9 defensive linemen drafted the last 3 years. How many more this year?

[Lomax to Green 84]

Maybe we should use all 8 of our picks on defensive linemen and hope that one pans out. Heck that would be close to what we have done with the 9 we have drafted the last 3 years and next year we can draft 7 more and hopefully by the end of next year we will have a competent defensive line.

When is enough, enough. So if we take a bunch more d-linemen this year are we admitting that Dennis Johnson is a total bust? How about Nate Dwyer? Or Mario Fatefahi? Or Kyle Vandenbosch? Or Marcus Bell? Or Wendell Bryant? Someone on the Cards needs to be held accoutable for the mess on the defensive line. They have drafted 9 d-linemen over the last 3 years and once again the #1 need is defensive line. When do you say to Mac and Greene-tough you made this mess, you drafted these guys, deal with it, we have other needs besides defensive line that need to be addressed.

 

[AZ1766]

Thats a different angle......... hhmmmm!
It's true, but you can't just say the hell with it and do nothing about it, DL is a key part of the defense.
Greene is looking more like the culprit everyday, ay?
Thats if he has some input into who we draft and don't draft.

 

[red desert]

Originally posted by Holian
Maybe we should use all 8 of our picks on defensive linemen and hope that one pans out. Heck that would be close to what we have done with the 9 we have drafted the last 3 years and next year we can draft 7 more and hopefully by the end of next year we will have a competent defensive line.

When is enough, enough. So if we take a bunch more d-linemen this year are we admitting that Dennis Johnson is a total bust? How about Nate Dwyer? Or Mario Fatefahi? Or Kyle Vandenbosch? Or Marcus Bell? Or Wendell Bryant? Someone on the Cards needs to be held accoutable for the mess on the defensive line. They have drafted 9 d-linemen over the last 3 years and once again the #1 need is defensive line. When do you say to Mac and Greene-tough you made this mess, you drafted these guys, deal with it, we have other needs besides defensive line that need to be addressed.

Heck, with our beloved cards, couldn't that be said about every position?

 

[SECTION 11]

Originally posted by AZ1766
Greene is looking more like the culprit everyday, ay?

I definately think there's culprits on that side of the ball.

Why did it take three second round OLB's to (not even) replace Miller?
Why didn't Thompson have 10 sacks last year?
If your front four can't get pressure on the QB, what made them think our front three would?
Why didn't we blitz McNabb?

Ugh.

 

[MadCardDisease]

Of those 9 guys only 2 of them were drafted in the first two rounds. Maybe we should Invest higher round draft picks on the Line instead of trying to find bargains in the later rounds.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

or maybe the following plan is so crazy it just might work:

lube up all 9 of the ones we got with grape jelly and make 'em all wrassle each other before home games! then make mean joe eat the jelly scraped off of each one of 'em. i can hear mean joe now, "Mmmmm, manjelly . . . " WHEEEEEEEEEEEE!

 

[Cheesebeef]

Originally posted by PHXSPORTS4LIFE
or maybe the following plan is so crazy it just might work:

lube up all 9 of the ones we got with grape jelly and make 'em all wrassle each other before home games! then make mean joe eat the jelly scraped off of each one of 'em. i can hear mean joe now, "Mmmmm, manjelly . . . " WHEEEEEEEEEEEE!

whoa - don't want to know where those thoughts came from.

 

[SECTION 11]

Originally posted by PHXSPORTS4LIFE
lube up all 9 of the ones we got with grape jelly and make 'em all wrassle each other before home games! then make mean joe eat the jelly scraped off of each one of 'em. i can hear mean joe now, "Mmmmm, manjelly . . . " WHEEEEEEEEEEEE!

Dude, that plan sucks.
#6 is way too high for manjelly anyway.
Sheesh.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

MANJELLY!

 

[JeffGollin]

SF used that "********* a position" strategy with respect to DB's over a decade ago, and it brought Bill Walsh a Super Bowl.

 

[Cardforlife]

a different thought

How about we sign these guys befoer camp starts! That way they don't have to jump in 1/2 way through there 1st nfl camps. When was the last time we had all our draft picks at the beginning of camp!

 

[mdamien13]

Originally posted by PHXSPORTS4LIFE
lube up all 9 of the ones we got with grape jelly and make 'em all wrassle each other before home games! then make mean joe eat the jelly scraped off of each one of 'em. i can hear mean joe now, "Mmmmm, manjelly . . . " WHEEEEEEEEEEEE!

When the hell did Mean Joe become the Tossed Salad Man?

 

[EndZone]

Re: Re: 9 defensive linemen drafted the last 3 years. How many more this year?

Originally posted by red desert
Heck, with our beloved cards, couldn't that be said about every position?

Name one offensive position that we have drafted a bunch of guys at in the last 3 years and none have worked out? Our WR's drafted in late rounds have been good, our OL is very good, our 1 first round rb sucked but we have a undrafted FA that is good.

