Target JACKSON

[pokerface]

What I like about Warren is just how efficient he is. He doesn't take bad shots. He know what his game is, and he sticks to it.
He is such a smart player and such a natural scorer! I am a huge Warren fan.

That's why I don't want Tatum because we're kinda getting that with Warren.


I like Jackson partly because he's different than those two guys.

 

[SirStefan32]

That's why I don't want Tatum because we're kinda getting that with Warren.


I like Jackson partly because he's different than those two guys.

There are two schools of thought with that. I'd probably prefer Jackson too, BUT there is an argument to be made for Tatum. Redundancy when it comes to scorers is not a bad thing. Split their minutes and you have a scorer on the floor for 48 minutes at that spot. Additionally, it allows you to trade one of them without losing that "natural scorer".

I'll be OK with either, but the Suns are so bad defensively that I'd like to see what Jackson can do. I've read some valid concerns about how his defense will translate into the NBA, but I still think he is the best defensive prospect out there.

 

[pokerface]

There are two schools of thought with that. I'd probably prefer Jackson too, BUT there is an argument to be made for Tatum. Redundancy when it comes to scorers is not a bad thing. Split their minutes and you have a scorer on the floor for 48 minutes at that spot. Additionally, it allows you to trade one of them without losing that "natural scorer".

I'll be OK with either, but the Suns are so bad defensively that I'd like to see what Jackson can do. I've read some valid concerns about how his defense will translate into the NBA, but I still think he is the best defensive prospect out there.

Yeah I agree. It's nice to have an abundance of shooters and Tatum would definitely fit that. But also like you said we need defense so Jackson 'may' help there.

I think the emergence of Booker and his scoring ability allows us to gamble on Jacksons 'intangibles'.

 

[sunsfan88]

Yeah I agree. It's nice to have an abundance of shooters and Tatum would definitely fit that. But also like you said we need defense so Jackson 'may' help there.

I think the emergence of Booker and his scoring ability allows us to gamble on Jacksons 'intangibles'.

He didn't say shooters, he said scorers. And Tatum doesn't fit shooting in anyway shape or form. His 3pt shot isn't any better than Jackson's or even Fox imo.

 

[Sun Devil Mania]

Nah, you're either confusing me with someone else or there's been a misunderstanding about my position. I was outspoken against making that trade until I started hearing the apparent consensus around here that he was the next great two way player. I acknowledged that if, following our workouts, we decided he truly was a star in the making, that it would be worth giving up an extra pick if necessary.

If he's that player that many suggest he will be, a lock down defender that also has significant value offensively then, yes, he's perfect for us (rage issues notwithstanding). And giving up an extra pick to grab the next Kawhi or even the next Butler makes a lot of sense. But the more I watch of him the less enamored I am about his defense and his game overall.

I think his ceiling falls somewhere between solid bench player and average starter. IMO, if we do draft him at four, 3 years from now everyone will regret the pick and complain about how we drove away a much more complete player (Warren).

And welcome to the forum.

Thanks, but actually I have been on the forum for a number of years as asuhoopsnut. I don't use or have access to my old email account that (asuhoopsnut) is linked to and I can't access the account because I forgot the password. So I started this new account. Is there any way to revive the old account and have it linked to the email address I now use?

 

[AzStevenCal]

Thanks, but actually I have been on the forum for a number of years as asuhoopsnut. I don't use or have access to my old email account that (asuhoopsnut) is linked to and I can't access the account because I forgot the password. So I started this new account. Is there any way to revive the old account and have it linked to the email address I now use?

Well, then, welcome back to the forum. I have no answer to your question but I'd suggest posting it in the Announcements and Support forum.

 

[AzStevenCal]

He didn't say shooters, he said scorers. And Tatum doesn't fit shooting in anyway shape or form. His 3pt shot isn't any better than Jackson's or even Fox imo.

Just looking at the numbers that appears to be a real stretch, what's your reasoning? Jayson wasn't great but he took almost twice as many as Fox, making almost 35% of them whereas Fox put them down at just under a 25% rate.

 

[Mainstreet]

I love his character and charisma but I think when it comes to actual skills Dennis Smith is better than him at everything besides effort on defense.

I had a chance to watch Fox play in the NCAA Tournament which really caught my eye. Unfortunately I did not get a chance to see Smith play live. Perhaps if I had seen him play in some games I would feel differently. My concern with Smith has already been mentioned, the ACL injury. If the Suns trade down in the draft, who knows. I still think Fox is going to be a special player and he should be in the top four picks. IMO, if he slides to 5th in the draft, the Kings are going to have a steal.

 

[GatorAZ]

There's a few scouting vids out there that show Jackson shot 0% on well contested 3's. Not one make... Crazy.

 

[Mainstreet]

There's a few scouting vids out there that show Jackson shot 0% on well contested 3's. Not one make... Crazy.

I'm stating to question some players I liked earlier and Jackson is one of them. Now I'm thinking I like Tatum more than Jackson if that is the choice. Also he is a year younger and more consistent.

 

[Chaplin]

If people are now saying they could draft Lauri Markannen at the #4 with the hopes he gets better, why can't that reasoning apply to EVERY player we draft at #4? None of them have hit their skill wall, so that reasoning is basically invalid.

 

[mojorizen7]

Jackson is still my #2 guy on the big board behind Fultz...for what best fits the Suns. I believe Jackson will make an impact on both ends of the floor. Same with Fox and Ball. I'd rather not chase a player picking at #4 who has little to no versatility to his game.

As amateur scouts on a message board like us you have to trust in what you see on the film and not necessarily let all these so called blog experts blind you with their analysis paralysis.

 

[pokerface]

If we don't get Jackson I'd still want Fox and probably be happy with him.


