Discussion in 'Phoenix Suns' started by BC867, Dec 4, 2019.
And he's not the only one lately...
I suppose my criticism lies in the much greater number of players historically that have scored in the 24-27 range compared to the much more limited numbers that have eclipsed 30. In the last decade players have only accomplished 30pts/game 7 times. Seven times in ten years.
Do you know how many seasons LeBron averaged at least 30 points and 7 assists? 1.
Do you know how many seasons Dwyane Wade averaged 30 points and 7 assists? 1.
Do you know how many seasons Steph Curry averaged at least 30 points and 7 assists? NONE.
Do you know how many seasons Kevin Durant averaged at least 30/7? NONE.
But somehow, Devin Booker... is going to accomplish something the greatest scorers/playmakers the game has ever seen either only did once or NEVER did?
I mean... in Michael Jordan's 6 title winning years, he averaged 30 points and 5 assists, shooting at 50% from the field and 32% from three... and Booker's "best seasons" will be better offensively... than MJ from 1991-1998?
I... just don't get where some of you are coming some times. I mean, you didn't even say his best season... you said seasons, as in plural. The statement implies that Devin Booker will be one of the best offensive players in the history of the game.
Is the statement above just a case of not realizing just how rare-ified air those stats are or do you really believe that when all's said and done, he's going to be compared offensively to the LeBron, Wade, Curry, Kobe, Harden and Jordan's of the world?
All of that was a pretty big waste of time. The league is in an era of inflated numbers and thus it is far more likely for a player to put up numbers like that today than it was even as recently as LeBron's prime.
I mean Westbrook averaged 31/10/10 just a couple years ago and I think we can agree that he isn't on those guys level's either. I would guess no one would have believe like 5 years ago that Harden would ever be averaging 39 ppg and here we are.
We are only going to continue to see bigger and bigger numbers until they make some sort of rule change that slows the league back down or gives the defense some help. Neither will likely happen anytime soon.
Also not sure why you are taking the numbers so literally considering I clearly stated "something like" which means close to those two numbers. Maybe his best seasons will be a point or assist off or something, but I think his best years will be close to those numbers. If you were to count every time LeBron and MJ got close to those numbers you would get something more like 5-6 seasons apiece and the league was much lower scoring then.
Exactly why I don’t believe claims that Booker is already better shooter or passer than Kobe based on numbers. Yes his efficiency numbers are higher than Kobe but like you said Westbrook averaged a trip-dub, Harden is averaging 40, Towns has better numbers than prime Dirk etc etc etc... Stats today need to be taken with a boulder of salt.
I can agree with that with the facilitating, but Booker is definitely a better shooter, especially from three.
arguing with anyone who think Devin Booker will one day eclipse Kobe Bryant as an offensive player is a waste of time, yet here we are. it's too bad you could continue the conversation without being a condescending jerk above but it's pretty obvious when someone turns that way, they already know the argument is lost. let's continue anyway.
Uh... Durant and Curry have played in this era. Neither of them have gotten to 30/7.
Kyrie Irving has played in this era. Never came close to 30/7.
Lillard has played in this era. Never one season of 30/7.
And on and on it goes. And all of the above are better offensive players than Booker.
I'd absolutely put Westbrook up there with a Wade (who's a notch below the others mentioned) and I don't know anyone that thinks Booker can at some point be prime Westbrook's equal offensively. Westbrook is a sure-fire HOFer. I don't know a single soul outside the valley of the Sun who would try to make the argument that Devin Booker's probably going to be as well.
They're the numbers YOU gave. Why you're surprised they're going to be used for comparison to others in the league is beyond me.
I really was not trying to come off as condescending and I apologize that I did.
My point of it being a waste of time is that you really can't compare numbers to past eras as the pace of the game and the rules of the game have changed a lot.
The league is quickly trending into a higher and higher scoring league and I truly believe that averaging say 30/10 now would have been about the equivalent of averaging something like 25/7 just 10 years ago.
The only thing I said that I think might be a bit too optimistic was that he could be a better offensive player as I believe if prime Kobe was playing in the league right now he would probably be putting up close to 40 a game with 5-7 assists.
I do believe that Booker is a better shooter and is certainly trending into being a better passer, but he doesn't dominate one on ones as well as Kobe and will likely never be quite as good of a scorer because of that.
To be fair I also don't quite put Kobe in the same category as MJ or LeBron as an offensive talent. He is up there in raw scoring numbers, but both of those guys were much more efficient than Kobe.
And again I used those numbers as a general Idea. I never suggested that he will put up at least that much, but only that I could see him putting up numbers near those. Maybe they will be off by 1 or 2 one way or another, but I do believe his best year's will be around there. Unless of course he ends up on like a super-team or something in which it is really hard to really rack up scoring numbers like that.
I think he projects to be a better shooter but he has to do it over several meaningful seasons. I think Book is ultimately Joe Johnson with edge. So a better version of Joe.
For whatever it means, interrupted development or not, 23 year old Devin Booker moved into 15th tonight on the all time Suns scoring list during our game at Houston. According to an article on the Suns page at NBA com, Booker took the spot formerly held by Connie Hawkins.
And then the team folded as soon as he returned to the game in the 4th quarter with the team trailing by only 1 point...
Unfortunately, scoring stats do not necessarily equate to team growth.
Some people won't be happy with what Booker does. If he passes too much then he's not being aggressive and looking to score like he should and if he scores too much then he's got tunnel vision and being a ball hog.
He's 23 years old and is not close to a finish product at this point. He's gotten where he is largely on his own since he hasn't had the opportunity to learn from a coach because the head coach has been canned every year he's been in the league. He'll learn what Monty wants and Monty will call for him to do more in time also. They've been together for just over 20 games, a quarter of the season.
They are without their two starting centers. They are a couple games under .500 with all kinds of injuries. They are still way ahead of where any of us expected them to be at this moment. Book is adjusting to a different kind of team ball. His defense is improved (earlier more than now) and his efficiency is significantly better.
If that isn’t team growth I do not know what is.
BC, it seems to me that your real gripe is that Book has too many turnovers. Ok fine. Agreed. He needs to take better care of the ball.
Booker = 35 points on 19 shots
Harden = 34 points on 27 shots
If the “team” can’t find a way to capitalize on Booker’s incredible efficiency, than I suggest the “team” is at fault and not Booker...
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