OT: Kyler Murray Debacle Thread

[kerouac9]

I still don't think they trade him mid season which would make the most sense but you never know.

That would make no sense. Trade him where?

 

[kerouac9]

It's not just roster bonus. At the start of the new league year it locks in $19.5m guaranteed base salary for 2027. A new team is taking on $62m for a single year.

Mike can agree to pay some or all of this to get a trade done but it's going to be ugly. And even then the best is likely to be 1 year and $42m for a new team. Not something I'd give a 3rd for.

I'd think a 4th, or a 5th, and a 5th for a 6th.

The Jets paid Just Fields $40 for two years. Even Kyler right now is worth a 50% premium on Justin Fields.

It's paid out, but also still part of the cap. I will be honest, I can't find a great answer for this. The Cards pay any bonsues, but I don't know if they stay on the Cardinals cap if that player is later traded. You are probably correct.

The roster bonus is guaranteed, but it doesn’t get paid until sometime around the start of the league year. If this relationship really sours, maybe Kyler defers some or all of that to facilitate a trade. I doubt Michael is gonna get the board to pony up some $30 million to facilitate getting rid of him.

 

[Stout]

I've said this elsewhere. However, Greg Cosell says how a coach calls a game tells you what he thinks of the QB (WR to a lesser extent)

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Fair or not. We're seeing Drew has lost faith. Whether in just Kyler. Maybe h'se not seeing MHJ improving under Drew Terrell in terms of getting YAC.

Either way to make that call at that time is just brutal. Faith has been lost and the season may now be cooked.

Absolves KM in that moment for sure. F'ing Petzing! KM would show me some sand by coming out in that situation, shaking his head at the sidelines, and calling the passing play he wants. Even if the play failed, he'd get a nod from me.

 

[DVontel]

I said this in the other thread

I would still fire Petzing & trade away Kyler. Not a fan of the boring Kevin Stefanski offense that Petzing is trying to run.

Bring in McDaniel once Miami fires him.

 

[BritCard]

23 going to be 24 but yes I just said that in another post. He also had no major injury. But they are the same age, after 3 years there wasn't a team in the league that thought Sam Darnold was better than Kyler. He is now, but at the point of his trade not even close. Darnold was on the way down not up at that point, so is Kyler.

I'm sure the contract matters somewhat yes but I don't think it's as big a deal as it used to be

The big issue is how Kyler finishes the year. If he "fights back" and plays well his market value goes up, if he just turtles, market value goes down.

Contract matters a great deal, it's one of the biggest elements of a trade. As is age. A 23 year old with only 2 years in the league has far greater room to develop than a 28 year old with 7 years.

 

[BritCard]

The Jets paid Just Fields $40 for two years. Even Kyler right now is worth a 50% premium on Justin Fields.



The roster bonus is guaranteed, but it doesn’t get paid until sometime around the start of the league year. If this relationship really sours, maybe Kyler defers some or all of that to facilitate a trade. I doubt Michael is gonna get the board to pony up some $30 million to facilitate getting rid of him.

It's not 50% though. It's 1 year at $62m or 2 years at just under $80m.

 

[slanidrac16]

I'm guessing Murray will definitely get another shot with a different team in the future. If Daniel Jones ( who Giants fans still blame for losing Saquan ) can get another shot, Baker Mayfield ( who's been on a couple of different team ) and lastly Sam Darnold ( who was seeing dead people " I mean ghost " on the field during a game ) can get another shot. I don't think anyone would think Murray won't get another chance.
Just because Cardinals fans can blame a single player doesn't mean that other teams don't look at a player and see their performance as a " Bidwill, Arizona Cardinals " organization problem. Teams saw the Mayfield problem as a " Cleveland Browns organization " problem. Teams saw Daniel Jones as a " N.Y Giants organization " problem.
Never get so high and mighty on the Arizona Cardinals to think that other teams believe that if a player doesn't succeed with the Cardinals than that player must be a BUST ! ! ! That's alot of belief in an organization that's been to one ( count it 1.... ) Superbowl in almost the last 40 years.

No doubt there will teams interested.

