Jalen Smith

[Proximo]

People keep bringing up the "it's never happened before!" excuse. That's pretty old and has no relevance on anything. James Jones and Monty Williams had no confidence in Jalen Smith. IF he continued to be terrible going into next year, what would you have thought then? You'd be all over the front office for doing it.

He has barely played. If they wanted to trade him or get any value for him whatsoever they needed to pick up the third year option. Not doing so basically tells the rest of the NBA we think he is a bust - you don't want him. He had played so little that even if that is what they thought, it's idiotic to tell the rest of the NBA that by declining the option.

Now once you have been proven wrong, nobody can offer him more than 4.7 million next year so why would they want to trade an asset of value for him if they are likely to lose him to free agency.

You can not tell me a 4.7 million dollar contract cannot be moved as a throw in on a trade no matter how bad the player is.

 

[Proximo]

It really is okay to just say “well, looks The FO blew it on this one”. It happens.

In this case no, because there is no reasonable justification.

Blowing it is messing up a draft pick, this is more equivalent to giving the asset away for nothing.

 

[Chaplin]

In this case no, because there is no reasonable justification.

Blowing it is messing up a draft pick, this is more equivalent to giving the asset away for nothing.

It's acknowledging they made a mistake with the pick in the first place.

 

[Cheesebeef]

So not picking up Smith's option shows that Sarver doesn't want to keep the Suns as a contender? You're joking, right?

it's not a black and white issue like you're making it out to be, Chap. to me, it shows he's not willing to spend the money to do everything he can to try and win a title. and it's something we've seen before in the last title run when he was selling draft picks and giving away our best low post defender in KT with 2 first round picks for nothing.

 

[Yuma]

He earned his lack of playing time, he was horrible in practice and not much better in games. And while he rebounded well in summer league, he wasn't very good there either and that was against weak competition.

I hope he continues his current run and recently he's shown enough that I wish we'd extended him but he gave us plenty of reasons to not do so. Just like Josh Jackson, Kendall Marshall and Earl Clark gave us good reason to not offer the 3rd year extension (according to a Realgm poster they were the most recent NBA players to not get their 3rd year extension offer).

I have heard the opposite. Guys like EJ and Chambers hinted he is a good team guy and hard worker in practice, it just wasn't transferring to games. That's why they are so happy to see him achieve now. That makes sense as to why he stuck around so long until now. You can see he is playing more relaxed on offense, FINALLY. I would not say he's made it yet. This season I would not be surprised if he earns a contract offer from the Suns. I just don't think it would be anywhere near what the extension money was for. So it was wise for the Suns to not take that option.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

The one thing I will say is that it appears just about every big they plug in on this team does well. Whether it be Smith, Biyombo, McGee or Ayton they seem to just be plug and play. Obviously they don't all excel to the same level, but they are all playing well on this team.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The one thing I will say is that it appears just about every big they plug in on this team does well. Whether it be Smith, Biyombo, McGee or Ayton they seem to just be plug and play. Obviously they don't all excel to the same level, but they are all playing well on this team.

You can add Frank to that list too.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I have heard the opposite. Guys like EJ and Chambers hinted he is a good team guy and hard worker in practice, it just wasn't transferring to games. That's why they are so happy to see him achieve now. That makes sense as to why he stuck around so long until now. You can see he is playing more relaxed on offense, FINALLY. I would not say he's made it yet. This season I would not be surprised if he earns a contract offer from the Suns. I just don't think it would be anywhere near what the extension money was for. So it was wise for the Suns to not take that option.

Hard worker and good team guy yes, good practice performer no. I think it's clear that everyone on the team, including the coach, like the kid a lot. He was about all we had in summer league yet look at the turnout from Booker, Paul and others to support him.

But the point about his performance in practice was that it wasn't just his limited game time where he fell short, he was doing the same thing in his practice minutes.

 

[Mainstreet]

The one thing I will say is that it appears just about every big they plug in on this team does well. Whether it be Smith, Biyombo, McGee or Ayton they seem to just be plug and play. Obviously they don't all excel to the same level, but they are all playing well on this team.

Monty said something to the effect Chris Paul likes centers who dive to the basket because it opens up the court.

I think this is one of the reasons we are seeing centers have such success in the Suns system.

The Suns need their centers to be a force inside.

 

[Mainstreet]

Maybe it took the Suns being forced to play Smith at center to open eyes.

Most players need to play with confidence and get comfortable on the court before taking the next step. Stix used to look so awkward when he was placed in position where he had to take those corner threes.

It's not that he can't hit the shot but there has to be a level of confidence that comes first.

 

[JCSunsfan]

The Suns would have only been out $4.7 million guaranteed if they had picked up Smith's option next season. It was a short sighted approach by the Suns considering it takes big men longer to develop. Also Smith's contract would have more trade value right now with the option.

With the tax, probably twice that number.

