Are we in an Offensive Rebuild?

Krangodnzr

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Yep, I can't say we were in better shape on defense at this time. Both are in shambles. Hell, even our special teams will likely need a new kicker and punter this year too.
If the Cardinals resign Allen, Murphy, and Hamilton (or draft a third round guy to fill his spot), the defense will largely be intact.

Draft Will Anderson, and the defense starts to look a lot better. I think they need another young player for the DL rotation as well.
 

BritCard

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You do realize that the term rebuild isn't static. The term means different things to different people.

How? A rebuild means stripping down the roster and rebuilding. It's dumping guys you don't want and eating dead money if you need to.

It's not signing 2-3 FA's and keeping 70% of your starters.
 

kerouac9

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If the Cardinals resign Allen, Murphy, and Hamilton (or draft a third round guy to fill his spot), the defense will largely be intact.

Draft Will Anderson, and the defense starts to look a lot better. I think they need another young player for the DL rotation as well.
I don't know where you think this money is coming from, because I know you're not going to criticize Monti and company if they don't re-sign all three of these guys. You're going to blame the cap situation.

Bringing back a defense that finished 31st in points, 21st in yards, and 24th in DVOA mostly intact (except for its best player in J.J. Watt) is hardly a plan for success.
 

dreamcastrocks

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How? A rebuild means stripping down the roster and rebuilding. It's dumping guys you don't want and eating dead money if you need to.

It's not signing 2-3 FA's and keeping 70% of your starters.
Because the length on how much you strip down the roster IS the variable. To some people, just kicking Kyler out of the team and going with a new QB/Coach/GM is a rebuild. Others want most of the roster gone; others somewhere in between. Since it is impossible to cut every player on your team and start over, the term will never be as rigid as you think it is.
 

BritCard

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Because the length on how much you strip down the roster IS the variable. To some people, just kicking Kyler out of the team and going with a new QB/Coach/GM is a rebuild. Others want most of the roster gone; others somewhere in between. Since it is impossible to cut every player on your team and start over, the term will never be as rigid as you think it is.

Ok, but none of those things can happen. Whether it be Kyler or a bunch of other guys.

Unless some people's definition of rebuild is "sign some of our own FA's and add a couple of outsiders". In which case every team is rebuilding.
 

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Ok, but none of those things can happen. Whether it be Kyler or a bunch of other guys.

Unless some people's definition of rebuild is "sign some of our own FA's and add a couple of outsiders". In which case every team is rebuilding.

Given the percentage of turnover from season to season, almost every team is somewhere between a 'rebuild' and a 're-jig.'

Everyone is free to define these terms to fit their narrative.
 

dreamcastrocks

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Ok, but none of those things can happen. Whether it be Kyler or a bunch of other guys.

Unless some people's definition of rebuild is "sign some of our own FA's and add a couple of outsiders". In which case every team is rebuilding.
You are proving my point. No one's definition of a rebuild will be exactly the same.
 

Krangodnzr

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I don't know where you think this money is coming from, because I know you're not going to criticize Monti and company if they don't re-sign all three of these guys. You're going to blame the cap situation.
Simple restructures can easily get you there. And pushing some money to next year. Last offseason any cap savvy person could look at last years cap and see that "We don't have a ton of money this year, or next." That's not the case this year.
Bringing back a defense that finished 31st in points, 21st in yards, and 24th in DVOA mostly intact (except for its best player in J.J. Watt) is hardly a plan for success.
If you think that it was a perfectly coached unit, then you'd have a great point. I don't think it was.
 

kerouac9

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Simple restructures can easily get you there. And pushing some money to next year. Last offseason any cap savvy person could look at last years cap and see that "We don't have a ton of money this year, or next." That's not the case this year.

If you think that it was a perfectly coached unit, then you'd have a great point. I don't think it was.

What are the "simple restructures"? Whatever they are, they're going to take away the cap flexibility you're very happy about for 2024. Also, how eager is Michael going to be to make additional cash outlays considering :waves hands:

So if the defense is perfectly coached, what do you think the improvement gets you to? 15th? 10th? Without J.J. Watt and replacing him with some mid-round picks?

Like, I know people are excited that we're 10th in nominal cap space right now, but according to over the cap, we only have a little over $4 million in cap space if we only signed minimum salary guys and our draft class. We open up an additional $12 million by cutting Robby Anderson. After that, the only major salaries on the roster are DHop, Budda, Hollywood, Ertz, and Conner.

How many of those guys do you want to commit to for the next 2-3 years?
 

