2021-22 Around the NBA Thread

[1Sun]

If that trade is made though then they start expanding the list of who would be a candidate to fill a roster spot since they'd have more depth upfront.

And the longer they wait, the less likely they are to find an NBA worthy player to fill it.

 

[Hoop Head]

The offer to Joe Johnson was anything but fair. It was a lowball, just as Sarver lowballed Bridges and Ayton this offseason. (And I don't think Ayton deserves the Max, but 5 years $125 million when he is eligible for 5 years $168 million is ridiculous.)

And Michael Finley was in Dallas.

And the similarity is that both times we had a team on the cusp of a championship, and instead to going for it, Sarver sat back and penny-pinched...which is why we have an open roster spot, no two-way contracts, a partially unused MLE, an entirely unused BAE and no application for a Disabled Player Exception

So you're back to making things up? A team can only offer a 5 year extension coming out of a rookie contract if its a max deal. So you're lying or pedaling false information.

Nothing you say has any credibility.

 

[Ronin]

No, they offered Joe Johnson $5M less than Joe Johnson requested, and Sarver wouldn't budge. And yes it was before his breakout season, but everyone could see that breakout season coming. Sarver was just too damn conservative...as always. Then by the time Joe Johnson predictably earned his Max contract, he predictably wanted no part of Sarver, so Sarver couldn't match it even if he wanted to (which of course he didn't).

I had really hoped Sarver had learned his lesson. I was praying heading into this offseason that Sarver would indeed learn from his past mistakes and not repeat them. With how this season went, with millions left on the table unspent and still no power forward, that hope is now long gone.

Sarver will do just enough to sell seats, but he will never do what it takes to win a championship.

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[Mainstreet]

If that trade is made though then they start expanding the list of who would be a candidate to fill a roster spot since they'd have more depth upfront.

I agree, if the Saric-Smith trade is made for Young, it leaves the Suns flexibility to improve the team at any position with the open roster spot.

I do hate the idea of giving up on Stix though. The Suns likely won't see a good draft pick like the 10th pick for awhile.

 

[GatorAZ]

No, they offered Joe Johnson $5M less than Joe Johnson requested, and Sarver wouldn't budge. And yes it was before his breakout season, but everyone could see that breakout season coming. Sarver was just too damn conservative...as always. Then by the time Joe Johnson predictably earned his Max contract, he predictably wanted no part of Sarver, so Sarver couldn't match it even if he wanted to (which of course he didn't).

I had really hoped Sarver had learned his lesson. I was praying heading into this offseason that Sarver would indeed learn from his past mistakes and not repeat them. With how this season went, with millions left on the table unspent and still no power forward, that hope is now long gone.

Sarver will do just enough to sell seats, but he will never do what it takes to win a championship.

You’re right it wasn’t a max offer but how is offering a player $5m less than he’s asking not “fair”? Not saying it wasn’t silly to come up that short but back then it was still a large offer for a non-established young player.

 

[Mainstreet]

Robert Sarver made a mistake in not extending Joe Johnson a year earlier. He has admitted such.

Phoenix Suns owner Robert Sarver applies lessons learned over 10 years

Ten years ago, the Suns were undergoing the second ownership change in franchise history when Jerry Colangelo weighed two leading bidders aiming to succeed him as the franchise's managing partner.

www.azcentral.com

 

[Hoop Head]

I agree, if the Saric-Smith trade is made for Young, it leaves the Suns flexibility to improve the team at any position with the open roster spot.

I do hate the idea of giving up on Stix though. The Suns likely won't see a good draft pick like the 10th pick for awhile.

I think Stix will have his chance to start the year as backup PF and if he can't cut it, they'll make a deal. That gives him a chance to play and develop and if it doesn't work, we'll have plenty of time to figure something out. As we saw with the Torrey Craig acquisition last year, good things can come to those that wait.