 

[CardinalChris]

Originally posted by JeffGollin
SF used that "********* a position" strategy with respect to DB's over a decade ago, and it brought Bill Walsh a Super Bowl.

Bill Parcells in New York with those great RBs and LBs.

 

[kerouac9]

Re: Re: Re: 9 defensive linemen drafted the last 3 years. How many more this year?

Originally posted by EndZone
Name one offensive position that we have drafted a bunch of guys at in the last 3 years and none have worked out? Our WR's drafted in late rounds have been good, our OL is very good, our 1 first round rb sucked but we have a undrafted FA that is good.

Our late-round WRs have been good? What are you talking about? Kasper: waivers. Mar Tay: Waivers. Jackson: Waivers (I may be wrong about this, but I don't think so). We didn't draft any of these players.

We drafted McAddley, and he had a higher drop percentage than any WR in the league besides ASFN darling Marcus Robinson. We drafted Gilmore, but he went out and got himself injured before he could do anything.

DB was a high draft pick. Frank Sanders is old, so he doesn't count, and we gave up a #1 for Rob Moore, who decided that he didn't want to be a Card anymore two years before his contract was up.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Mmm, kerouac, tough, but true.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by Holian
Maybe we should use all 8 of our picks on defensive linemen and hope that one pans out. Heck that would be close to what we have done with the 9 we have drafted the last 3 years and next year we can draft 7 more and hopefully by the end of next year we will have a competent defensive line.

When is enough, enough. So if we take a bunch more d-linemen this year are we admitting that Dennis Johnson is a total bust? How about Nate Dwyer? Or Mario Fatefahi? Or Kyle Vandenbosch? Or Marcus Bell? Or Wendell Bryant? Someone on the Cards needs to be held accoutable for the mess on the defensive line. They have drafted 9 d-linemen over the last 3 years and once again the #1 need is defensive line. When do you say to Mac and Greene-tough you made this mess, you drafted these guys, deal with it, we have other needs besides defensive line that need to be addressed.

I don't think anyone has ever said that we would "take a bunch more d-lineman this year". In fact I would be willing to bet that we take 3 at the most.

And no that isn't admitting those guys were mistakes, only that they haven't panned out so far. And by-the-way, Fatefahi isn't on the team anymore, and I'll bet Dwyer won't be soon.

The lines (both offensive and defensive) both need at least 8 guys or so. On defense, you want at least 5-6 tackles and 3-4 ends. Currently the DL has: KVB, Wendell, Wakefield, DJ, Tanner, Russell Davis, Bell, Dwyer, Alton Moore (ugh that list looks terrible).

We easily need about two more guys that are good and can beat out guys like Davis, Dwyer, and possibly Moore.

 

[AZCB34]

Re: Re: Re: Re: 9 defensive linemen drafted the last 3 years. How many more this year?

Originally posted by kerouac9
Our late-round WRs have been good? What are you talking about? Kasper: waivers. Mar Tay: Waivers. Jackson: Waivers (I may be wrong about this, but I don't think so). We didn't draft any of these players.

We drafted McAddley, and he had a higher drop percentage than any WR in the league besides ASFN darling Marcus Robinson. We drafted Gilmore, but he went out and got himself injured before he could do anything.

DB was a high draft pick. Frank Sanders is old, so he doesn't count, and we gave up a #1 for Rob Moore, who decided that he didn't want to be a Card anymore two years before his contract was up.

I know I don't have to say this but I will anyway. You do realize that drop precentage is directly effected by the number of passes thrown to a guy so bringin up Robinson is ludicrous? He ended up being the forgotten man in CHI because they went with Booker, Terrell and White (whose hands are 100x worse than Robinson's). Robinson, before he was injured was enetering the Boston level of play...check out the stats. As long as he is back to 100%, which he should be 2 years off knee injury since we all accept it takes anywhere from 18-24 months to get fully back, than he is significantly better than anything we have right now. I also submit that he will play with a sizable chip on his shoulder and will excel JUST to prove he isn't close to being done.

I assume you were glad to see Boston leave due to his dropsies last year since he too was a darling of ASFN-land?

 

[kerouac9]

Re: Re: 9 defensive linemen drafted the last 3 years. How many more this year?

Originally posted by Krangthebrain
We easily need about two more guys that are good and can beat out guys like Davis, Dwyer, and possibly Moore.

Don't forget Wakefield. He has no place on any but the most injury-riddled team's active roster on Sundays. Why he starts in PHX is beyond me.

As much as I hate our situation at DE, I think that we need help at DT more. Tanner and Davis are just not good starting DTs. As long as they're at the top of the depth chart, the Cards are never going to be above the bottom half of the league in rushing.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Re: Re: Re: 9 defensive linemen drafted the last 3 years. How many more this year?

Originally posted by kerouac9
Don't forget Wakefield. He has no place on any but the most injury-riddled team's active roster on Sundays. Why he starts in PHX is beyond me.

