Kyler's inability to throw on the run is a real issue

[SoonerLou]

Watched every snap in college. The ball dies when he's rolling out. Doesnt generate juice.

Its why a guy so athletic doesnt have have that many rollouts or scramble plays to find wrs.

Can you recall a time he created something in and out of the pocket and just ripped it for a first down? I'm not sure.

Dont get me wrong he's made first down throws while rolling out, etc. I'm talking overly impressive "How did he make that throw?!" type plays.

Its why the ball was behind on Hopkins on that one play.


I'm not TOO concerned about the ints...yet.

1st one...tipped on a great play by Greenlaw.
2nd one...Hopkins runs the wrong route which leads the safety to the ball.
3rd one...pressure up the middle....ball bounces of the tip of a wrs hands. It happens.

The last two were purely because of his inability to throw on the run. He could have moved around and found someone open. Instead he forces it to Fitz. Obviously the Hopkins play as well as it just doesnt have real zip.


He just doesnt make the Lamar Jackson, Mahomes and early Russell Wilson plays to cover for his inexperience.

With the pace and tempo when Kyler scrambles there should passes downfield to open wrs. Its not because as of now he just cant scramble and rip it.

He had a bad game. It sucks, but it happens. However, if he's EVER going to be great and overcome his height issue he needs to be able to make throws on the run.

 

[dscher]

Smaller guy thing imo. He will never be amazing at it. I think Russell is about the only shorter QB that can do it with incredible accuracy.

 

[Covert Rain]

Four picks in two weeks. It should have been 5. That is a scary thought. He looks like on some of these throws he is trying to make something happen.

IMO if Murray feels like he needs to make something happen I would rather him do it with his feet verses his arm until his judgement improves.

Willing to chalk it up to a bad game but he sure played like a young 2nd year QB.

 

[Broseph]

TBH I could make a lot of the throws Lamar Jackson does behind that offensive line of his.

 

[kerouac9]

I have no real concerns about Kyler Murray’s physical ability to put the ball where he wants it.

 

[Germz249]

Lets trade K1, Jones, Fitz, Hop, Simmons, Baker and everyone.. Fire KK and SK.. Start the rebuild..

 

[Chopper0080]

I have no real concerns about Kyler Murray’s physical ability to put the ball where he wants it.

Agreed. He will need to learn more patience and understand what game he needs to play to win each individual game. Today he didn't need to be an MVP, he just needed to take the easy throws and march down the field. He got impatient and tried to push when he didn't have to.

 

[SoonerLou]

Smaller guy thing imo. He will never be amazing at it. I think Russell is about the only shorter QB that can do it with incredible accuracy.

The major difference between him and Russ physically is that Kyler has way shorter arms. Russell's longer arms allows for him to create enough force and throw from non comfortable spots on the field.

Kyler's shorter arms are part of the reason he has such an amazingly quick release. However, for him that only works when his feet are set in the pocket. When his feet are off or not generating power his arm falters.

 

[dscher]

The major difference between him and Russ physically is that Kyler has way shorter arms. Russell's longer arms allows for him to create enough force and throw from non comfortable spots on the field.

Kyler's shorter arms are part of the reason he has such an amazingly quick release. However, for him that only works when his feet are set in the pocket. When his feet are off or not generating power his arm falters.

We all knew this about Kyler from the start. Russell is a freak of nature. Long arms, big hands, and that short compact body(that can withstand hits and injury). Kyler just needs time to figure his strengths out. Russell had these hiccups at times when he was young as well. It will come. Imo

 

[Russ Smith]

The major difference between him and Russ physically is that Kyler has way shorter arms. Russell's longer arms allows for him to create enough force and throw from non comfortable spots on the field.

Kyler's shorter arms are part of the reason he has such an amazingly quick release. However, for him that only works when his feet are set in the pocket. When his feet are off or not generating power his arm falters.

per google Kyler 28.5 inches arm length, Wilson 31. I guess that's 10% but I don't really think you get velocity from arm length I think it comes more from the overall motion. I think the key is that when Wilson moves in the pocket, as Romo was saying early today in the game he worked, Wilson steps up or moves, and then resets before he throws. Kyler going left is much better than going right, for whatever reason when he goes right he almost always throws it, when he goes left he often runs it. I think teams figured that out, I was saying it about 5 weeks in last year. So I think when he scrambles right they know he's going to throw.

He has to work on that and he has to make better reads.

2 really bad picks today and nearly another one, the first one was high due to pressure right in his face but IMO still a ball Arnold could have caught.

What I liked today is he didn't get scared, drop by Johnson then a pick, he went right back out and played. Throws a pick to Hopkins next drive goes back to him multiple times. What I didn't like is he kept forcing balls.

