Lou's Views #2: Dbacks Should Bid Farewell To Melvin & Coaching Staff

[FinleyLover]

I think Gracey still needs some time and experience before he is cut loose with the reins. That being said, someday I think he could be a good manager. For next year, it seems as though this offseason brought about a large shuffle, so no telling who would be contractually available. Anyone know of some possibilities?

 

[BC867]

Mark Grace refused the D'backs offer to manage in the Minor Leagues.

Until he does that, and shows himself, and everyone else, whether he'd be good at it, or not, I don't believe he should be considered for the Major League level.

It's not a question of paying dues. It's more a case of determining if he is Managerial material.

 

[FinleyLover]

Does he think it'b beneath him to manage in the minors?

 

[KingLouieLouie]

I think Gracey still needs some time and experience before he is cut loose with the reins. That being said, someday I think he could be a good manager. For next year, it seems as though this offseason brought about a large shuffle, so no telling who would be contractually available. Anyone know of some possibilities?

Quite frankly...Mark Grace would be the worst candidate to become the Dbacks manager.....

First, he would become too "buddy, buddy" with the veterans (although not too many remain from his 3 seasons in the Dbacks uniform) which was a major downfall of Brenly and is currently the case w/Melvin...

Also, Grace would probably constantly clash with the younger players and lose total patience with them...What suggests that is his comments regarding Chris Snyder during that one telecast last season...True, that wasnt meant to be broadcasted on the airwaves, but if he was really concerned about Snyder's approach, he would have taken into his own power to try to help Snyder make the proper adjustments... Unfortunately, Grace was making some snide comments behind Snyder's back (well..was meant to be).....

Grace doesnt possess that full demeanor to be a manager of a team that will be in a youth movment by next season....He doesnt seem as astute at the game..or if at all serious...Not someone you would want to pattern your players after....

The ideal candidates I listed earlier make better sense... Matt Willams, Will Clark, Kirk Gibson, Brett Butler, Dave Collins, and Hal McRae....

I think that there was a reason why Butler was re-assigned a coaching role in the Dbacks farm-system...He would be the perfect NL manager since he specialized in small-ball and knows the fundamentals... At least now he's getting a chance to become familiar with the Dbacks players at the Minor League level and begin forming bonds with players at the Major League level as well.....

It doesnt seem that Melvin would be retained...The Dbacks havent discussed giving him a contract extension... and if they do get off to a horrible start, I wouldnt be soo shocked that he will be immediately terminated... He's already in a lame-duck situation as is....

I dont know if Price was the ideal hire for pitching coach since he didnt do much wonders in Seattle... Tinsley was a welcomed addition and perhaps they might groom him as an eventual manager as well....

They just need someone with a staunch aggressiveness..a hard-liner as a manager who has the astute knowledge and awareness of the basic fundamentals of the game which appears to be the areas in which Grace lacks in.... However, that's where Matt Williams or Brett Butler comes into play and I hope Moorad and Co. make a wise choice and hire one of the latter 2..someone with all those attributes and more....

 

[FinleyLover]

Quite frankly...Mark Grace would be the worst candidate to become the Dbacks manager.....

First, he would become too "buddy, buddy" with the veterans (although not too many remain from his 3 seasons in the Dbacks uniform) which was a major downfall of Brenly and is currently the case w/Melvin...

Also, Grace would probably constantly clash with the younger players and lose total patience with them...What suggests that is his comments regarding Chris Snyder during that one telecast last season...True, that wasnt meant to be broadcasted on the airwaves, but if he was really concerned about Snyder's approach, he would have taken into his own power to try to help Snyder make the proper adjustments... Unfortunately, Grace was making some snide comments behind Snyder's back (well..was meant to be).....

Grace doesnt possess that full demeanor to be a manager of a team that will be in a youth movment by next season....He doesnt seem as astute at the game..or if at all serious...Not someone you would want to pattern your players after....

