2022-23 Around the NBA Thread

Covert Rain

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Booker's contract ends in 2028, if we're trading him for anything of value he's gotta go in 2027.

The Nets control our pick in 2027, 28 and 29.

Rebuilding prior to 2029 serves no purpose.
Why not trade your most valuable asset on the last year of his contract (2027-2028) season? Sure that means the Nets likely get good picks for three drafts but the Suns could be back in the thick of drafting in what 2027 or 2028 draft? Then could have multiple picks to package and move.

2027 Draft - Nets Get the Suns pick unprotected. Suns could have pick via Book trade?
2028 Draft - Nets can swap with the Suns but we still have a pick. Knowing the Nets still a decent pick assuming they want to pay the salary of a higher pick. Suns could have a pick via trade.
2029 Draft - Suns could have a draft pick from a Booker trade?

How else are the Suns going to reload for a rebuild? Booker is a UFA in 2028. You will have nobody to move to reload if let him walk for NOTHING. To me it's more insane to let that happen. You won't have to wait a decade to start a rebuild.
 
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Phrazbit

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Why not trade your most valuable asset on the last year of his contract (2027-2028) season? Sure that means the Nets likely get good picks for three drafts but by 2029 the Suns would be in a good position to do something by the 2029 draft just two years later.

2027 Draft - Nets Get the Suns pick unprotected.
2028 Draft - Nets can swap with the Suns but we still have a pick. Knowing the Nets still a decent pick assuming they want to pay the salary of a higher pick.
2029 Draft - if you trade Book you are likely to reload on a bunch of assets coming back your way.

How else are the Suns going to reload for a rebuild? Booker is a UFA in 2028. You will have nobody to move to reload if let him walk for NOTHING. To me it's more insane to let that happen. You won't have to wait a decade to start a rebuild.

It's going to be very difficult to keep this team as a competitor through the end of the decade but we have to try, if we give up sooner than that it makes the Durant trade an act of self defeating insanity.

Flat out, full stop, I cannot emphasize enough... it would be insane to hit the reset button before we're done paying off the Nets.

This is the bed we made when we traded one of the most lucrative trade packages of all time for a 34 year old.
 

Covert Rain

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It's going to be very difficult to keep this team as a competitor through the end of the decade but we have to try, if we give up sooner than that it makes the Durant trade an act of self defeating insanity.

Flat out, full stop, I cannot emphasize enough... it would be insane to hit the reset button before we're done paying off the Nets.

This is the bed we made when we traded one of the most lucrative trade packages of all time for a 34 year old.
What other scenario gives the Suns the most flexibility to accelerate a rebuild? Insanity would be letting Booker walk and getting nothing. We could thearotically then be particpating in either the 2027 or 2028 draft, 2029 draft with a ton of future flexibility. Any other scenario means a long long rebuild process.
 
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Phrazbit

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What other scenario gives the Suns the ability to completely rebuild by 2029 verses waiting a decade while still giving them a legit show at a title for a couple years?

There is no scenario where we can completely rebuild by 2029, trading Booker, would merely ensure that we are in total ruin.
 

Covert Rain

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There is no scenario where we can completely rebuild by 2029, trading Booker, would merely ensure that we are in total ruin.
I didn't mean completely rebuild by 2029. Sorry, meant be in the middle of a rebuild. You could accelerate your rebuild process in a Book trade scenario. Letting Booker walk for nothing means a long long slow rebuild.

What other scenario is a better option?
 

Phrazbit

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I didn't mean completely rebuild by 2029. Sorry, meant start a rebuild. You could accelerate your rebuild process within 2 years in that trade scenario. Letting Booker walk for nothing means a long long slow rebuild.

What other scenario is a better option?

You sure as hell don't let him walk for nothing. You keep him.

I kept bringing up "opportunity cost". What we're talking about is the opportunity cost.

The options we have to avoid totally bottoming out are few and will require some really savvy moves by the front office.

That is our scenario... we pray the front office is freaking brilliant and can find some diamonds in the rough and make some really smart trades with limited resources and maybe that some star signs in free agency at the cost of no assets.
 

Covert Rain

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You sure as hell don't let him walk for nothing. You keep him.

I kept bringing up "opportunity cost". What we're talking about is the opportunity cost.

The options we have to avoid totally bottoming out are few and will require some really savvy moves by the front office.