People who say he's not really progressing I don't buy. How many times has he run backwards this year, maybe once?

If you consider how little he actually played in college his rookie year on what was a horrible team the year before was quite good. Compare to Wilson who took over a team that won 7 games with Tarvaris Jackson at QB and a young up and coming defense. Wilson was a huge reason they were so good but they had an elite defense and a great run game. First 2 years really good, third year down a bit but the team was so good he didn't have to carry the offense, then 4th year on spectacular. And Wilson played way more in college than Murray did so he came in more polished.

I don't know if he'll ever be as good as Wilson, he needs to learn to step up reset and throw, but as badly as he played today he still is a very good young QB. Wilson was on teams where he didn't have to take lots of chances the defense was so good, Kyler has more to worry about because our defense isn't as good, I think he needs to figure out that means be MORE careful sometimes not less

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

The major difference between him and Russ physically is that Kyler has way shorter arms. Russell's longer arms allows for him to create enough force and throw from non comfortable spots on the field.

Kyler's shorter arms are part of the reason he has such an amazingly quick release. However, for him that only works when his feet are set in the pocket. When his feet are off or not generating power his arm falters.

That and Wilson is calm, cool and collected and much more fundamentally sound than Kyler.

 

[kerouac9]

People who say he's not really progressing I don't buy. How many times has he run backwards this year, maybe once?

thats fine, but pressure wasn’t really coming in his face. The problem was that Kyler was throwing balls high the entire first and second quarter. It wasn’t bad reads; it was something with his technique

 

[BullheadCardFan]

thats fine, but pressure wasn’t really coming in his face. The problem was that Kyler was throwing balls high the entire first and second quarter. It wasn’t bad reads; it was something with his technique

He was also throwing behind the receivers which puts them in a bad position.

 

[phillycard]

In addition he also throws high way too many times. With him being so short, I'm baffled. Even on a lot of the completions, receivers are extending to the max to bring the ball in. The man's got a cannon, but his touch in certain situations could stand improvement.

 

[Dr. Jones]

Kyler's interceptions this year are, at least to me, a bit concerning.

2 deflected balls - No issue here. It happens.

3 over the middle of the field...... I see these as all being part of the same overall problem. He's not seeing all of the robbers and safety help within his line of sight.

Watching him throw outside of the hash marks continues to be a sight to behold. The work with Nuk, the TD's to Andy, and many of his truly spectacular throws have been outside of the hashes.

He needs to do a better job diagnosing what is going on in between the hash marks, and reducing the amount of lazy interceptions because he can't see the safety biting up.

Remember...... This kid is still learning, but this was easily a bottom 5 game for him in the NFL so far. And we still probably could have won it. In short: the sky is not falling.

Something I am done with....... Keesean Johnson getting good playing time at WR. He's below the mean for an NFL quality WR IMO.

 

[phillycard]

Something I am done with....... Keesean Johnson getting good playing time at WR. He's below the mean for an NFL quality WR IMO.

Agreed. I trust Sherfeld more at this point. Kee has regressed horribly.

 

[SoonerLou]

Kyler's interceptions this year are, at least to me, a bit concerning.

2 deflected balls - No issue here. It happens.

3 over the middle of the field...... I see these as all being part of the same overall problem. He's not seeing all of the robbers and safety help within his line of sight.

Watching him throw outside of the hash marks continues to be a sight to behold. The work with Nuk, the TD's to Andy, and many of his truly spectacular throws have been outside of the hashes.

He needs to do a better job diagnosing what is going on in between the hash marks, and reducing the amount of lazy interceptions because he can't see the safety biting up.

Remember...... This kid is still learning, but this was easily a bottom 5 game for him in the NFL so far. And we still probably could have won it. In short: the sky is not falling.

Something I am done with....... Keesean Johnson getting good playing time at WR. He's below the mean for an NFL quality WR IMO.

Basically gone two weeks because of Covid and suddenly gets 7 targets. No idea why.

High passes could be trying to compensate for tipped passes at the LOS.

 

[Russ Smith]

According to ESPN, Detroit played man about 82% of the plays the first 2 weeks, only 55% yesterday. That may have had something to do with Kyler being confused they were expecting more man?

 

[SoonerLou]

Kyler's interceptions this year are, at least to me, a bit concerning.

2 deflected balls - No issue here. It happens.

3 over the middle of the field...... I see these as all being part of the same overall problem. He's not seeing all of the robbers and safety help within his line of sight.

Watching him throw outside of the hash marks continues to be a sight to behold. The work with Nuk, the TD's to Andy, and many of his truly spectacular throws have been outside of the hashes.

