What happened to Isaiah Simmons?

[Zeno]

Question (not) criticizing mind you but Simmons is just about the same size as one Adrian Wilson isnt he? Would that not be a ideal position for him I really dont know of Budda is playing there right now is the reason why I'm asking cant watch any football due to work Dang it!!!

He's a little taller than AW and really about the same size as Daryl Washington...more athletic than both. I think after last weeks schooling they are going to bring him along slower than they had anticipated, a normal offseason might have helped him grow faster but who knows for sure.

 

[Totally_Red]

Extend Devonte Campbell and convert Isaiah to a strong safety in the Cam Chancellor mold. The dude has the size, speed and physicality to be an elite safety eventually IMO.

 

[AZCB34]

Calling the kid a "bust" 2 games in to his NFL career is nonsense.

How long have you been posting on this board? Isn't that kind of what we do?

 

[blindseyed]

These are funny threads lol

 

[Arz101]

Let's see what Simmons can and cannot do in the next 14 weeks. Simmons didn't have a preseason either.

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[Delmar M Lewis]

He's a little taller than AW and really about the same size as Daryl Washington...more athletic than both. I think after last weeks schooling they are going to bring him along slower than they had anticipated, a normal offseason might have helped him grow faster but who knows for sure.

I think your absolutely right I remember Denny Green saying after we drafted a guy "He is just a football player" maybe that's what Simmons is Just a Really good football player in time

 

[Southpaw]

The defense he played on at Clemson is what created the hype. Those were monster defenses and Brent Venables was able to create havoc with Simmons. He was a man without a true position and lined up all over the field. He spotlighted when they turned him loose and he was unaccounted for. I don't think that will work in the NFL. He needs to learn one position. This year will be tough on him. It was a risky pick that may or may not turn out well.

 

[Chopper0080]

Calling the kid a "bust" 2 games in to his NFL career is nonsense.

Except that no one is...

 

[Chopper0080]

Extend Devonte Campbell and convert Isaiah to a strong safety in the Cam Chancellor mold. The dude has the size, speed and physicality to be an elite safety eventually IMO.

This is what I thought the plan was originally when they drafted him. Doesn't seem to be the case.

 

[Chopper0080]

Let's see what Simmons can and cannot do in the next 14 weeks. Simmons didn't have a preseason either.

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Here is the point...

the Cardinals are essentially saying that they drafted this freak athlete and game wrecker, and yet over the course of time since the NFL draft, they can't find ANY WAY for him to have an impact and find the field. There isn't anything he can do that is better than Reddick or Kennard or Banjo. He is essentially a Vallejo or Fitts level player in terms of what they can find for him to do. That is embarrassing.

 

[Cheesebeef]

man... i was over the moon with this pick in the draft and loved him in college, but it's two games... where he's playing on what's been a VERY GOOD D so far. I'm never one to hold back on criticizing a guy, but sheesh... i think y'all are getting at this pretty damn early.

 

[Chopper0080]

man... i was over the moon with this pick in the draft and loved him in college, but it's two games... where he's playing on what's been a VERY GOOD D so far. I'm never one to hold back on criticizing a guy, but sheesh... i think y'all are getting at this pretty damn early.

Personally, it is more of an indictment of Steve Keim and Vance Joseph than Simmons. It seems they had no real clue what the hell they were going to do with Simmons.

They aren't playing him man-to-man with TEs.

They aren't using him as a free defender in the middle of the defense to run and tackle.

They aren't using him as a chess piece pass rusher.

Those were all the things he did well at Clemson and yet our defense can't find a way to ena ble him to do one of them? They cannot find any use for a dude who is 6'4 and 238 lbs who runs a 4.3 40? That is a joke.

 

[Arz101]

Fans expect too much.

Kevin Minter, Buccanon, Reddick and now Simmons, have you guys learned nothing?

 

[Chopper0080]

If our defense has no place for freak athletes who are chess pieces then I would question why the hell we drafted him.

