What should be the asking price be for Hollywood?(Carolina)

[Cheesebeef]

Maybe I missed it, but I don't recall anyone railing against signing them. I think it was more a matter of understanding why the team didn't sign them, trusting the judgment of (or at least bring willing to give the benefit of the doubt to) the new FO, and not being mad about it.

Whereas, I do recall some people railing against the fact that the team didn't sign those two. And then some of the people in the first category argued with the people in the second, because, ASFN!

But was anyone really arguing vehemently before free agency that Allen and Murphy should NOT be re-signed?

Dave, despite your youthful looks, I think you’re starting to lose your mind.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I don't follow the reasoning that if we don't trade him we then have to sign him as free agent. Why? We all like Dobbs now and want to see what Kyler does in the same offense with the same tools. Dobbs appears to really trust Brown and he is the main target along with Ertz. No, I don't want to "evaluate Moore or Dortch" with more snaps because this is a football season not training camp. It's not fair to the QB room to weaken the WR corps. Nothing wrong with playing out the string with him and seeing what's up at the end of the season.

We don’t “have to sign him” if we don’t trade him. I just think if we don’t trade him and let him walk, we’re just blowing an asset and getting pretty much nothing back for the 1st round pick we blew on him.

If Kyler is worth 50 million bucks per year, he should be able to show some level of success with a Hollywoodless squad, IMO. He’s got what’s a surprisingly good offensive line, a good WR with Wilson, a good running game and RB out of the backfield to throw to. And two average TE. If he’s a franchise guy, he should be able to elevate that group around him. Is it ideal circumstances? No.

Eh… to be honest, if we need to keep Hollywood for the rest of the season tk give Kyler best chance to prove himself, I get the argument.

I just think it’s beyond stupid to eat up a huge chunk of cap space to a #2 small WR, who doesn’t bring anything special to the table.

 

[BirdGangThing]

Do they have a WR dollars per catch scale anywhere? Factoring in salaries and production?

Let's say some cat signs for 15 million guaranteed 1 year - if he only caught 1 pass his DPC would be 15 million

 

[WindCardinal]

If we get out of the MHJ sweepstakes I think resigning Hollywood is a must. Either way I think franchise tag is a must as well whether trading him or not. We cannot afford to let assets go at this point. Especially not ones that we had to give up a 1st rounder for.

 

[BritCard]

That’s just it. A guy who’s only cracked had more than 768 yards receiving ONCE in his career isn’t a high-end free agent, IMO.

And teams that treat him as such will regret paying it.

But even if that WAS market value for a Hollywood Brown, it still wouldn’t explain the complete 180 by posters here who want to waste that money there but railed against signing Allen and Murphy even though BOTH got BELOW what those posters said they would and ended up with reasonable deals when all was said and done.

I've not seen anyone say we should sign Brown. Just clarified what his market rate is and that there is still a lot of the season left to see how he fits in this system.

I don't think using his past stats applies much in Brown's case. He spent the first 3 years in the Ravens system that was very run and TE heavy and still managed to have a 1000 yard season.

He would have had a 1000 yard season last year had he not missed games due to Woolen falling on his ankle. And that's the only real time he's missed so he isn't injury prone.

And he's tracking for 1000 yards this year too so far. That's nearly 60 yards per game on average over a 3 year span. That's something teams covet.

I agree I don't really want to spend $20m on that though. But it's a close call, he's not the garbage people make out. It's a 45/55 thing.

 

[BritCard]

But was anyone really arguing vehemently before free agency that Allen and Murphy should NOT be re-signed?

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[Phrazbit]

If we get out of the MHJ sweepstakes I think resigning Hollywood is a must. Either way I think franchise tag is a must as well whether trading him or not. We cannot afford to let assets go at this point. Especially not ones that we had to give up a 1st rounder for.

Why?

This is a perfect example of the sunk cost fallacy.

The first rounder is gone... it ain't coming back. Overpaying for mediocrity only compounds the mistake, furthermore, that mistake was made by Keim, this front office has no obligation to try and make good on Steve's screw ups.

He is somewhat of an asset right now, get what you can for him. If we end up paying 20+ million for him, he is no longer an asset... within a year or 2 he is yet another contract that we are crunching the math on the cap hit for when we have to dump him.

 

[schutd]

The “deranged” comments always crack me up.

GUYS. He can HEEEEAAAAAARRRRR you!

 

[schutd]

Maybe I missed it, but I don't recall anyone railing against signing them. I think it was more a matter of understanding why the team didn't sign them, trusting the judgment of (or at least bring willing to give the benefit of the doubt to) the new FO, and not being mad about it.

Whereas, I do recall some people railing against the fact that the team didn't sign those two. And then some of the people in the first category argued with the people in the second, because, ASFN!

But was anyone really arguing vehemently before free agency that Allen and Murphy should NOT be re-signed?