As much as I hate our situation at DE, I think that we need help at DT more. Tanner and Davis are just not good starting DTs. As long as they're at the top of the depth chart, the Cards are never going to be above the bottom half of the league in rushing.

I disagree. Wakefield is a good backup LDE. But there is no way in hell that he should be playing over 60% of the snaps (more like 30%). He is a depth guy, that is good against the run, plays hard, but is very limited athletically.

I also think that Tanner is a decent tackle, but not a starter. Sometimes I think you might play a little too much Madden or some other video game football, where every player on your team is a star. In this league, you need players like Wakefield and Tanner (I honestly do agree that Davis sucks; he offers very little).

They are the dirtworkers that help out in multiple areas, but I will say this, they do suck as full-time starters.

 

[kerouac9]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 9 defensive linemen drafted the last 3 years. How many more this year?

Originally posted by AZCB34
I know I don't have to say this but I will anyway. You do realize that drop precentage is directly effected by the number of passes thrown to a guy so bringin up Robinson is ludicrous? He ended up being the forgotten man in CHI because they went with Booker, Terrell and White (whose hands are 100x worse than Robinson's). Robinson, before he was injured was enetering the Boston level of play...check out the stats. As long as he is back to 100%, which he should be 2 years off knee injury since we all accept it takes anywhere from 18-24 months to get fully back, than he is significantly better than anything we have right now. I also submit that he will play with a sizable chip on his shoulder and will excel JUST to prove he isn't close to being done.

I assume you were glad to see Boston leave due to his dropsies last year since he too was a darling of ASFN-land?

I'm just calling the stats as they are, not the way that you'd like them to be. Robinson might come back, like Jerry Rice did, or he might not. I can tell you that, with about equal numbers of times thrown to (about 50), Denny Northcutt caught 78.0% of his passes, Joe Jurevicious caught 72.2% of his.

DB caught more passes than he missed, last season and will next season. Which is more than I can say about McAddley (39.7%) or Robinson (39.6%). It'll be hip to talk bad about him now that he's gone (as been aptly illustrated by Krang's outbursts anytime his name comes up), but he remains a helluva player, and the Cards are far worse without him.

 

[BIGDADDY_REDBIRD]

I Agree.. kerouac9, I'm still baffled at the re-signing of both Tanner & Davis. I also feel wakefield could be more effective if we moved him inside to DT . Does'nt have the speed to get up the field off the edge, but has the size, smarts, & uses his hands well enough to contain gap assignments....

 

[AZCB34]

Re: Re: Re: 9 defensive linemen drafted the last 3 years. How many more this year?

Originally posted by kerouac9
Don't forget Wakefield. He has no place on any but the most injury-riddled team's active roster on Sundays. Why he starts in PHX is beyond me.

As much as I hate our situation at DE, I think that we need help at DT more. Tanner and Davis are just not good starting DTs. As long as they're at the top of the depth chart, the Cards are never going to be above the bottom half of the league in rushing.

I agree. The strength of a defense is measured by the strength right up the middle and the Cards DTs are barely adequate, the MLB is average at best. That is not going to stop the run effectively which as well all know allows the DEs to pin their ears back and crash in on the QBs. That is why I am sooooo against Suggs since I flat out question his run stopping ability against the top OTs the game of football has to offer. If they cannot stop the run, a player like Sugss (sack specialist at best) is rendered ineffective...and I think he will fall well short of expectations is the pass rushing category as well.

 

[SECTION 11]

Re: Re: Re: Re: 9 defensive linemen drafted the last 3 years. How many more this year?

Originally posted by AZCB34
The strength of a defense is measured by the strength right up the middle and the Cards DTs are barely adequate, the MLB is average at best. That is not going to stop the run effectively which as well all know allows the DEs to pin their ears back and crash in on the QBs.

Booyah!




I hate that saying.

 

[kerouac9]

Re: Re: Re: Re: 9 defensive linemen drafted the last 3 years. How many more this year?

Originally posted by Krangthebrain
I disagree. Wakefield is a good backup LDE. But there is no way in hell that he should be playing over 60% of the snaps (more like 30%). He is a depth guy, that is good against the run, plays hard, but is very limited athletically.

I also think that Tanner is a decent tackle, but not a starter. Sometimes I think you might play a little too much Madden or some other video game football, where every player on your team is a star. In this league, you need players like Wakefield and Tanner (I honestly do agree that Davis sucks; he offers very little).

They are the dirtworkers that help out in multiple areas, but I will say this, they do suck as full-time starters.

No, I totally agree that they're fine as backups (I do play too much Madden, but I'm in the Super Bowl with the Season 2 Cards with a #1 DT and #2 CB [I did re-sign Jake and DB, though]), but they're awful as starters. If all three are on the field one at a time, the overall quality doesn't drop that much (like on the Lakers, when either Kobe or Shaq are on the floor), when all three play together at the same time, as starters, you get a QB who has time to chill champaign and spread out the checked picnic blanket while in the pocket.