 

[slanidrac16]

Maybe the most disturbing thing is watching those repays in this thread. What the hell must Petzing and Gannon thinking when they see those?
So we keep seeing it week after week.
If Brissett is going to play I hope he has the week to practice.

 

[Russ Smith]

Contract matters a great deal, it's one of the biggest elements of a trade. As is age. A 23 year old with only 2 years in the league has far greater room to develop than a 28 year old with 7 years.

Give me 5 examples of a starting QB on a contract like Kyler has being traded and what they got. You can't because it rarely happens. Darnold was traded after 3 seasons, the third of which was the worst of his 3 years. They literally traded him to make room for Zach Wilson, that's how little the Jets thought of him, and they still got a 3rd.

If Murray doesn't completely meltdown the rest of this year the Cards will be able to trade him but how he does the rest of the year will determine what we get in exchange. Acting like anybody knows in early october what that value is, is just wrong. Nobody knows.

 

[602 Native]

That would make no sense. Trade him where?

The Vikes

 

[SoonerLou]

Absolves KM in that moment for sure. F'ing Petzing! KM would show me some sand by coming out in that situation, shaking his head at the sidelines, and calling the passing play he wants. Even if the play failed, he'd get a nod from me.

Welp. Instead he walked off the field with his head hanging down after the play was stopped.

JG should have called timeout. However, to truly own the team thats what Kyler should have done. Go to the sideline and say that play has no chance to succeed and call a fricking passing play.

 

[kerouac9]

It's not 50% though. It's 1 year at $62m or 2 years at just under $80m.

No it’s not. Kyler’s due $42.5 MM in cash next year and $36.3MM in 2027. Only $17mm of that 2027 is guaranteed in 2026.

 

[SoonerLou]

Maybe the most disturbing thing is watching those repays in this thread. What the hell must Petzing and Gannon thinking when they see those?
So we keep seeing it week after week.
If Brissett is going to play I hope he has the week to practice.

Maybe he's a good fit with Drew. However, what I saw on the Patriots last year was brutal. Now they didnt have that much talent, but Brissett isnt the let it rip kind of QB either.

Tip's ankle/leg got shattered attempt to catch a pass from him.

The Vikes

Still seems wishful thinking. JJ has to fail hard ala Zach Wilson.

I said this in the other thread

I would still fire Petzing & trade away Kyler. Not a fan of the boring Kevin Stefanski offense that Petzing is trying to run.

Bring in McDaniel once Miami fires him.

McDaniel did bring in Zach Wilson in Miami. Name to keep an eye out for as a backup whether Kyler stays or not.

 

[Russ Smith]

Maybe he's a good fit with Drew. However, what I saw on the Patriots last year was brutal. Now they didnt have that much talent, but Brissett isnt the let it rip kind of QB either.

Tip's ankle/leg got shattered attempt to catch a pass from him.

Still seems wishful thinking. JJ has to fail hard ala Zach Wilson.


McDaniel did bring in Zach Wilson in Miami. Name to keep an eye out for as a backup whether Kyler stays or not.

My prediction we trade Kyler to Minnesota for McCarthy. We then trade for Shedeur. And I leave the country (-:

I think the Vikes are a longshot for the same reason. How bad would it look to trade for a new QB after letting Darnold walk because they thought JJ was the guy. Another year maybe but now now.

But apparently JJ is back in the lineup now Wentz is out

 

[Shane]

My prediction we trade Kyler to Minnesota for McCarthy. We then trade for Shedeur. And I leave the country (-:

I think the Vikes are a longshot for the same reason. How bad would it look to trade for a new QB after letting Darnold walk because they thought JJ was the guy. Another year maybe but now now.

But apparently JJ is back in the lineup now Wentz is out

They should stay with wentz. def playing better than McCarthy

 

[Russ Smith]

They should stay with wentz. def playing better than McCarthy

Wentz hurt his left shoulder last week, he came back in but there are reports now he might not be able to go this week. I read yesterday that they think McCarthy will go. He is supposed to have a high ankle sprain so I'm a bit skeptical those don't heal quickly but it sounds like he might play Sunday

 

[SoonerLou]

My prediction we trade Kyler to Minnesota for McCarthy. We then trade for Shedeur. And I leave the country (-:

I think the Vikes are a longshot for the same reason. How bad would it look to trade for a new QB after letting Darnold walk because they thought JJ was the guy. Another year maybe but now now.