He needs to do a better job diagnosing what is going on in between the hash marks, and reducing the amount of lazy interceptions because he can't see the safety biting up.

Remember...... This kid is still learning, but this was easily a bottom 5 game for him in the NFL so far. And we still probably could have won it. In short: the sky is not falling.

Something I am done with....... Keesean Johnson getting good playing time at WR. He's below the mean for an NFL quality WR IMO.

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[dscher]

According to ESPN, Detroit played man about 82% of the plays the first 2 weeks, only 55% yesterday. That may have had something to do with Kyler being confused they were expecting more man?

This is where coaching sucked for the halftime adjustments. They should have been accounted for and fixed.. but they weren't. I was ok with going into half neck and neck. But the team didn't come out attacking the way I thought a well adjusted team would. Coaching. Imo.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Kyler's interceptions this year are, at least to me, a bit concerning.

2 deflected balls - No issue here. It happens.

3 over the middle of the field...... I see these as all being part of the same overall problem. He's not seeing all of the robbers and safety help within his line of sight.

Watching him throw outside of the hash marks continues to be a sight to behold. The work with Nuk, the TD's to Andy, and many of his truly spectacular throws have been outside of the hashes.

He needs to do a better job diagnosing what is going on in between the hash marks, and reducing the amount of lazy interceptions because he can't see the safety biting up.

Remember...... This kid is still learning, but this was easily a bottom 5 game for him in the NFL so far. And we still probably could have won it. In short: the sky is not falling.

Something I am done with....... Keesean Johnson getting good playing time at WR. He's below the mean for an NFL quality WR IMO.

Agreed, Johnson should be buried behind Sherfield. Give more reps to Andy. Bring in a veteran or maybe get Jaron Brown out there. I have zero confidence in Keesean Johnson.

The interception that I thought was really bad was the one to Collins. Kyler had zero awareness on that play. The pick to Okudah I partially blame on Hopkins. He was timid and didn't fight back to the ball. You can let someone step in front of you and steal that ball.

I think the Cardinals need to find another receiver and move on from Kirk. Cut Keesean. Get more snaps to Isabella. Andy should be getting minimum 5 touches a game right now.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Just to echo everyone’s thoughts, I never need to see Keesan on the field for the Cardinals ever again. Dude is not worthy of an NFL roster spot.

 

[Russ Smith]

Not an excuse for Kyler but an interesting thing I heard today from someone who follows the Washington Football team because he lives nearby. There is already talk there that if Haskins doesn't improve dramatically he won't be their QB next year, he went so far as to say people are already saying when was the last time a first round pick QB was just outright cut 2 years later by the team who picked him. We traded Rosen after 1 and he was cut after 2 but not by the team that drafted him.

Apparently the new coaching staff is not impressed so far, they like that he worked hard to lose weight, and they don't think his issue is work ethic, they're just not sure he's ever going to be accurate enough. They didn't draft him they have a new coaching staff. He's under 60% in all 3 games this year. They had to throw more yesterday because they were behind and he threw his first 3 picks of the season. IT was bad enough Rivera had to publicly give him a vote of confidence as people were wondering if Kyle Allen or even Alex Smith might become the QB.

So yes we have growing pains and Murray was not good yesterday, but put in perspective

 

[Harry]

The Cards play design needs to add 2 man games to the rollouts. Edmonds would be an excellent partner; even Daniels. What Murray hasn’t learned to do is pull up and reset. I think he can learn to be effective but the Cards aren’t really developing him in ways that builds his confidence. They need to be tougher with him but design plays giving him a better chance to succeed.

 

[SoonerLou]

Not an excuse for Kyler but an interesting thing I heard today from someone who follows the Washington Football team because he lives nearby. There is already talk there that if Haskins doesn't improve dramatically he won't be their QB next year, he went so far as to say people are already saying when was the last time a first round pick QB was just outright cut 2 years later by the team who picked him. We traded Rosen after 1 and he was cut after 2 but not by the team that drafted him.

Apparently the new coaching staff is not impressed so far, they like that he worked hard to lose weight, and they don't think his issue is work ethic, they're just not sure he's ever going to be accurate enough. They didn't draft him they have a new coaching staff. He's under 60% in all 3 games this year. They had to throw more yesterday because they were behind and he threw his first 3 picks of the season. IT was bad enough Rivera had to publicly give him a vote of confidence as people were wondering if Kyle Allen or even Alex Smith might become the QB.

So yes we have growing pains and Murray was not good yesterday, but put in perspective

Interesting since Rivera was part of the staff that had Haskins and Will Grier ranked ahead of Kyler.