Krangodnzr

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What are the "simple restructures"? Whatever they are, they're going to take away the cap flexibility you're very happy about for 2024. Also, how eager is Michael going to be to make additional cash outlays considering :waves hands:
Budda Baker is one. Convert some of his 13 million in salary into a bonus and you could free up 8 million more. Cutting Dennis Gardeck and Rodney Hudson are two more. You could also add a dummy year to the end of Conner's contract to free up more money. I know it sucks, but the Cardinals need to do what they can to keep the existing talent from leaving.

So if the defense is perfectly coached, what do you think the improvement gets you to? 15th? 10th? Without J.J. Watt and replacing him with some mid-round picks?
If the Cardinals had the 15th ranked defense last year, we're likely not talking about a new HC.

Will Anderson/Jalen Carter will help the defense significantly. And growth from youngsters (Sanders, Thomas, Wilson, etc.)
Like, I know people are excited that we're 10th in nominal cap space right now, but according to over the cap, we only have a little over $4 million in cap space if we only signed minimum salary guys and our draft class. We open up an additional $12 million by cutting Robby Anderson. After that, the only major salaries on the roster are DHop, Budda, Hollywood, Ertz, and Conner.

How many of those guys do you want to commit to for the next 2-3 years?
Excited? Why must you be so insulting? I'd say I'm looking at this practically and saying it can be done without too much maneuvering.
 

kerouac9

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Budda Baker is one. Convert some of his 13 million in salary into a bonus and you could free up 8 million more. Cutting Dennis Gardeck and Rodney Hudson are two more. You could also add a dummy year to the end of Conner's contract to free up more money. I know it sucks, but the Cardinals need to do what they can to keep the existing talent from leaving.


If the Cardinals had the 15th ranked defense last year, we're likely not talking about a new HC.

Will Anderson/Jalen Carter will help the defense significantly. And growth from youngsters (Sanders, Thomas, Wilson, etc.)

Excited? Why must you be so insulting? I'd say I'm looking at this practically and saying it can be done without too much maneuvering.
So Budda Baker is the only one of the "simple restructures" that you can do. Were you aware that he only has two more years on his current contract? Converting $10 million of his 2023 salary to bonus only creates an additional $5 million in cap space.

His 2024 cap number would be over $21 million.

Then you're cutting players, which mean you have to SIGN more of those guys to replace them. Cutting Rodney Hudson actually costs us $470k against the cap.

Thanks, Keim.

I don't put much faith in rookie pass rushers making an instant impact. Myles Garrett had seven sacks his rookie season, but Joey Bosa had 10.5 in just 12 games. I think you're really underestimating how troubled this roster is this offseason.
 

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If the Cardinals resign Allen, Murphy, and Hamilton (or draft a third round guy to fill his spot), the defense will largely be intact.

Draft Will Anderson, and the defense starts to look a lot better. I think they need another young player for the DL rotation as well.

Or draft Carter to tandem with Allen and possibly add an off-the-edge rusher later in the draft.
 

QuebecCard

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Budda Baker is one. Convert some of his 13 million in salary into a bonus and you could free up 8 million more. Cutting Dennis Gardeck and Rodney Hudson are two more. You could also add a dummy year to the end of Conner's contract to free up more money. I know it sucks, but the Cardinals need to do what they can to keep the existing talent from leaving.


If the Cardinals had the 15th ranked defense last year, we're likely not talking about a new HC.

Will Anderson/Jalen Carter will help the defense significantly. And growth from youngsters (Sanders, Thomas, Wilson, etc.)

Excited? Why must you be so insulting? I'd say I'm looking at this practically and saying it can be done without too much maneuvering.

Agree on Baker, which is actually a $6m saving against the Cap. If Dhop is traded, we gain $8m; if he's restructured, it's $9m. Other potential 'savings' through restructuring include Ertz $3.7m - Conner $2.5m - Humphries $2.9m - Releasing Anderson saves $12m, Gardeck $2.8m and Golden $3m - There are no savings from Hudson's departure. A new deal for Hollywood would also be less than his present $13m Cap hit.

These moves would create approximately $55m in Cap space, not counting a new contract with Hollywood.
 
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Krangodnzr

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Agree on Baker, which is actually a $6m saving against the Cap. If Dhop is traded, we gain $8m; if he's restructured, it's $9m. Other potential 'savings' through restructuring include Ertz $3.7m - Conner $2.5m - Humphries $2.9m - Releasing Anderson saves $12m, Gardeck $2.8m and Golden $3m - There are no savings from Hudson's departure. A new deal for Hollywood would also be less than his present $13m Cap hit.

These moves would create approximately $55m in Cap space, not counting a new contract with Hollywood.
Yeah it's nonsense that the Cardinals can't have some money to spend.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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Im starting to think BritCard is actually an AI "devils advocate" bot, created by Shaggy, solely to regularly and consistently supply differing opinion in order to keep traffic flowing.
Brilliant
 
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