If the Cardinals were looking to draft a polished and instinctual ILB, they got the wrong guy. Simmons was never that player.

It just looks like another Deone Bucannon/Haason Reddick type move at this point. (and again, I don't blame the player. They are just trying to do what they are being asked to do.)

 

[Cheesebeef]

Personally, it is more of an indictment of Steve Keim and Vance Joseph than Simmons. It seems they had no real clue what the hell they were going to do with Simmons.

They aren't playing him man-to-man with TEs.

They aren't using him as a free defender in the middle of the defense to run and tackle.

They aren't using him as a chess piece pass rusher.

Those were all the things he did well at Clemson and yet our defense can't find a way to ena ble him to do one of them? They cannot find any use for a dude who is 6'4 and 238 lbs who runs a 4.3 40? That is a joke.

that's fair.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Fans expect too much.

Kevin Minter, Buccanon, Reddick and now Simmons, have you guys learned nothing?

what were supposed to learn about Minter and Buccannon who were both weak links of the D and now I think completely washed out of the league?

 

[Chopper0080]

For those who think I am crazy...

Deone Bucannon never demanded to play ILB. He was never reported as not being a hard worker. He never said, draft me in round 1. It's not his fault that he was over-drafted and not put in a position to be successful. That is on the team.

Haason Reddick is the exact same thing. I have never been a Reddick fan, but it has never been an effort issue with him. Everything that has been shared has been that he is doing what he can to fit the role he has been given.

Andy Isabella. Dude couldn't get off press at the Senior Bowl, was an inefficient route runner and has tiny hands. He didn't get asked to move outside. He did what he was told and, shockingly *sarcasm*, he struggled.

Byron Murphy is very similar. They drafted dude to play the slot and instead of getting a vet to play outside and protect him, they moved him outside and fed him to the wolves. That is what happens when you put players in positions to fail.

Someone tell me how the treatment of Isaiah Simmons to date is any different from these situations other than that he is more athletically talented than these other players. This is what a flawed process looks like.

 

[AZCrazy]

Dammit! Simmons will be fine. He's a rook with no camp or preseason at all, and he has the actual benefit of playing behind Devondre Campbell, who's been playing out of his mind the first two weeks. Our best defender right now.

I say if we re-sign Campbell and he keeps dominating, make Simmons and Baker your safeties and with Peterson and Kirkpatrick as your corners, that's a serious secondary.

 

[Chopper0080]

Dammit! Simmons will be fine. He's a rook with no camp or preseason at all, and he has the actual benefit of playing behind Devondre Campbell, who's been playing out of his mind the first two weeks. Our best defender right now.

I say if we re-sign Campbell and he keeps dominating, make Simmons and Baker your safeties and with Peterson and Kirkpatrick as your corners, that's a serious secondary.

This is what denial looks like.

A one-year, prove it FA signing relegates our #8 player drafted overall to a position change? That doesn't sound like something you do when you draft a freak athlete and a guy who is going to revolutionize the position. It sounds like something you do when you draft a swiss army knife to be a phillips head screwdriver and find out that a ratcheting phillips head screw driver fills that role better because, you know, it was designed to be a phillips head screw driver.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

For those who think I am crazy...

Deone Bucannon never demanded to play ILB. He was never reported as not being a hard worker. He never said, draft me in round 1. It's not his fault that he was over-drafted and not put in a position to be successful. That is on the team.

Haason Reddick is the exact same thing. I have never been a Reddick fan, but it has never been an effort issue with him. Everything that has been shared has been that he is doing what he can to fit the role he has been given.

Andy Isabella. Dude couldn't get off press at the Senior Bowl, was an inefficient route runner and has tiny hands. He didn't get asked to move outside. He did what he was told and, shockingly *sarcasm*, he struggled.

Byron Murphy is very similar. They drafted dude to play the slot and instead of getting a vet to play outside and protect him, they moved him outside and fed him to the wolves. That is what happens when you put players in positions to fail.

