Is Carson Palmer a HOF QB?

[crisper57]

76-75, 0 playoff wins. Has some work to do.

 

[GatorAZ]

He never really played on "some of the worst teams in the league." He was the leader of a whole bunch of mediocre teams.

Aeneas was a three-time All-Pro, an eight-time Pro Bowler, and was voted to the Hall of Fame All-90s team. If Palmer had that kid of reputation, he would be in the conversation for the Hall of Fame.

How many years was Palmer even a Top 5 QB in the NFL in his 13-year career? Three times? Maybe four?

I wonder if Archie Manning would've liked to play on the teams Palmer did. Other than two years in Oakland his supporting casts haven't been "the worst" at all. Palmer will end up with really good numbers but the way the NFL is guys like Stafford, Ryan and Cutler will as well.

 

[sundevil04]

I think it's a huge stretch that Palmer gets to 340 TD's and 50,000 yards... In fact, I don't see it happening at all. He's at 251 TD's and 38,000 yards. At best, he has 2 more seasons of top performance (maybe) and then a 3rd season of mediocre performance. This season will likely be his career high-point.

I wouldn't say those numbers are a huge stretch at all, if he stays on the same pace he's on now for the remainder of this season, he'll throw another 16 TD's this season, putting him at 267. He's need another 73 TD's over the remainder of him career to hit 340. If we're assuming he plays another two seasons after this, he;d need to average 36.5 TD's per season over the next two years to get there.

Similar situation with yards, he's at 38,431 and projected to end this season at 40,271. He's just under 10k yards away, if he averages 4,800/ season over the next two years, he's there.

 

[Buckybird]

He will soon be if you know what I mean

 

[82CardsGrad]

I wouldn't say those numbers are a huge stretch at all, if he stays on the same pace he's on now for the remainder of this season, he'll throw another 16 TD's this season, putting him at 267. He's need another 73 TD's over the remainder of him career to hit 340. If we're assuming he plays another two seasons after this, he;d need to average 36.5 TD's per season over the next two years to get there.

Similar situation with yards, he's at 38,431 and projected to end this season at 40,271. He's just under 10k yards away, if he averages 4,800/ season over the next two years, he's there.

Yep...and you don't see that as a HUGE stretch?? You do know he's about to turn 36 in a month, right?
I don't see him averaging 36.5 TD's in 2016 and 2017. No way...
And I don't think he'll be anywhere close to 4,800 yard seasons next year and in 2017!
So yea - HUGE, MASSIVE, nearly IMPOSSIBLE stretch....

 

[bankybruce]

Yep...and you don't see that as a HUGE stretch?? You do know he's about to turn 36 in a month, right?
I don't see him averaging 36.5 TD's in 2016 and 2017. No way...
And I don't think he'll be anywhere close to 4,800 yard seasons next year and in 2017!
So yea - HUGE, MASSIVE, nearly IMPOSSIBLE stretch....

Could he? Yes! What are the odds? Not very high with age and his history.

 

[Buckybird]

Yep...and you don't see that as a HUGE stretch?? You do know he's about to turn 36 in a month, right?
I don't see him averaging 36.5 TD's in 2016 and 2017. No way...
And I don't think he'll be anywhere close to 4,800 yard seasons next year and in 2017!
So yea - HUGE, MASSIVE, nearly IMPOSSIBLE stretch....

In this offense it's possible.

I found it funny this past offseason that peeps thought Palmer had maybe only this year & next left. I see no reason right now why he cant play til 39 or 40 but we shall see

 

[nashman]

Sure know one thought manny was gonna play till 40 either, no reason if healthy Palmer doesn't play a few more seasons. And obviously improving the line has been a priority for the cards they know keeping him healthy can reap great benefits in the future!

 

[Dude]

In this offense it's possible.

I found it funny this past offseason that peeps thought Palmer had maybe only this year & next left. I see no reason right now why he cant play til 39 or 40 but we shall see

At some point the switch just goes to off. He might go to 40 or this could be his last year. As to the H.O.F. I don't see it yet.

 

[Buckybird]

At some point the switch just goes to off. He might go to 40 or this could be his last year. As to the H.O.F. I don't see it yet.

No reason to see it yet. 1 year at a time & let the chips fall how they do. Enjoy 2015 & go from there.

 

[Dude]

No reason to see it yet. 1 year at a time & let the chips fall how they do. Enjoy 2015 & go from there.

+1.

 

[bankybruce]

No reason to see it yet. 1 year at a time & let the chips fall how they do. Enjoy 2015 & go from there.

 

[82CardsGrad]

In this offense it's possible.

I found it funny this past offseason that peeps thought Palmer had maybe only this year & next left. I see no reason right now why he cant play til 39 or 40 but we shall see

Not saying he won't play until 39 or 40. But I don't see him putting up a season like this season again. Even next year, when he'll be approaching his 37th bday... he might have another very solid year, but I just don't see another year like this one coming from him. I could be totally wrong and honestly, I really hope I am! But aside from Tom Brady, I don't know of many others, if any other QB that had their best seasons past their 36th bday.

