Guys, help me win this argument

[Joe Mama]

On the ESPN Phoenix Suns message board the other day some guy posted that the best deal ever was the Bo Outlaw trade that supposedly brought the draft pick that the Phoenix Suns used on Amare back to Phoenix. I replied that that is actually a fallacy in something commonly missed reported by the media. I remember that a few people in the sport have shown more than once that the Phoenix Suns already owned at that draft pick regardless of the trade. I just can't find it now, and I can't remember why it was.

I suck at searching the message boards, so I cannot find those threads.

Maybe someone could help me out here.

Joe

 

[Forrestham]

If I remember right, we originally gave up that pick in a sign and trade for Penny Hardaway. We gave up Pat Garrity, Danny Manning and 2 number ones. We swung some kind of a 3 way deal with the clippers and magic when we traded Jed Buechler and Vinny Del Negro and took back Bo Outlaws bad contract. The pick we got back was AMare so we did get the better end of it after getting hosed over Penny

 

[Joe Mama]

If I remember right, we originally gave up that pick in a sign and trade for Penny Hardaway. We gave up Pat Garrity, Danny Manning and 2 number ones. We swung some kind of a 3 way deal with the clippers and magic when we traded Jed Buechler and Vinny Del Negro and took back Bo Outlaws bad contract. The pick we got back was AMare so we did get the better end of it after getting hosed over Penny

actually that is the misunderstanding. The pick the Phoenix Suns got back in that Bo Outlaw deal was NOT the pick used to take Amare. the Phoenix Suns did not have to give the Orlando Magic their 2002 draft pick. If I remember correctly there was something in the original Penny Hardaway sign and trade deal that said the Phoenix Suns had to provide the second of the two pics to Orlando by 2003. Orlando took Phoenix's #18 draft pick in 2001 and sent it to Houston. That meant they owed one more draft pick to Orlando, but they could have waited until 2003 to give it to them.

I know that the Phoenix Suns did not have to make the Bo outlaw trade to keep the #9 2002 draft pick they used on Amare Stoudemire. I was just trying to remember the reason that was.

Joe

 

[arthurracoon]

http://www.arizonasportsfans.com/vb/showthread.php?t=9232&highlight=Orlando

The league will hold a series of tiebreaking coin tosses Monday to determine draft order. The Suns, with a 44-38 record, finished tied with the Boston Celtics for the 16th spot.

The winner of their toss will get the 16th pick in the first round and the loser will get the 17th.

If you think that's not a big deal, consider this:

A year ago, the Suns flipped a coin with the Miami Heat for the No. 9 pick. The Suns won the toss.

Had that not happened, Miami would have drafted Amare Stoudemire at No. 9, as the Suns did. However, the Heat already had a deal arranged to send Stoudemire to the Portland Trail Blazers.

Stoudemire wound up with the Suns and was named Rookie of the Year.

 

[PhxGametime]

I haven't gone through the thread but some member here called Suns office to ask and they said what Joe Mama is saying...

 

[hcsilla]

That meant they owed one more draft pick to Orlando, but they could have waited until 2003 to give it to them.

My understanding of the CBA that they had to wait until 2003 because you can't remain without 1st rounders in future consecutive years. Since the Suns didn't have a 1st rounder in 2001, they had to have one in 2002. That means that they couldn't get back that from ORL in the Outlaw-trade.

(Note: after the JJ-trade they already had one 1st rounder from BOS so they could have get back their 2002 1st from ORL IF the Outlaw-trade would have went down after the JJ-trade.)

 

[sunsfn]

actually that is the misunderstanding. The pick the Phoenix Suns got back in that Bo Outlaw deal was NOT the pick used to take Amare. the Phoenix Suns did not have to give the Orlando Magic their 2002 draft pick. If I remember correctly there was something in the original Penny Hardaway sign and trade deal that said the Phoenix Suns had to provide the second of the two pics to Orlando by 2003. Orlando took Phoenix's #18 draft pick in 2001 and sent it to Houston. That meant they owed one more draft pick to Orlando, but they could have waited until 2003 to give it to them.

I know that the Phoenix Suns did not have to make the Bo outlaw trade to keep the #9 2002 draft pick they used on Amare Stoudemire. I was just trying to remember the reason that was.

Joe

I called the suns 3 times about this pick and always received the same answer. The #9 pick was always the suns.
They did not have to give up a pick until 2003, and that changed with the trade.
The pick they got back from Orlando is the one where they drafted Casey Jacobson.

I also sent many e-mails to Bob Young who wrote an article about the suns and how Bryan Colangelo did this great trade to get back the pick to draft Amare. After a few e-mails he said something like well, I may be wrong.


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[newfan101]

I called the suns 3 times about this pick and always received the same answer. The #9 pick was always the suns.
They did not have to give up a pick until 2003, and that changed with the trade.
The pick they got back from Orlando is the one where they drafted Casey Jacobson.


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Actually, I'm pretty sure Casey was the pick we got from Boston in the Joe Johnson trade. I think the pick we got back from Orlando was our own pick in 2003, which turned out to be Zarko.

 

[hcsilla]

I called the suns 3 times about this pick and always received the same answer. The #9 pick was always the suns.
They did not have to give up a pick until 2003, and that changed with the trade.
The pick they got back from Orlando is the one where they drafted Casey Jacobson.

No, that pick was used on Cabarkapa.

Jacobsen was drafted a year before at BOS' pick.

 

[playstation]

http://www.arizonasportsfans.com/vb/showthread.php?t=9232&highlight=Orlando
A year ago, the Suns flipped a coin with the Miami Heat for the No. 9 pick. The Suns won the toss.

Had that not happened, Miami would have drafted Amare Stoudemire at No. 9, as the Suns did. However, the Heat already had a deal arranged to send Stoudemire to the Portland Trail Blazers.

Stoudemire wound up with the Suns and was named Rookie of the Year.

that means we finally won a meaningful toss in franchise history! amare is no kareem...yet...but a monster slam is a lot more fun than a sky hook!

 

[George O'Brien]

Unless I have been misinformed for years:

Suns pick they used on Amare was protected and would not have to give up
The pick they got from Orlando was used for Carbakapa
The pick they got from Boston along with JJ was used for Casey

 

[sunsfn]

I should have checked my records before posting. Memory?

The pick for Casey Jacobson was from Boston..........

 

[Treesquid PhD]

So in some alternate universe the Suns have a team that features Jerred Jeffries