PFF Loved College Murray, Disappointed In Pro Murray

[kerouac9]

https://www.pff.com/news/2019-rookies-most-likely-to-make-a-big-jump-in-2020

I'm a huge critic of PFF and don't believe in their grading system. A lot of people here aren't and do, though, so I'm interested in how they end up squaring this circle.

Jeepers. I didn't see this in the runup to the Super Bowl:

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-best-quarterbacks-ahead-of-super-bowl-liv

 

[Dr. Jones]

I run hot and cold on PFF grading. Kyler does have a ton of progress to make and history has shown that it's the next 12 to 24 months that will be the most important for him.

Reducing self-inflicted sacks, and getting back into a place where he is protecting the ball while making the trows that he is best at are key.

His accuracy makes the sky the limit though. No reason he can't have a Lamar Jackson style rise up the rankings if Kliff, Kugler, & Vance turns in the type of season I hope for.

 

[Proximo]

It's pretty simple really. Adjusting to the NFL is hard and takes time.

I think he was a bottom 10 qb performance wise last season, it's only right PFF sees it that way. But he still showed a lot of promise for a rookie. He didn't even learn how to run the ball till over half way through the season. With a year of familiarity and adding Hopkins, I expect his performance to improve greatly in year two.

 

[Weenus O'Baggins]

https://www.pff.com/news/2019-rookies-most-likely-to-make-a-big-jump-in-2020

I'm a huge critic of PFF and don't believe in their grading system. A lot of people here aren't and do, though, so I'm interested in how they end up squaring this circle.

Jeepers. I didn't see this in the runup to the Super Bowl:

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-best-quarterbacks-ahead-of-super-bowl-liv

I appreciate that they don't try to back up their prior rankings with current rankings.

 

[MadCardDisease]

LOL

PFF when you are "wrong you are right"

 

[Finito]

It’s hit and miss. I don’t care how well you throw the ball you can’t throw 30 ints and fumble 5 times and be higher than guys like Murray.

it’s not a coincidence that guys like Baker, Murray, Darnold, Minshew and Allen both of them are all kind of grouped together. Like it was said before the jump from college to the NFL at QB is really hard

 

[Solar7]

Yep, it'll be a crucial season, and I didn't think he was as good last season as many did.

But he now has the best WR in the NFL, a defense that should make him press a little less (guy was playing hero ball all last year), and two improved assets on the OL in Gilbert and Jones that should give him comfortable room to improve.

This topic's title feels a little misleading. It seems PFF expects him to advance dramatically, even though his rookie year left a lot out there. I don't think he'll enter the top 5 of QBs, but he could push his way into the top 10, and barring a major disappointment, should be top-15.

 

[Rain Man]

PFF

Gee it's good news sometimes. Sometimes not but I can say KM won the rookie of the year.

It's a tough division and trying our best to build and compete is only a bar raised to the rest of the league. Murray was poised and yes he tried to do too much. His arm strength is unbelievable along with his accuracy. I haven't seen him get pissed yet though and it will happen. I'm sure he will remain a pro and shut them up.

I wanted to keep Rosen and draft Bosa. But I'm not a front office personnel and I'm sure PFF isn't either.

 

[TaylorSwift]

I dont know any SB winning team that values PFF

 

[Jetstream Green]

I dont know any SB winning team that values PFF

I do not care for the stat game either but your comment is precarious unless you can confirm something and maybe you can... tell me how many people which you are on speaking terms with who are part of these Super Bowl organizations which allows you to glean this assertion

 

[SoonerLou]

https://www.pff.com/news/2019-rookies-most-likely-to-make-a-big-jump-in-2020

I'm a huge critic of PFF and don't believe in their grading system. A lot of people here aren't and do, though, so I'm interested in how they end up squaring this circle.

Jeepers. I didn't see this in the runup to the Super Bowl:

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-best-quarterbacks-ahead-of-super-bowl-liv

Not big on PFF, but I think his low grade is simply because of him constantly taking sacks and we didnt really run much of Kliff's offense. A lot of dink and dunks doesnt help your PFF grade.

Baker Mayfield for example made way more "big time throws" rookie year. A lot stemming from play action passes off a great run game. Run action (under center) opens up plays like that.

Our current offense didnt really allow for that and we really couldnt stretch the defense that much.

The thing in college was able he was able to escape so many potential sacks and turn them into plays. He hasnt done that much in the NFL. Its why I wanted to really upgrade the Oline. Unless he develops the ability to manuever around a mediocre Oline I dont see a major improvement....next season.

I run hot and cold on PFF grading. Kyler does have a ton of progress to make and history has shown that it's the next 12 to 24 months that will be the most important for him.