 

[Mainstreet]

I think Stix will have his chance to start the year as backup PF and if he can't cut it, they'll make a deal. That gives him a chance to play and develop and if it doesn't work, we'll have plenty of time to figure something out. As we saw with the Torrey Craig acquisition last year, good things can come to those that wait.

Stix developing into a player this season is the best possible outcome. He could be the Suns future starting power forward and Saric would return for the 2022-23 season. Also the Suns could strengthen the team this coming season with a bought out player.

 

[1Sun]

So you're back to making things up? A team can only offer a 5 year extension coming out of a rookie contract if its a max deal. So you're lying or pedaling false information.

Nothing you say has any credibility.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.azcentral.com/story/sports/nba/suns/2021/07/24/should-phoenix-suns-give-deandre-ayton-max-rookie-extension-168-million/8079719002/&ved=2ahUKEwjd99Pt7uvyAhVVFjQIHUdyCa4QFnoECAQQBQ&usg=AOvVaw09r0B-yW7angOtr8NU2JKM

 

[1Sun]

I think Stix will have his chance to start the year as backup PF and if he can't cut it, they'll make a deal. That gives him a chance to play and develop and if it doesn't work, we'll have plenty of time to figure something out. As we saw with the Torrey Craig acquisition last year, good things can come to those that wait.

We already saw in Summer League, not to mention the G League last year, that Stix can't cut it. A front court player who shoots a putrid 36.5% while looking awkward as hell, turning the ball over constantly and incapable of defending is not the answer at power forward. He has zero physical coordination. If he gets any meaningful playing time at all, it will cost us games and likely at least home court in the first round of the playoffs.

 

[1Sun]

Stix developing into a player this season is the best possible outcome. He could be the Suns future starting power forward and Saric would return for the 2022-23 season. Also the Suns could strengthen the team this coming season with a bought out player.

Fair enough. But if he plays like he did in the G League last year and in the Summer League this year, it could cause the entire team to implode. As in miss the playoffs, CP3/Booker/Ayton all asking out, this team repeating the decade before last season implode. (And for those saying "but Booker has multiple years left on his deal", look no further than what is happening at this very minute with Ben Simmons.)

Not at all worth that risk, in my opinion. Stix has not shown anywhere near enough to warrant taking it. And it's not for lack of effort on Stix's part. He just has a strange physical composition, where his upper body is disproportionate to his lower body, no matter how much work he puts in the weight room. I believe that is what accounts for his very poor physical coordination and awkward gait.

 

[Mainstreet]

Players can improve. Christian Wood didn't look good when he worked out for the Suns.

 

[Hoop Head]

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.azcentral.com/story/sports/nba/suns/2021/07/24/should-phoenix-suns-give-deandre-ayton-max-rookie-extension-168-million/8079719002/&ved=2ahUKEwjd99Pt7uvyAhVVFjQIHUdyCa4QFnoECAQQBQ&usg=AOvVaw09r0B-yW7angOtr8NU2JKM

A link to a 2 month old article asking if he's worth the max doesn't support a thing you said.

 

[1Sun]

A link to a 2 month old article asking if he's worth the max doesn't support a thing you said.

That article said he was eligible for 5 years, $168 million.

 

[Hoop Head]

That article said he was eligible for 5 years, $168 million.

Yeah, that's the max. You said Sarver low balled him by offering 5 years and $125 million. Have a source for that? Its a figure that can't even be offered because unless its for the max annually, 25% of the cap, then the longest extension the Suns can offer is 4 years. So your claim Sarver has low balled both Ayton and Mikal is wrong.

 

[1Sun]

Robert Sarver made a mistake in not extending Joe Johnson a year earlier. He has admitted such.

Phoenix Suns owner Robert Sarver applies lessons learned over 10 years

Ten years ago, the Suns were undergoing the second ownership change in franchise history when Jerry Colangelo weighed two leading bidders aiming to succeed him as the franchise's managing partner.

www.azcentral.com

And he's about to make the same mistake with Mikal Bridges.