Someone tell me how the treatment of Isaiah Simmons to date is any different from these situations other than that he is more athletically talented than these other players. This is what a flawed process looks like.

So what exactly is it that you believe is wrong with the process? Isabella for instance was almost certainly someone that Kliff really wanted and had a plan for.

As to the defensive players 2 of them were drafted for DCs that we no longer have and the other 2 were drafted for this DC.

So are you saying that the coordinators just don't know how to utilize the players or that Kiem is simply drafting the wrong players for the system that's in place?

That being said, Simmons is still a bit different from the rest in the sense that he didn't get crap for an off-season and it would be foolish to not consider that before writing him off as some sort of FO mistake.

 

[Chopper0080]

I am pretty sure the the 25 total snaps played is the lowest played by any top 15 player drafted this year outside of Tua.

 

[Chopper0080]

So what exactly is it that you believe is wrong with the process? Isabella for instance was almost certainly someone that Kliff really wanted and had a plan for.

As to the defensive players 2 of them were drafted for DCs that we no longer have and the other 2 were drafted for this DC.

So are you saying that the coordinators just don't know how to utilize the players or that Kiem is simply drafting the wrong players for the system that's in place?

That being said, Simmons is still a bit different from the rest in the sense that he didn't get **** for an off-season and it would be foolish to not consider that before writing him off as some sort of FO mistake.

Isabella was a roster construction and scouting mistake. Of course Kliff loved him as a prospect, he does a lot of things Kliff likes. The issue was that if you accurately scouted Isabella, he has to play in the slot. We already have Kirk and Fitz who play in the slot and you aren't going to take established players and put them in situations where they are less impactful, so Isabella didn't have a place to play that used his strengths. As a GM, you need to tell your HC that the prospect is solid, but the role is not. Let's get a guy who plays best outside so Kirk and Fitz can do those great things inside.

With Reddick...sorry coach, I know you love this guy but he is too small to play outside and too inexperienced to play inside. Let's trade back if we really want him or take someone who fits our scheme better.

Murphy...let's sign a free agent to play outside so we can focus on keeping this guy to the role we drafted him for.

Deonne...either I know we need an ILB but this guy is a safety OR I know we need a S but this guy struggles in space so we will need to play him at LB.

We are an absolute crap show at identifying players to fit roles or having plans on how to adjust our scheme to fit what THEY do best.

 

[Chopper0080]

Maybe this will help those who are struggling with this (and yes, I know the timeline does not match up but the point in solid).

You don't draft Brian Urlacher to be Luke Keuchly. You draft Brian Urlacher because he is Brian Urlacher. If your scheme isn't built for Brian Urlacher, don't draft him. If your scheme needs Luke Keuchly, draft Luke Keuchly.

We drafted a SUV and are struggling (as a coaching staff) because it doesn't hold as many people as a miny van, it can't tow like a truck and it doesn't get the gas mileage of a hybrid.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Maybe this will help those who are struggling with this (and yes, I know the timeline does not match up but the point in solid).

You don't draft Brian Urlacher to be Luke Keuchly. You draft Brian Urlacher because he is Brian Urlacher. If your scheme isn't built for Brian Urlacher, don't draft him. If your scheme needs Luke Keuchly, draft Luke Keuchly.

We drafted a SUV and are struggling (as a coaching staff) because it doesn't hold as many people as a miny van, it can't tow like a truck and it doesn't get the gas mileage of a hybrid.

I'm not worried yet. I think they need to find a "joker" role for him. Let him play out in space like a S/LB hybrid that he is.

I'd also like to see him subbing out as a OLB. Give him some of the snaps that Fitts would get.

 

[BigRedRage]

I mean, we have the blueprint for $lb. We also have the blueprint for honey badger and Budda Baker. Why this guy is not getting the same treatment positionally, especially as the ladder two is beyond me.