and UCLA. if Book paid a kid 15K it likely came from money he got in bribes for steering players to agents, and it's highly unlikely that it was just one kid. I also don't buy for a second that Miller didn't know Book was bending the rules to get some of these kids.

Did he know he paid a kid 15K in cash, no idea, but did he know his recruiter was pushing the envelope absolutely. These coaches get paid to win and assistants get paid to recruit and to do that at this level, you have to do this stuff. I'm not saying UA is any better or worse at this than anybody else, as this story grows I'd be quite surprised if UCLA, Oregon and other Pac 12 programs aren't involved too, but I highly doubt this is a case of Book going rogue.

Remember I've pointed this out for years, UA at one point had a pipeline to the Oakland Soldiers, who are co founded by NBA agent Calvin Andrews, who was the agent suspended by the NBA for a year for paying OJ Mayo when he was in HS. Anybody who knows anything about the Soldiers knows there's financial advisers connected to them. So when the articles say Book was taking bribes to steer kids to agents and advisers, that screams to me Oakland Soldiers.

I'm not saying Miller instructed him to do this but I seriously doubt Miller had no idea Book was paying kids, he may not have known the source of the money but again we've been hearing that rumor on BRO for 2 years about him and Bland.

 

[Russ Smith]

FYI I should add there's a big reddit thread on this, according to that, Pasternack was involved too, he has since left UA but there's a reference to a money guy calling a coach who was then at Arizona in March, but isn't there now, that has to be Pasternack he took the UCSB job late March.

 

[Russ Smith]

DeAnthony Melton of USC another player who got paid, allegedly got 4K in cash from Tony Bland.Bland apparently got 13K from one agent that he distributed to multiple kids, one of whom is a freshman at USC this year which people are speculating is Charles O'Bannon Jr.

 

[TJ]

This is fascinating to me because as everyone knows message boards constantly have rumors of other teams cheating but BRO has had a persistent rumor for 2 years now that Bland and Book were cheating and had been called out by other coaches to the NCAA and it is a big reason why we've been so puzzled that UA and USC were killing it in recruiting. If we were hearing the rumors on BRO, surely the kids being recruited were too?

The irony here is one of the kids is Bowen who UA boards were all calling "sketchy" because his recruitment was so odd, but it turns out he got paid to go to Louisville.

On Book, if people recall he took a "leave of absence" a couple of years back, at the time the rumors on BRO were rampant that he had a substance abuse issue, don't know if it was alcohol or drugs or what, but that UA essentially suspended him but they wanted to keep him because he's such a good recruiter.

We have an "insider" on BRO who many years ago was involved in an NCAA investigation with Sean Higgins when he claimed a booster offered him free housing at his house in the room Reggie Miller used to live in. The NCAA cleared the booster he had detailed documentation proving Miller was paying rent, above market actually(it was a pool side room with no AC) but UCLA got dinged because the guy had met with Higgins during his recruitment. That guy still posts on BRO, he was one of the guys telling us outright that it was well known that Book and Bland were involved in rule breaking.

The other rumor that's not addressed here and not really related was that Stanley Johnson was fully planning on staying at UA for his sophomore year until he got into a car accident. The car he was driving was "arranged" by a UA booster, and they decided the only way to get out of it without that coming out was to have Johnson turn pro. I've never known if that was true it doesn't totally make sense, turning pro after the accident wouldn't make the car not be a violation if it happened, but that has been a rumor on BRO ever since he went pro. Note USC was widely accused of offering him cash during his recruitment.

The FBI indicated that assistants were concealing bribes and seemed to have indicated that they did so without the institution knowing. If Miller was involved, shame on him, but I have reason to believe that because Book was taking cash on the side, Miller wasn't aware of most, or all, of Book's actions.

 

[Russ Smith]

This could be really interesting before it all is done. It now looks like USC paid DeAnthony Melton and Charles O'Bannon, and there's some innuendo they also paid, or attempted to pay, Marvin Bagley.

And the worst one so far IMO is Merl Code. he was the director of the NIKE EYBL league, and then he was hired away by Adidas. he's named multiple times in the investigation, both for taking bribes to funnel kids from the EYBL, and he was one of the people directly involved in "selling" Bowen to Louisville. So he was cheating at Nike and then adidas hired him and he cheated to get a kid to an Adidas school. that implies whoever hired him at Adidas was well aware of what he was doing at Nike.