The ideal candidates I listed earlier make better sense... Matt Willams, Will Clark, Kirk Gibson, Brett Butler, Dave Collins, and Hal McRae....

I think that there was a reason why Butler was re-assigned a coaching role in the Dbacks farm-system...He would be the perfect NL manager since he specialized in small-ball and knows the fundamentals... At least now he's getting a chance to become familiar with the Dbacks players at the Minor League level and begin forming bonds with players at the Major League level as well.....

It doesnt seem that Melvin would be retained...The Dbacks havent discussed giving him a contract extension... and if they do get off to a horrible start, I wouldnt be soo shocked that he will be immediately terminated... He's already in a lame-duck situation as is....

I dont know if Price was the ideal hire for pitching coach since he didnt do much wonders in Seattle... Tinsley was a welcomed addition and perhaps they might groom him as an eventual manager as well....

They just need someone with a staunch aggressiveness..a hard-liner as a manager who has the astute knowledge and awareness of the basic fundamentals of the game which appears to be the areas in which Grace lacks in.... However, that's where Matt Williams or Brett Butler comes into play and I hope Moorad and Co. make a wise choice and hire one of the latter 2..someone with all those attributes and more....

You know, I forgot about that comment he made about Snyder- I agree that if he is future management material, his thinking should be along the lines of what's needed for a player to help him improve, instead of taking personal swipes at him.

 

[cardsfan22]

Grace would make a great Manager. He played the game the way it was ment to be played. He played in Chicago for a long time with a bunch of youngsters and if anyone know how to rebuild it would be grace(he did for about a decade----more or less)Baseball is not football. I am not one of those people that think you need a Hard line manager.I am not a big Melvin fan but if players cant play the game because there coach is not jumping all over the place and is not a big ra ra guy, that is the front office bringing in a bunch of chumps who need a nanny.

and lets not forget what kind of player he was. He was on one of the worst teams in baseball for more then a decade, and all he did was lead the decade of the 90's in hits---he never quit or complained about nothing----He just played the game. That's something i think a bunch of young players need to learn about.

and whats wrong with being buddy buddy with your players?????You think Grace would not say something to a player if he was slacking off?

and i dont know what he said about snyder, but come on, who was not saying a bunch or crap about Snyder? How many pitches does he need to see that are 2 ft of the plate to know they are going to pitch you there and you need to be ready. he may be the worst bat i have seen play for the d-backs

 

[FinleyLover]

The comment about Snyder was dead on, but what we having issues with is the appropriateness of those comments and the possibility of the mike being live. Wasn't very professional. This wasn't the first time that he made inappropriate comments when he thought the mike was off. I have heard him referring to female fans in the stands on several occasions and glad that my boys weren't sitting in the room at the time...

 

[Djaughe]

I wish W. Backman would be given a shot to manage this team.

 

[KingLouieLouie]

Well... I believe it's time to review this thread and I am certain we will with such frequency...

True.. the Dbacks are 1-1, but most of us still questions Melvin..especially in his overall reluctance to play younger players (IE Conor Jackson).....

If the Dbacks do plan on going into that much needed youth movement, it is quite obvious that Melvin will be removed by then... Of course.. the eternal question is as always.. who will replace him?

I have a feeling that Melvin will be dismissed by June and Carlos Tosca will serve as the interim manager to finish off the season.. then next year.. they'll hire an up-and-comer to be hired on permanent basis... I still am leaning toward either Will Clark or Matt Williams... it will be interesting to see how this all unfolds throughout the season.....

 

[devilfan02]

I posted this in the Dbacks/Rockies thread and figured I'd put it in this thread as well. I'm sick of Melvin. KLL, I'm with you, lets try and make this forum more entertaining. I'll try and come up with some ideas.