 

[Darkside]

I really like Carson Palmer, but he isn't HOF material and may never be. Regarding QB's especially, I typically disregard comparing stats from different eras. It's different when you're comparing a Fran Tarkenton, for example, to previous eras because they're generally playing within the same rule-set and Tarkenton was a different beast with a different game and still able to shatter the records at the time (still no SB, which is why I used him as an anecdote to Palmer being HOF). If you don't win a SB then the only way you deserve HOF is to change the way the game is viewed or talked about or appreciated. Palmer hasn't done that. He's been above average playing a traditional role and hasn't won a playoff game.

It's when we start talking about QB's like Romo breaking Troy Aikman records, when we talk about Dalton breaking Boomer Esiason records, when we talk about Ben Roethlisberger breaking Bradshaw records, that the stats start becoming useless because of the rule changes and changes to the game in general. What have Dalton and Romo won? And as far as Ben, Bradshaw won 4, get back to us.

(The only caveat to the above is that before many of the rule changes I dislike--because I'm old and cranky and get off my lawn!--owners were allowed to stack teams because of a lack of free agency and collective bargaining, so they owned those players for life, and the richer teams would stockpile talent and build dynasties)

That being said, Carson isn't a HOF player. That doesn't mean he can't win us a SB or two. We'd all be good with that, Carson included. Sometimes the # of trophies don't matter as much as how far you had to go to get just 1.

 

[nashman]

82 I know your a Brady fan, but you can't forget about manning. The numbers manning has put up the last three years in Denver are amazing so to say you can't put up big number late in your career is just wrong. Yeah manning this season hasn't but we shall see what they are end of season, but the three years prior to this one the numbers have been outstanding! One could argue that manning, Brady, Palmer are better late in their careers because of all the experience. Palmer may keep playing at this level maybe better the more him and Bruce work together, aside from injury their is no reason to believe Carson can't keep this up.

 

[Cheesebeef]

So Carson Palmer gets punished because he played for some of the worst teams in the league?

That doesn't seem right to me. It's similar to what happened to Aeneas Williams. Never got the recognition he deserved because he played for the Cardinals.

This was sent from my cell pjone so please excise any typeos or other errors.

there's no comparison to Aeneas, who was repeatedly recognized as a great player on a terrible team, making something like 8 Pro-Bowls, a couple All-Pro teams and even an All-Decade team. and why did he get that recognition, even on a terrible team? Because he was CONSISTENTLY GREAT. Palmer hasn't been.

 

[82CardsGrad]

82 I know your a Brady fan, but you can't forget about manning. The numbers manning has put up the last three years in Denver are amazing so to say you can't put up big number late in your career is just wrong. Yeah manning this season hasn't but we shall see what they are end of season, but the three years prior to this one the numbers have been outstanding! One could argue that manning, Brady, Palmer are better late in their careers because of all the experience. Palmer may keep playing at this level maybe better the more him and Bruce work together, aside from injury their is no reason to believe Carson can't keep this up.

OK... so there are 2 guys in the history of the game that played at very high levels past the age of 36...
Again, I am as big a Palmer fan as you will ever find. But, I honestly can't place him on the level of a Manning or Brady. He's never done anything at any point in his career to suggest that he's at their level, or even close. To think that at the age of 36,37,38 he will suddenly perform at levels light-years ahead of what he's done the previous 12 years of his career is asking for a miracle.
Again, I so hope I'm wrong. But then again, I'd be happy if he simply produces W's, particularly in the post season, while putting up solid numbers of 25-27 TD's and single-digit INT's!

 

[Buckybird]

OK... so there are 2 guys in the history of the game that played at very high levels past the age of 36...
Again, I am as big a Palmer fan as you will ever find. But, I honestly can't place him on the level of a Manning or Brady. He's never done anything at any point in his career to suggest that he's at their level, or even close. To think that at the age of 36,37,38 he will suddenly perform at levels light-years ahead of what he's done the previous 12 years of his career is asking for a miracle.
Again, I so hope I'm wrong. But then again, I'd be happy if he simply produces W's, particularly in the post season, while putting up solid numbers of 25-27 TD's and single-digit INT's!

Favre & Moon had some pretty good seasons around 40 as well

 

[Hollywood]

OK... so there are 2 guys in the history of the game that played at very high levels past the age of 36...
Again, I am as big a Palmer fan as you will ever find. But, I honestly can't place him on the level of a Manning or Brady. He's never done anything at any point in his career to suggest that he's at their level, or even close. To think that at the age of 36,37,38 he will suddenly perform at levels light-years ahead of what he's done the previous 12 years of his career is asking for a miracle.
Again, I so hope I'm wrong. But then again, I'd be happy if he simply produces W's, particularly in the post season, while putting up solid numbers of 25-27 TD's and single-digit INT's!

Warren Moon played until his mid forties...and played well untill his early forties.

Kurt Warner played until 38 when he walked away while playing at a high level.

This was sent from my cell pjone so please excise any typeos or other errors.

 

[82CardsGrad]

Favre & Moon had some pretty good seasons around 40 as well

Warren Moon played until his mid forties...and played well untill his early forties.

Kurt Warner played until 38 when he walked away while playing at a high level.