 

[Cheesebeef]

With the tax, probably twice that number.

this is such a totally specious argument. does that mean that Shamet will cost 20 million per year next year since he makes 10 per and we'll be in the tax? No. The number is an accumulation of all the contracts. Saying Stix is going to cost double whatever he signs to ignores that reality.

or better question, so does that mean we shouldn't sign Ayton to a max deal because it will actually be a DOUBLE MAX DEAL with the cap? No. Because that's not how this works.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I am just not convinced about Smith at all. We have seen this with other players--Baynes, Kaminski, Saric, McGee, and now even Biz. They have all had stetches where we have seen this type of hype start to build. Smith might make it in this league. I sincerely doubt he will ever be on a tier above Kaminski or Saric. So I am just not going to get uptight about not extending him.

 

[Chaplin]

this is such a totally specious argument. does that mean that Shamet will cost 20 million per year next year since he makes 10 per and we'll be in the tax? No. The number is an accumulation of all the contracts. Saying Stix is going to cost double whatever he signs to ignores that reality.

Yes Shamets contract is going to be murder next year.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Yes Shamets contract is going to be murder next year.

so, then I guess we shouldn't sign Ayton next year considering he will be a DOUBLE MAX, right? And Cam Johnson will be DOUBLE whatever he signs for.

with that kind of thinking, there's literally no one they can sign.

 

[Chaplin]

so, then I guess we shouldn't sign Ayton next year considering he will be a DOUBLE MAX, right? And Cam Johnson will be DOUBLE whatever he signs for.

with that kind of thinking, there's literally no one they can sign.

That’s changing the goalposts.

 

[95pro]

I am just not convinced about Smith at all. We have seen this with other players--Baynes, Kaminski, Saric, McGee, and now even Biz. They have all had stetches where we have seen this type of hype start to build. Smith might make it in this league. I sincerely doubt he will ever be on a tier above Kaminski or Saric. So I am just not going to get uptight about not extending him.

With you on that. Suns made the wrong call in drafting him and the right call not extending. Live with it and make him serviceable enough for the playoffs IF needed. I doubt he would get minutes anyway considering how Monty for some reason really shortened his lineup in the playoffs.

 

[JCSunsfan]

so, then I guess we shouldn't sign Ayton next year considering he will be a DOUBLE MAX, right? And Cam Johnson will be DOUBLE whatever he signs for.

with that kind of thinking, there's literally no one they can sign.

You know it's not exactly that. It's about juggling the salaries to stay at, or as close to the tax as possible. The place for savings is at the end of the bench. If we want to keep Stix, then other players have to go--one or two of Frank, Saric, Biz, or even JaVale. If we want to dump one or two of those guys to keep Stix, fine. I am not sure it would be wise to let go of JaVale. Biz or Stix? I don't know. Either one I guess.

 

[Proximo]

It's acknowledging they made a mistake with the pick in the first place.

Well they did, but Stix still has some value, value they are now giving away at least a year early.

 

[Mainstreet]

No one is suggesting the Suns go on a spending spree but if the Suns can't afford to extend the 10th pick something is wrong.

I'm tired of the Kurt Thomas type moves. The Suns wouldn't even pay Ayton the max.

Even Robert Sarver said he is willing to pay the luxury tax.


By Dave King Bright Side of the Sun:


“That’s gonna come with the territory here,” Sarver said of paying the luxury tax soon. “I don’t know if that’s next season (2021-22) or the one after that (2022-23), but we know it’s coming. We see ourselves as a taxpayer, and that’s just part of what it’s gonna take to bring home a championship.”


This is an important admission by the owner who actively avoided luxury tax payments during the Nash years. Sure he paid luxury tax in three of those six years, but the ‘overage’ was small each time and the Suns made head-scratching moves to specifically reduce their tax payments. One of those moves was to trade center Kurt Thomas AND a pair of first round picks to rid the team of his 2007-08 salary that could have cost the team almost $20 million after tax calculations.

Suns owner on bringing Paul and Payne back, paying luxury tax, biggest team needs

Phoenix Suns managing partner Robert Sarver talked about the Suns off-season needs and wants

www.brightsideofthesun.com

 

[Proximo]

You can add Frank to that list too.

Which is why I said earlier this year that Jared Allen, or Miles Turner could do 80-90% of the job ayton does at a lot lower contract cost.

Our system - and Chris Paul - is very big man friendly

 

[Proximo]

Yes Shamets contract is going to be murder next year.

Yeah, he is really not earning that deal. He is worse than I expected, and I wasn't expecting a lot.

 

[Cheesebeef]

No one is suggesting the Suns go on a spending spree but if the Suns can't afford to extend the 10th pick something is wrong.

I'm tired of the Kurt Thomas type moves. The Suns wouldn't even pay Ayton the max.

this.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Which is why I said earlier this year that Jared Allen, or Miles Turner could do 80-90% of the job ayton does at a lot lower contract cost.

Our system - and Chris Paul - is very big man friendly

those guys can't defend the way Ayton does all over the court. I've also seen the beginning of an actual offensive game from Ayton that those guys, at older ages, have never developed.

 

[Chaplin]

this.

Doesn’t that lend more credence to the idea that james Jones and Monty simply didn’t like what they saw from the kid?