That is our scenario... we pray the front office is freaking brilliant and can find some diamonds in the rough and make some really smart trades with limited resources and maybe that some star signs in free agency at the cost of no assets.
Keeping him could be a bad opportunity cost move through the end of his extension contract. You cannot accelerate your rebuild if you let him walk or keep him. Naturally, I am assuming worst case scenario that the Suns can't work front office magic. You are right that is a possible scenario they could. Hence my faith that James and Ishbia won't sit on their hands during that stretch.
 

Phrazbit

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Keeping him is a bad opportunity cost move. You cannot accelerate your rebuild if you let him walk or keep him. Naturally, I am assuming the Suns can't work front office magic for a possible 3rd window. I just can't see how that would work.

I don't know what to say.

Shipping off Booker to a contender for late round picks, while simultaneously, turning us into probably the worst team in the NBA while having no control over our own picks would be, unquestionably, one of the biggest follies in NBA history.

It won't happen. If it does happen I will go burn the arena down.
 

Covert Rain

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I don't know what to say.

Shipping off Booker to a contender for late round picks, while simultaneously, turning us into probably the worst team in the NBA while having no control over our own picks would be, unquestionably, one of the biggest follies in NBA history.

It won't happen. If it does happen I will go burn the arena down.
If the front office can't make some brilliant moves the Suns will be in a terrible position with or without Book by the end of his extension contract anyway. There is no avoiding that. It all depends on what kind of magic they can pull off over the next few years. If they can't? The bigger folly would be to watch it all burn down and just watch.

If that happens? Fans will bring out the pitch forks anyway without something to look forward too.
 

Phrazbit

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If the front office can't make some brilliant moves the Suns will be in a terrible position with or without Book by the end of his extension contract anyway. There is no avoiding that. It all depends on what kind of magic they can pull off over the next few years. If they can't? The bigger folly would be to watch it all burn down and just watch.

If that happens? Fans will bring out the pitch forks anyway without something to look forward too.
We are arguing in circles about something that is a hypothetical long in the future but, no, there is zero upside to bottoming out before 2029, it would accelerate nothing.
 

Covert Rain

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We are arguing in circles about something that is a hypothetical long in the future but, no, there is zero upside to bottoming out before 2029, it would accelerate nothing.
Yes we are. Getting assets absolutely can accelerate your rebuild. It's nonsensical to say otherwise. Assets means flexibility. That is the very definition of upside. At least we agree that much might hinge on the Suns ability to make move over the next several seasons.
 

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You sure as hell don't let him walk for nothing. You keep him.

I kept bringing up "opportunity cost". What we're talking about is the opportunity cost.

The options we have to avoid totally bottoming out are few and will require some really savvy moves by the front office.

That is our scenario... we pray the front office is freaking brilliant and can find some diamonds in the rough and make some really smart trades with limited resources and maybe that some star signs in free agency at the cost of no assets.
Stars will sign in free agency.. Period
 

Finito

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Domantas Sabonis won his 3rd player of the week honor this season. Gosh, even if he’s not the defensive presence of Ayton, he’s a great facilitator and would be a beast on the pick and roll with CP3/Book. Oh well. Him and Fox should both be all-nba

Ayton is 10x better in the pick and role. Ayton and Paul were the number 1 duo in the NBA last year

Our pick and roll has fallen off because Paul is washed. I would love to see a Booker/Ayton two man game but that’s not what Monty runs.
 

GatorAZ

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I think the Suns will pull off a major trade involving Ayton after next season. They can absorb salary since Paul & Shamet will be off the books by then and Ayton will only have two years left on his deal so he’s movable. It’s all about rearranging the deck chairs when you’re in our position. Looks what the Clippers are doing with their different cycle of role players each year and they’re contenders every year depending on health. Also there might be some coaching change upside as well.
 

Covert Rain

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I think the Suns will pull off a major trade involving Ayton after next season. They can absorb salary since Paul & Shamet will be off the books by then and Ayton will only have two years left on his deal so he’s movable. It’s all about rearranging the deck chairs when you’re in our position. Looks what the Clippers are doing with their different cycle of role players each year and they’re contenders every year depending on health. Also there might be some coaching change upside as well.
What if they are in contention next year and playing lights out?
 