Call me crazy but did anyone else question Melvin using Andy Green and Eric Byrnes as pinch hitters???????? Why would you not use Connor Jackson???? I would even rather see Easley or Snyder (even though he can't hit to save his life but does have power if a miracle happens) get an opportunity. I am so sick of Connor Jackson rarely being used. We have only played one game and had a day off before today so the "rest" card won't work. What is Melvins reluctance to use him???? UGHHHHHHH

'06 MELVINS LAST YEAR

 

[FinleyLover]

Yeah, it's almost like he has something against CJ. On the second day he's sitting???????? What the hell is going on? All this talk about starting him and only using Clark occasionally or off the bench is already BS.
This could be an extremely looooooong season watching Clarabell make one bone headed move after another. I have already yelled at the TV and it's only the second day of the season...
If he destroys our youth from his mismanagement, I'll throttle him personally.

 

[AZZenny]

On radio pregame he defended his decision to play Clark -- said it was a rare situation where a switch-hitter made sense and CJ would get at least 2 of the next 3 games -- which didn't appease me at all, but he said all that without being asked, so you know he's on the hot seat.

 

[HooverDam]

I would like to submit my resume for the position of manager of the Arizona Diamondbacks.

In EA Sports MVP 06, I've managed the Air Force Falcons for 6 seasons. I've lead them to back to back College World Series Championships, as well as for Conference Championships in 6 seasons. I've found talent all over the virtual country and developed it well.

In MVP 05, I managed the virtua- D'Backs, brought on the youth movement and led them to three straight winning seasons and a World Series Championship (with Brandon Webb pitching a no hitter in the World Series).

Clearly, I have the patience and know how to develop young talent and lead them to victory. Or I can at least do that as much as Bob Melvin can.

 

[devilfan02]

I would like to submit my resume for the position of manager of the Arizona Diamondbacks.

In EA Sports MVP 06, I've managed the Air Force Falcons for 6 seasons. I've lead them to back to back College World Series Championships, as well as for Conference Championships in 6 seasons. I've found talent all over the virtual country and developed it well.

In MVP 05, I managed the virtua- D'Backs, brought on the youth movement and led them to three straight winning seasons and a World Series Championship (with Brandon Webb pitching a no hitter in the World Series).

Clearly, I have the patience and know how to develop young talent and lead them to victory. Or I can at least do that as much as Bob Melvin can.

HA! If Melvin could turn on the Playstation, which I don't think he's smart enough to do, I think his head would blow up if he had any young talent on his virtual team.

"A 23 year old with major upside, WTF should I do??"
-Bob Melvin

 

[The Commish]

I agree Melvin is weak. I don't think he is a Byrnes guy and to be honest, I don't think this organization really wanted Bob in the first place. The more I look back at the Wally Backman saga, the more I wish this organization had the balls to just stand up and say that Backman was their man. It would have been easy to spin if you think about it. Simply state, "We were aware of Wally's incidents in the past and we fully stand behind him in his persuits to better himself as a person. Now he is one hell of a manager and he is our guy for the next few years". Instead they looked completely incompetant and really damaged the face of the organization.

Though I think this organization knows exactly what they are doing when it comes to Melvin this season. If you think about it it's perfect. Hire a boring guy that everyone likes personally but absolutely hates professionally. When our team sucks we can simply let him go and let the blame rest somewhat with him. At that point when our team has long since lost hope of making the playoffs you suddenly say that you are rebuiling for next year. That's when you trade away all of your assets and deadweight (*coughcough* Green and Gonzo) and let the youngsters play.

Melvin doesn't make it til the end of the year. I think most of us agree on that. All of the moves Byrnes have made have been the right ones, so I trust that he will know what type of manager to hire.

If Melvin had just a little more personality than Alan Greenspan then he wouldn't seem so bad.

By the way, how is that MVP '06? I refuse to buy 2k6 and I need to get my baseball fix in.

 

[HooverDam]

I
By the way, how is that MVP '06? I refuse to buy 2k6 and I need to get my baseball fix in.