Maybe we could trade Bled and re-crack the top ten...

 

[Mainstreet]

Jackson is still my #2 guy on the big board behind Fultz...for what best fits the Suns. I believe Jackson will make an impact on both ends of the floor. Same with Fox and Ball. I'd rather not chase a player picking at #4 who has little to no versatility to his game.

As amateur scouts on a message board like us you have to trust in what you see on the film and not necessarily let all these so called blog experts blind you with their analysis paralysis.

The reading is driving me crazy. Thanks, I needed an out.

 

[Mainstreet]

I think this is what Mojorizen7 is talking about.

This is what made me critical of Jackson of late.

Jackson's physical profile is a mixed bag. He has very good size for the wing at 6'8, and is a quick-twitch and highly explosive athlete who plays above the rim with ease and covers ground seamlessly defensively. With that said, his small hands, 6'10 wingspan and narrow 207 pound frame may limit his effectiveness playing the small-ball power forward role he was so successful filling in college, and the fact that he's an older freshman at 20 years old makes you wonder how much more strength his frame will carry down the line.

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Josh-Jackson-7239/

 

[pokerface]

I think this is what Mojorizen7 is talking about.

This is what made me critical of Jackson of late.


http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Josh-Jackson-7239/

The only thing that's telling me is draft him if he's available but not sweeten any deal to move up. He's probably still an upgrade over Warren plus he'd give us a different dynamic than Warren.

Fox's frame and build isn't the greatest either ... Everything we can say about Jackson we can say about Fox.

 

[overseascardfan]

I would be all in for Smith but the biggest knock on him is that he is very selfish and undisciplined which could lead to chemistry issues. Jackson lacks a jump shot (his second half shooting percentages could be fools gold). Tatum's offense is ahead of his defense and Issac needs to hit the gym. I'm wondering if we could deal for Fultz by including Bledsoe in a package?

 

[Mainstreet]

Fox's frame and build isn't the greatest either ... Everything we can say about Jackson we can say about Fox.

You are talking about one of my favorite prospects in Fox. This is heresy I tell you. LMAO

 

[Mainstreet]

I would be all in for Smith but the biggest knock on him is that he is very selfish and undisciplined which could lead to chemistry issues. Jackson lacks a jump shot (his second half shooting percentages could be fools gold). Tatum's offense is ahead of his defense and Issac needs to hit the gym. I'm wondering if we could deal for Fultz by including Bledsoe in a package?

IT would like this in Boston land.

 

[pokerface]

You are talking about one of my favorite prospects in Fox. This is heresy I tell you. LMAO

I knew that would get to ya!


Hey they both are good...or bad... whatever.

 

[Mainstreet]

I knew that would get to ya!


Hey they both are good...or bad... whatever.

Whatever?

This is why the Suns tanked and we watched meaningless games together. Can't miss on #4.

 

[GatorAZ]

I would be all in for Smith but the biggest knock on him is that he is very selfish and undisciplined which could lead to chemistry issues. Jackson lacks a jump shot (his second half shooting percentages could be fools gold). Tatum's offense is ahead of his defense and Issac needs to hit the gym. I'm wondering if we could deal for Fultz by including Bledsoe in a package?

Personality wise? B/c he's a better passer than Fox...

 

[Errntknght]

If players don't get better after they're drafted, they don't usually amount to much... they're the Archie Goodwins of the basketball world, they drift down to a level of game where they can succeed. Hornacek tried to do Goodwin a favor by making him an offensive pariah - no one threw him the ball, he had to grab a rebound if he wanted to handle it. So it was defend, defend, defend. He defended okay but he didn't get the underlying message and embrace the role. Horny did him a disservice in another way, he did not demand that Archie bust his butt learning to shoot mid-range and in shots that weren't at the rim - at least one of pull up jumper, runner, floater, jump hook or whatever, so he didn't have to go crashing toward the rim when it was defended. Send him down to the D-league with instructions to the coach that he had to shoot one of those shots on half his drives or he sat. Of course, Archie could have ignored that message, too. Archie was supposedly a gym rat but practice does little good without a coach or an internal voice that makes you practice what you need to learn, not what's fun.

Since I'm old, it's my duty to pass on what I've learned. There is a level below that - when you don't even have the muscle strength and flexibility to do basic things right. An exercise guru told me last week that if you don't keep an exercise/stretching journal, you'll get nowhere. Years of experience confirms that. I bought the spiral notebook today and tomorrow I start logging... or maybe I'll wait until June 1st to start with a fresh month...

 

[pokerface]

Whatever?

This is why the Suns tanked and we watched meaningless games together. Can't miss on #4.

Actually I do mean "whatever" because...

1) We don't know if Jackson will be available.

2) Fox and Jackson have eerily similar strengths and weaknesses. Both athletic..both good defenders ..both need some work on their shooting. Both with real good upside potential IMO.

3) This draft has so many solid prospects and there is so many directions we could go it's hard to get a lock on anything. The suns could trade up...trade down...or package this pick with players for established talent. We really have no idea what will happen on draft day or this offseason in general.

 

[Mainstreet]

Actually I do mean "whatever" because...

1) We don't know if Jackson will be available.

2) Fox and Jackson have eerily similar strengths and weaknesses. Both athletic..both good defenders ..both need some work on their shooting. Both with real good upside potential IMO.

3) This draft has so many solid prospects and there is so many directions we could go it's hard to get a lock on anything. The suns could trade up...trade down...or package this pick with players for established talent. We really have no idea what will happen on draft day or this offseason in general.

But what are we going to talk about?

However, what Fox has going for him is his ability to play PG leaving defense out of the equation. IMO, this gives him an edge over Jackson.

I agree the Suns could go in a lot of different directions.