But apparently JJ is back in the lineup now Wentz is out

Yep.

There is a better chance we cut Kyler and he signs there as a backup w/the hope of playing some day than us trading him there for a 3rd round pick.

 

[PDXChris]

The Vikes

How? Make the numbers make sense!

If the Arizona Cardinals traded Kyler Murray today, they would take a $59.39 million dead cap charge on their 2025 cap. The Cardinals only have.$16 million in space. It's not possible to trade him ir cut him in season.

 

[WisconsinCard]

It's not 50% though. It's 1 year at $62m or 2 years at just under $80m.

I don't think so. I outlined earlier what I believe he's due over the next couple of years. its around 76 mil total, if he earns everything he's due. But next year he would only count 33 mil because the cards are going to have to pay that 17 mil bonus he's due on the fifth day of the new league year, if they want to trade him

 

[kerouac9]

How? Make the numbers make sense!

If the Arizona Cardinals traded Kyler Murray today, they would take a $59.39 million dead cap charge on their 2025 cap. The Cardinals only have.$16 million in space. It's not possible to trade him ir cut him in season.

I don’t think you have that right. If they trade him (according to overthecap) they have $30MM in dead money vs a $43MM 2025 cap hold. They’d save $14MM against the cap, but we’d be treated to Jacoby Brissett for the next 12 games and The Great Unknown for 2026.

 

[SoonerLou]

Ben Allbright
- Coaches feel its more of an execution issue. Admittingly sequencing on play calls and predictable 2nd down runs havent been great. However, there is nothing wrong with the play design.
- Klayton Adams actually splits play calling in Dallas.
- Coaches also feel they dont have the players to truly run the offense the way they'd like.

"Is this a Kyler Murray in this offense problem, is this an offensive coordinator with Kyler Murray problem or is this a Kyler Murray problem? Like with Russell in Denver the coaches are coming around that there are limitations to him"

Kliff came from college and he was more malleable. Drew just how the west coast offense is supposed to be run.

Will update later.

 

[kerouac9]

Coaches also feel they dont have the players to truly run the offense the way they'd like.

Bruh you’ve been here three years you picked all these guys

 

[SoonerLou]

Ben Allbright -
Half a dozen teams will likely be in on Kyler. Jets, Saints and maybe the Raiders stand out the most.
Cards might bring in a west coast offense experienced vet and then draft a young QB like Mendoza, Simpson or Mateer, etc.

Keep an eye on Wes Phillips as an OC, Arthur Smith (Steelers if he's fired), Stefanski (if he's fired), etc
@DVontel



Both Kyler and Petzing are likely gone if things dont change around, but they do have hope it can still work.

 

[oaken1]

I don't put much stock in this play.

Seeing that live my first thought was "WTF kyler?"
It gave the impression of a guy who wanted to stay clear of the scrum but give the impression he was trying...it looked to be an obvious flop...seeing it again doesn't really shed light on anything to change that impression

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

Ben Allbright
- Coaches feel its more of an execution issue. Admittingly sequencing on play calls and predictable 2nd down runs havent been great. However, there is nothing wrong with the play design.
- Klayton Adams actually splits play calling in Dallas.
- Coaches also feel they dont have the players to truly run the offense the way they'd like.

"Is this a Kyler Murray in this offense problem, is this an offensive coordinator with Kyler Murray problem or is this a Kyler Murray problem. Like with Russell in Denver the coaches are coming around that there are limitations to him"

Will update later.

All signs point to it being a Kyler problem. He doesn't play on time. He will never be comfortable in a pocket. He's not a leader. According to Klayton Adams, he doesn't even want to do designed runs, because he's terrified of contact. His mental limitations are too great to overcome in seemingly any offense. There's a reason the team didn't put the ball in his hands with the game on the line.