Its college teams, so its different. But I like the college game a lot, so its neat. Its sort of an incomplete, rushed game. Most teams dont have their stadiums in the game (though ASU and UofA do). The have a really neat batting system that involves using the right trigger in a lock and load fashion. I also like the way you throw to the bases w/ the right analog stick, at first it was tough, but it makes it more realistic. Try renting it first, or wait until next years game when they have all the stadiums in and the game is more fully featured.

Its too bad EA lost the MLB license, rumor had it that they were working on a game that would allow you to play NCAA, A, AA, AAA, and MLB all in the same game.

 

[CardsFan222]

I hope everyone is joking!!!!!!!!

If not................THEN GET HELP!!!!!!!!!!

if you are going to ride the guy for winning a ball game then this room is not as smart as i thought it was

 

[devilfan02]

I hope everyone is joking!!!!!!!!

If not................THEN GET HELP!!!!!!!!!!

if you are going to ride the guy for winning a ball game then this room is not as smart as i thought it was

 

[FinleyLover]

Well just to defend my(our)selves a little- we are already seeing the same pattern as last season (which was not all that good if you recall), with him. I was really hoping that with all the kids now there, he would have no choice but to play them on a regular basis, and things would be different from last season. So far, not the case. Guess we are just a bit nervous and tense.

Don't get me wrong, I feel very strongly that we need veteran presence and leadership, but to let the kids sit and lose their confidence and momentum from the incredible ST is just a crime.

His personal style of being very quiet and somber is the very LAST thing this team needs. They need the passion and spark and enthuasiam that he so sorely lacks.

 

[KingLouieLouie]

Well.. I must bump this old thread up since the subject has been brought-up again, however, I wont merge that thread at the moment....

The Tigers have proven this year how much a fiery manager means to a team... They dont have much of a different personnel this season, however, Leyland's approach as worked wonders....... Therefore.. the.... still "what ifs" begin to surface regarding if Backman didnt subject himself to those off-the-field controversies.. he would have been ideal.....

The Dbacks currently are just playing thru the motions.... they seem like zombies out there... mainly because Melvin still seldom takes any accountability.. never lits any type of fire......

With this franchises current stance and reaction against ineptness of any nature.. expect Melvin to be terminated by mid-July..especially around the time when they will promote-up most of their uber prospects...

Carlos Tosca will be the interim manager for the rest of the season and Chip Hale might be promoted as the 3rd base coach to make some of those prospects he coached at Tucson's transition somewhat easier....

If Tosca impresses, he will be get a 2-yr contract to manage to the Dbacks.. otherwise.. they certainly will go outside the organization......

Melvin is in a lame-duck situaiton and the players know how to exploit it..... however... he definitely wont last the season..especially since he hasnt received any form of vote of confidence.. or that no contract negotiations have begun to extend him further....

 

[Dback Jon]

Bob Melvin needs to go - now.

 

[BC867]

"Little" Bob Melvin is still trapped in his "little" "trying" world.

It's June 22 and here's the quote he gave to the Az. Republic.

Yeah, we flipped it up today a little bit, just trying to shake off the cobwebs and trying to get a different look. It's a little bit more of a dramatic change ... But we're just trying to mix it up because we're in a bad little period here, and we're trying to shuffle the deck.

ZZZZZZZZZZZ!

The Manager has set a low ceiling on enthusisiam. He sets the tone. His team will never show any more emotion than what he's capable of.

I hope he is removed before we bring up a prospect or they, too, will hit that ceiling and start their Major League career in a coma.

 

[KingLouieLouie]

"Little" Bob Melvin is still trapped in his "little" "trying" world.

It's June 22 and here's the quote he gave to the Az. Republic.



ZZZZZZZZZZZ!

The Manager has set a low ceiling on enthusisiam. He sets the tone. His team will never show any more emotion than what he's capable of.

I hope he is removed before we bring up a prospect or they, too, will hit that ceiling and start their Major League career in a coma.

I guarantee that he will be terminated if the Dbacks fall 10 games below .500... Because that is when the youth movement will finally begin and it's long overdue.....