Reducing self-inflicted sacks, and getting back into a place where he is protecting the ball while making the trows that he is best at are key.

His accuracy makes the sky the limit though. No reason he can't have a Lamar Jackson style rise up the rankings if Kliff, Kugler, & Vance turns in the type of season I hope for.

Lamar's Oline was VERY GOOD last year. We cant overlook this. We played the longterm game with Simmons. However, as good as Hopkins is I havent seem Kyler be Deshaun Watson like dynamic enough make elusive/climb the pocket throws to overcome a below average Oline...next season. I mean I hope Kyler improves, but we got a lot riding on our interior (Cole) and RT...not to mention hoping DJ actually keeps staying healthy.

Yep, it'll be a crucial season, and I didn't think he was as good last season as many did.

But he now has the best WR in the NFL, a defense that should make him press a little less (guy was playing hero ball all last year), and two improved assets on the OL in Gilbert and Jones that should give him comfortable room to improve.

This topic's title feels a little misleading. It seems PFF expects him to advance dramatically, even though his rookie year left a lot out there. I don't think he'll enter the top 5 of QBs, but he could push his way into the top 10, and barring a major disappointment, should be top-15.

I actually think he did match his hype because I dont think the offense around him was very good last year. Just smoke and mirrors from Kliff to make it through the season. I'm more of a QBR guy and believe he was right in the middle of the pack last year 15/16. Its the awful Steelers/Rams games that really hurt his case. He was playing rather well going into the bye week and seemed to fall off a cliff for a couple of weeks. It doesnt help that he didnt finish the Seahawks game as well.

 

[Solar7]

I apologize for cherrypicking, so if I miss anything in your arguments with my counterpoints, feel free to call me out.

The thing in college was able he was able to escape so many potential sacks and turn them into plays. He hasnt done that much in the NFL. Its why I wanted to really upgrade the Oline. Unless he develops the ability to manuever around a mediocre Oline I dont see a major improvement....next season.

As far as upgrading the line goes, I don't think we could have done a better job of addressing things with our limited assets this offseason. I know it was sold as a situation where we had a lot of coin to spend, but a camp competition between Gilbert/Jones/Murray makes the RT position feel like a possible strength. Center's a bit worrisome, but if Cole/Gaillard/Garcia can't take a lead, well, Shipley's a fallback option in a bizarre offseason. We can find a way to add him.

Lamar's Oline was VERY GOOD last year. We cant overlook this. We played the longterm game with Simmons. However, as good as Hopkins is I havent seem Kyler be Deshaun Watson like dynamic enough make elusive/climb the pocket throws to overcome a below average Oline...next season. I mean I hope Kyler improves, but we got a lot riding on our interior (Cole) and RT...not to mention hoping DJ actually keeps staying healthy.

Kyler's not Lamar Jackson by any means, and he's not Watson-esque either. I'm guilty of trying to make comparisons, but while I don't think he'll ever be as decisive as them when it comes to running, his accuracy and zip is on point. When Hopkins is drawing coverage and can beat it anyways, my faith in our RT moves from above really come into effect. The line is still concerning, but you can't tee off anymore with our weapons. Kyler doesn't have to play hero ball, which is going to be a recurring phrase of mine until football gets going. I'm upgrading OL as much as possible next offseason, but now my concerns about injury on the outside are mitigated with strong depth.

I actually think he did match his hype because I dont think the offense around him was very good last year. Just smoke and mirrors from Kliff to make it through the season. I'm more of a QBR guy and believe he was right in the middle of the pack last year 15/16. Its the awful Steelers/Rams games that really hurt his case. He was playing rather well going into the bye week and seemed to fall off a cliff for a couple of weeks. It doesnt help that he didnt finish the Seahawks game as well.

I'm anti-QBR, and he didn't always pass the eye test, but I've seen maturity in his interviews and work ethic that make me feel dramatically different from before, and his accuracy is on point. He trots too much for my liking, and I don't know if he'll ever be top-5, but I'm pretty excited.

 

[BritCard]

Rookie QB is hard. It's even harder on a poor team.

He had some great games, he also had some stinkers. The stinkers are going to drag the average down.

You also have to remember there no weighting involved in their grades. Take the Detroit game for example. He was bad for 3 quarters, but pulled it out in the 4th. But the 3 Qs of bad grades are going to drag his game grade right down.

 

[Johninromania]

It’s not like Murray had a tons of weapons at his disposal last season, he had a WR core that was often injured and those who played besides Kirk has problems getting separation. With the addition of Hopkins and the further development of Kirk I think he will be a top 10-15 QB Easy. If we get better then expected OL play I can see him in the top 10.