DJ Tabooh

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Ayton is 10x better in the pick and role. Ayton and Paul were the number 1 duo in the NBA last year

Our pick and roll has fallen off because Paul is washed. I would love to see a Booker/Ayton two man game but that’s not what Monty runs.
That’s not necessarily true. Sabonis is averaging more points per possession in P&R though he’s got less attempts. He is also undoubtedly a better passer than Ayton with better hands.

I think he’d personally be a better fit on this team because even if he’s not scoring a bunch, he can rebound and pass. But yes, we probably should go to Ayton more but we all know he doesn’t play with that burning desire every night and gets in his head when things don’t go well.
 

DJ Tabooh

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For what it's worth, our combo is much better than Shaq and Kobe.
Wait, you actually think this? Because we wouldn’t have needed to get KD if that was so….Shaq is one of the most dominant bigs ever.

And while the Kobe/Book comparisons aren’t far off offensively (Book is more efficient), Kobe was a better all-around player.

I wish Ayton turned into Shaq because KD would literally be a luxury and he’s one of the greatest players ever. We would 3 peat lol
 

AzStevenCal

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Wait, you actually think this? Because we wouldn’t have needed to get KD if that was so….Shaq is one of the most dominant bigs ever.

And while the Kobe/Book comparisons aren’t far off offensively (Book is more efficient), Kobe was a better all-around player.

I wish Ayton turned into Shaq because KD would literally be a luxury and he’s one of the greatest players ever. We would 3 peat lol
Yeah I actually think our combo is better than those two. Kobe was on the wrong helicopter at the wrong time and Shaq is in his 50's, our guys have to be better than them. Sure, Shaq could still probably dominate DA but not enough to offset Booker's advantage.
 

Finito

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That’s not necessarily true. Sabonis is averaging more points per possession in P&R though he’s got less attempts. He is also undoubtedly a better passer than Ayton with better hands.

I think he’d personally be a better fit on this team because even if he’s not scoring a bunch, he can rebound and pass. But yes, we probably should go to Ayton more but we all know he doesn’t play with that burning desire every night and gets in his head when things don’t go well.

It’s 100% true like I said Ayton and Paul were the number 1 duo in the NBA last year with DA being ridiculously efficient.

It takes two guys to run the pick and roll and Paul has fallen off a cliff making our pick and roll game a shell of what it was last year. This is a Paul issue

I love Sabonis and he is really good at rebounding and passing but he’s a huge liability on defense especially switching on the perimeter and that’s what the NBA is today. We would need a really good defensive PF.
 

Finito

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Yeah I actually think our combo is better than those two. Kobe was on the wrong helicopter at the wrong time and Shaq is in his 50's, our guys have to be better than them. Sure, Shaq could still probably dominate DA but not enough to offset Booker's advantage.

Shaq could not do you not remember him at the end that was UGLY.

Have you heard Amin talk about Shaq on the Suns and all the behind the scenes stuff that went on with him. Not a fan
 

Covert Rain

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Yeah I actually think our combo is better than those two. Kobe was on the wrong helicopter at the wrong time and Shaq is in his 50's, our guys have to be better than them. Sure, Shaq could still probably dominate DA but not enough to offset Booker's advantage.
Wow. :lmao:
 

Superbone

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I didn't even get it until you literally pointed it out. :p I mean, I knew of course Kobe died in a helicopter crash but didn't get that he was comparing Booker/Ayton to Kobe/Shaq at this very moment. Ayton is injured right now although I'm sure he could play if he had to. Shaq would play through him while Ayton would shoot fall away jumpers and hook shots.
 

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You are acting like KD and Paul signed here in their prime and didn't cost anything. They were traded here for good value. The Suns didn't even get either of them at a discount. Top dollar was paid. Now the cupboard is bare and there isn't an easy way to add another star once CP3 is finished, which is essentially this off-season. There are no assets other than Ayton left to trade and we aren't getting a star for him alone.
We gave up a bucket of crap for CP3.
 

AzStevenCal

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Shaq could not do you not remember him at the end that was UGLY.

Have you heard Amin talk about Shaq on the Suns and all the behind the scenes stuff that went on with him. Not a fan
Well, in case it's been missed along the way, I was mocking the idea that Booker and DA could ever be considered the next Shaq and Kobe duo. It could have been, maybe even should have been but missed it by many miles. And that's coming from one of the few fans that thinks Kobe is one of the more overrated players of the modern era.
 

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