The Dbacks cannot afford to continue to delude themselves in believing that theyre a contending team..... This is when they begin to explore/gague interests in what other teams might have toward Luis Gonzalez, Shawn Green (which I know obviously not too many teams would be keen on picking-up his contract, but the Dbacks might be inclined to cover most of it), Eric Byrnes, and Tony Clark....

The management is willing to pick-up most of those contracts since they will be paying for at least the next couple of seasons their prospects the ML minimal such as Quentin, Young, and whatever other pitching prospects they decide to promote.... Provide those players exposure to the ML and then invest heavily in the FA pitching market and this team will be lethal...

Of course though... we all know that Melvin will not be able to handle such a youthful influx, which he has demonstrated time and time again....

I just despise those comments about "little" and "trying"... just seems to be detached and really over his head at the moment.... No vote of confidence from anyone.... nothing whatsoever... he will be gone soon enough and good riddance.....

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Come on Lou. Tony Clark? Gonzalez? Shawn Green? There's no way we get anything for these has-beens. We should have traded Clark last summer during a fluke year that was obvious to nobody except myself and Zenny but we decided to extend him making him untradeable unless we eat a couple million more dollars. Gonzo and Green combined would probably cost us about $15 million in cash in order to get teams talking to us about marginal prospects and that's even if teams inquire about them at all.

This isn't the late 90s anymore, teams simply do not want to add payroll these days unless it's for impact players which these bums stopped being being years ago. Essentially every team in MLB could find someone in their minor leagues who can play mediocre defense and provide similar "production" as those guys while only paying them 300k a year.

Let's face facts here - it's going to take more than one offseason to repair the mess that Joe Jr, Matt Williams, and Moorad laid on this team. I'm willing to give Byrnes his time. His reputation has been nothing short of sterling at every stop prior to Arizona so we should all exercise some patience and wish the guy luck. He's going to need it as this organization has been in a downward spiral since October 2001.

 

[KingLouieLouie]

Come on Lou. Tony Clark? Gonzalez? Shawn Green? There's no way we get anything for these has-beens. We should have traded Clark last summer during a fluke year that was obvious to nobody except myself and Zenny but we decided to extend him making him untradeable unless we eat a couple million more dollars. Gonzo and Green combined would probably cost us about $15 million in cash in order to get teams talking to us about marginal prospects and that's even if teams inquire about them at all. This isn't the late 90s anymore, teams simply do not want to add payroll these days unless it's for impact players which these bums stopped being being years ago.

Let's face facts here - it's going to take more than one offseason to repair the mess that Joe Jr, Matt Williams, and Moorad laid on this team. I'm willing to give Byrnes his time. His reputation has been nothing short of sterling at every stop prior to Arizona so we should all exercise some patience and wish the guy luck. He's going to need it as this organization has been in a downward spiral since October 2001.

The Dbacks have proven recently that eating contracts isnt a major concern of theirs... and what must be taken into consideration is that they will be paying whatever prospects they promote (Quentin and Young) the ML mininum..... Also.... some times teams are willing to overlook a player's contract out of desperation if they're in a pennant chase.. have lost a crucial player due to a season-ending injury and must occupy that void....

Clark is suffering from what I pointed-out in the other thread that somewhat is the reason why Gonzalez has been struggling.. he's not receiving as good of pitch selection since they're not surrounded by any legit power hitters... that's the difference Glaus made in his albeit brief time, but not like Im inferring they should have kept Glaus either.....

It's the lack of power the really has affected this team.. players being called upon to go out of their usual element.... This where the manager must adjust accordingly to his player's strengths/abilities, but unfortunately Melvin is obviously unable to do so......

Regarding Josh Byrnes... he's done an impressive job thus far and I look forward to see what deals he'll pull off at the deadline.....I just wouldnt rule out a team willing to take on Gonzo and Green.. especially a team that might be at their final opportunity to win..and are willing to win at all costs...