There was a level at which certain posters decided the cost would outpace the value, so people were concerned that the Cards would over pay in order to keep, and we were opposed to THAT. Not to re signing them. They ended up getting deals LESS than that threshold, and as far as I remember, didnt both players chose to forgo better deals here to sign where they did? If thats true, it speaks more to the history of this dumb franchise, and less about the new regime who tried to keep them here while not allowing that effort to disrupt the overall plan.

But then that belief is FAR too moderate, and likely based in reality, and therefore cannot be vociferously argued between middle aged men with a strong need to be correct all the time.

 

[schutd]

If we get out of the MHJ sweepstakes I think resigning Hollywood is a must. Either way I think franchise tag is a must as well whether trading him or not. We cannot afford to let assets go at this point. Especially not ones that we had to give up a 1st rounder for.

Franchise Tag? For Hollywood Brown? Youd be willing to pay him top 5 money?

 

[CardNots]

My guess we won’t spend foolishly during the upcoming free agency period.

 

[ajcardfan]

We don’t “have to sign him” if we don’t trade him. I just think if we don’t trade him and let him walk, we’re just blowing an asset and getting pretty much nothing back for the 1st round pick we blew on him.

If Kyler is worth 50 million bucks per year, he should be able to show some level of success with a Hollywoodless squad, IMO. He’s got what’s a surprisingly good offensive line, a good WR with Wilson, a good running game and RB out of the backfield to throw to. And two average TE. If he’s a franchise guy, he should be able to elevate that group around him. Is it ideal circumstances? No.

Eh… to be honest, if we need to keep Hollywood for the rest of the season tk give Kyler best chance to prove himself, I get the argument.

I just think it’s beyond stupid to eat up a huge chunk of cap space to a #2 small WR, who doesn’t bring anything special to the table.

I agree a gigantic contract is not appropriate at this time. But at the end of the year, he can be one of the options considered. He has played well so far this year, he might wind up with a big year. If so, he will get a Kirk-like contract somewhere. Monti can decide if he is worth it then.

 

[Garthshort]

Two things:
1. We should, like most teams, have at least one highly paid WR on the roster.
2. Seems that next year's draft is WR rich, which should impact what FA WR's are paid.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Franchise Tag? For Hollywood Brown? Youd be willing to pay him top 5 money?

Not me. That's a bridge too far.

 

[CardNots]

Do you think any of our defensive coaches feel if they were playing against our offense they would need to scheme for Hollywood? If the answer is no then Brown isn’t even worth top 10 WR money regardless of the going rate.

 

[Harry]

I initially thought a second round pick would motivate me to trade. However, his recent performance makes me think I’d first trade to extend him. If Ossenfort makes no such effort, but does trade him, Ossenfort is tanking.

 

[BullheadCardFan]

Now I'm really ready to trade him

What difference does it make to have him on the team when Dobbs can't even throw the ball accurately?

Put him on the market and see what we get for offers

 

[BirdGangThing]

Now I'm really ready to trade him

What difference does it make to have him on the team when Dobbs can't even throw the ball accurately?

Put him on the market and see what we get for offers

It just makes good business sense

 

[Chopper0080]

It is still Brian Burns. Round 1 is a lot easier with Burns on the roster vs Brown. Gets us a legit player on the defensive front to start building around.

 

[kerouac9]

It is still Brian Burns. Round 1 is a lot easier with Burns on the roster vs Brown. Gets us a legit player on the defensive front to start building around.

Do you re-sign him to a mega-deal?

 

[bankybruce]

Two things:
1. We should, like most teams, have at least one highly paid WR on the roster.
2. Seems that next year's draft is WR rich, which should impact what FA WR's are paid.

The Chiefs highest cap hit last year at WR was $4 million. Kelce was only $8 million.

In 2021, Kupp was the highest Rams WR at $5 million.

The both Super Bowls with cheap WRs.

 

[WindCardinal]

The Chiefs highest cap hit last year at WR was $4 million. Kelce was only $8 million.

In 2021, Kupp was the highest Rams WR at $5 million.

The both Super Bowls with cheap WRs.

The rams just happened to have a low cap hit on him at this point in time. Kupp is currently a top 5 receiver in terms of salary?

 

[bankybruce]

The rams just happened to have a low cap hit on him at this point in time. Kupp is currently a top 5 receiver in terms of salary?

And how are the Rams and Kupp doing? They ain't winning a super bowl this year, that's for sure.

The Dolphins top 2 WRs account for less than $20 million in cap space.


Draft smart and then move on unless they are generational WR talent.

 

[Cheesebeef]

And how are the Rams and Kupp doing? They ain't winning a super bowl this year, that's for sure.

The Dolphins top 2 WRs account for less than $20 million in cap space.


Draft smart and move then on unless they are generational WR talent.

This.

 

[Chopper0080]

Do you re-sign him to a mega-deal?

Sure do