 

[1Sun]

Yeah, that's the max. You said Sarver low balled him by offering 5 years and $125 million. Have a source for that? Its a figure that can't even be offered because unless its for the max annually, 25% of the cap, then the longest extension the Suns can offer is 4 years. So your claim Sarver has low balled both Ayton and Mikal is wrong.

It was reported on Burns and Gambo a few weeks ago. They were pleading on the air for Sarver at least to offer in the $140M to $150M range.

 

[1Sun]

Players can improve. Christian Wood didn't look good when he worked out for the Suns.

We don't have the luxury of the time to find out, with only a 2 year window with CP3 (not to mention having to demonstrate to Booker that we won't return to the pre-CP3 days after those two years), especially given how awkward and uncoordinated Stix looked against bad competition in Summer League. He basically looks like they took Shaq's upper body and attached it to Manute Bol's lower body. And that's not a matter of getting "good". It's a matter of changing a physique that appears to be unchangeable.

 

[Mainstreet]

The Suns do have a roster spot available without trading Saric or Stix. If they can fill it with the right player there may be no need for a trade.

Admittedly it's like a poker game. No one knows what cards the other teams will play.

Some in the media have speculated that Thad Young only wants to play for Phoenix.

 

[Hoop Head]

It was reported on Burns and Gambo a few weeks ago. They were pleading on the air for Sarver at least to offer in the $140M to $150M range.

That says to me the source is full of it since they don't even know what can be offered. You putting your trust in a source like that says a lot about you too but we all know that you're prone to making things up to bash the Suns so its not a real surprise.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The Suns offered JJ $5m less than max. How is that not fair? Keep in mind this is before his breakout year with Nash/D’Antoni.

Also: https://www.espn.com/nba/columns/story?columnist=stein_marc&id=2147720

this is totally wrong. They offered him 5 for 45 when he wanted 5 for 50 the summer of 2004. He wasn’t offered anything NEAR the Max in that 2004 off-season... and he broke out in 2003-4 when he really came on in the second half of the year averaging 19/5/5 once Marbury was traded.

let’s not litigate this again. Server blew that one by haggling over 1 mill per year for a guy who took a MASSIVE leap from Season 1 to 2 and getting him at that salary would have been a coup. We blew it, it soured the relationship and the next summer JJ was offered the boffo contact from the Hawks.

It happened. It blew. Let’s move on.

 

[Cheesebeef]

You’re right it wasn’t a max offer but how is offering a player $5m less than he’s asking not “fair”? Not saying it wasn’t silly to come up that short but back then it was still a large offer for a non-established young player.

this is one point 1Sun is just right on. There were plenty of people who were furious at the time Sarver pinched those pennies. It happened. Move on if you don’t remember what was actually happening at the time.

 

[1Sun]

this is totally wrong. They offered him 5 for 45 when he wanted 5 for 50 the summer of 2004. He wasn’t offered anything NEAR the Max in that 2004 off-season... and he broke out in 2003-4 when he really came on in the second half of the year averaging 19/5/5 once Marbury was traded.

let’s not litigate this again. Server blew that one by haggling over 1 mill per year for a guy who took a MASSIVE leap from Season 1 to 2 and getting him at that salary would have been a coup. We blew it, it soured the relationship and the next summer JJ was offered the boffo contact from the Hawks.

It happened. It blew. Let’s move on.

I hope we can, but my concern is that history is now repeating itself, including with Ayton and Bridges.

 

[1Sun]

That says to me the source is full of it since they don't even know what can be offered. You putting your trust in a source like that says a lot about you too but we all know that you're prone to making things up to bash the Suns so its not a real surprise.

Well, they were spot on regarding Payton and McGee...

 

[Phrazbit]

That says to me the source is full of it since they don't even know what can be offered. You putting your trust in a source like that says a lot about you too but we all know that you're prone to making things up to bash the Suns so its not a real surprise.

Nah, I doubt Gambo and Burns ever said it. 1Sun has a habit of "hearing" things on the radio that either were never said or totally misconstrued.