This was sent from my cell pjone so please excise any typeos or other errors.

I don't think you guys are reading carefully enough... I didn't say Palmer won't play past this season (36 years old)! I'm questioning the fact that he'll be able to average a level of production over the remaining years of his career needed to hit 340 TD's and 50,000 yards.
If he does finish this season where his current pace suggests, and if he played another 3 seasons, taking him to the age of 39, he would need to average over those remaining 3 years 24-25 TD's and roughly 3,500 yards per season.
I don't think it's crazy to suggest that this season will be his career high water mark. Next year, as he turns 37 I can see him putting up another very good year, but not a MVP worthy season. At best, 25-28 TD's and 3,800 or so yards. And then, in 2018 as he turns 38, I think the decline in production will be much more noticeable. Don't forget that Fitz will also be aging as well and by 2018, Larry will be showing very visible signs of slowing down...
As I've said, I would love to see Palmer play extremely well until he hangs up his cleats 4-5 years from now. And honestly, rather than focus on his career numbers, I'd prefer to see him win a Super Bowl, or two!

 

[Hollywood]

I don't think you guys are reading carefully enough... I didn't say Palmer won't play past this season (36 years old)! I'm questioning the fact that he'll be able to average a level of production over the remaining years of his career needed to hit 340 TD's and 50,000 yards.
If he does finish this season where his current pace suggests, and if he played another 3 seasons, taking him to the age of 39, he would need to average over those remaining 3 years 24-25 TD's and roughly 3,500 yards per season.
I don't think it's crazy to suggest that this season will be his career high water mark. Next year, as he turns 37 I can see him putting up another very good year, but not a MVP worthy season. At best, 25-28 TD's and 3,800 or so yards. And then, in 2018 as he turns 38, I think the decline in production will be much more noticeable. Don't forget that Fitz will also be aging as well and by 2018, Larry will be showing very visible signs of slowing down...
As I've said, I would love to see Palmer play extremely well until he hangs up his cleats 4-5 years from now. And honestly, rather than focus on his career numbers, I'd prefer to see him win a Super Bowl, or two!

Yeah, I get what you are saying and I am saying that these guys kept producing at a high level until there late 30's and early 40's. I dont see why Palmer cant on this team and in this system.

This was sent from my cell pjone so please excise any typeos or other errors.

 

[Buckybird]

I don't think you guys are reading carefully enough... I didn't say Palmer won't play past this season (36 years old)! I'm questioning the fact that he'll be able to average a level of production over the remaining years of his career needed to hit 340 TD's and 50,000 yards.
If he does finish this season where his current pace suggests, and if he played another 3 seasons, taking him to the age of 39, he would need to average over those remaining 3 years 24-25 TD's and roughly 3,500 yards per season.
I don't think it's crazy to suggest that this season will be his career high water mark. Next year, as he turns 37 I can see him putting up another very good year, but not a MVP worthy season. At best, 25-28 TD's and 3,800 or so yards. And then, in 2018 as he turns 38, I think the decline in production will be much more noticeable. Don't forget that Fitz will also be aging as well and by 2018, Larry will be showing very visible signs of slowing down...
As I've said, I would love to see Palmer play extremely well until he hangs up his cleats 4-5 years from now. And honestly, rather than focus on his career numbers, I'd prefer to see him win a Super Bowl, or two!

The thing is you don't know, I don't know & others don't know. It's possible & has been done.

 

[GatorAZ]

As long as an aging QB is not significantly deteriorating physically (unlike Manning) and still surrounded by elite weapons (unlike Brees) then quarterbacks can be plenty successful into their late 30's. Palmer has been dealing with tons of injuries from his time in Oakland mostly upper body though. He missed two games last year before tearing his ACL. I'm just not sure what to expect from him physically but the talent around him and coaching will still be here for him.

 

[82CardsGrad]

Yeah, I get what you are saying and I am saying that these guys kept producing at a high level until there late 30's and early 40's. I dont see why Palmer cant on this team and in this system.

This was sent from my cell pjone so please excise any typeos or other errors.

Well, as I said, I can see Palmer having very productive but not as good as this season years in 2016, 2017 and maybe 2018 (when he hits 38).

Aside from Brady (who is 38) and Manning (who is 39 and breaking down hard), Moon averaged 19 TD's and 2,700 yards from the age of 38 thru his last year.
Warner retired at 38...
Farvre averaged 23 TD's and 3,500 yards from the age of 38 on... But Farvre was much more mobile then Palmer...

We'll see how it all shakes out... My guess is that this season is his high water mark. In 2017 and 2018 he plays well but his TD's and Yards (along with all other passer stats) fall far short of this season. That doesn't mean he'll suck! Far from it. As long as he keeps his INT numbers down, I think he'll play well enough to keep the Cards relevant and a consistent post season threat.
But all bets are off after 2018.

 

[Jim Otis]

A lot being made of Palmer's age . John Elway played in { 5 } super bowls over his career , he lost { 3 } , the { 2 } that he won was at age 37 and age 38 . If MB --- SK --- BA keep putting the right kind of talent around Palmer , I believe that he could play at a high level for another three seasons .